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Have we already become a fascist state?

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independentusa

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It seems under Trump and his supporters we are going to align ourselves with fascist states around the world starting with Russia. Although Russia may have even gone farther as they seem to be a dictatorship, Trump seems to be heading us in that direction. When I think of all that the GOP under Trump has done to suppress voting rights, especially of those of color and aligning themselves with white supremacy groups, not only across this country but across the world, I think it is only time until we get to where they are heading us. Some are saying that Trump is only realigning us, he is doing so with the most dictatorial countries in the world. Along with his moves to turn us toward the most fascist countries in the world, he is trying to end the free press. His "fake news" crap rings true only to his ardent supporters. Only until the only media left is propaganda machines for Trump, the GOP and his supporters will they be happy. His supporters remind me of those in Germany who wanted a strong leader and were willing to give up their freedoms to get one. They see Trump's TV persona as the man they want. Too bad the real Trump is not strong, but foolish and very weak. In the face of real pressure by the real strong men of the world he just collapses and becomes their lapdog. Look at how he crumbled when confronted by the leaders of China, North Korea and the latest, Putin. But what Trump is able to do is to head this country toward fascism.
 
Not yet. Twelve more credit hours from Trump University and I'll have my BS in Fascism.
 
azgreg said:
Not yet. Twelve more credit hours from Trump University and I'll have my BS in Fascism.
Click to expand...
If it's BS you want, just read the OP?
 
independentusa said:
It seems under Trump and his supporters we are going to align ourselves with fascist states around the world starting with Russia. Although Russia may have even gone farther as they seem to be a dictatorship, Trump seems to be heading us in that direction. When I think of all that the GOP under Trump has done to suppress voting rights, especially of those of color and aligning themselves with white supremacy groups, not only across this country but across the world, I think it is only time until we get to where they are heading us. Some are saying that Trump is only realigning us, he is doing so with the most dictatorial countries in the world. Along with his moves to turn us toward the most fascist countries in the world, he is trying to end the free press. His "fake news" crap rings true only to his ardent supporters. Only until the only media left is propaganda machines for Trump, the GOP and his supporters will they be happy. His supporters remind me of those in Germany who wanted a strong leader and were willing to give up their freedoms to get one. They see Trump's TV persona as the man they want. Too bad the real Trump is not strong, but foolish and very weak. In the face of real pressure by the real strong men of the world he just collapses and becomes their lapdog. Look at how he crumbled when confronted by the leaders of China, North Korea and the latest, Putin. But what Trump is able to do is to head this country toward fascism.
Click to expand...

Given that the Trump administration is backtracking fascist kinds of executive orders, removing onerous regulations that encroached on civil liberties, and has been steadily moving to restore more authority to the states and assistance to the private sector, I would say that we are now moving away from fascism instead of toward it as we were before.
 
Given the the UK is commonly held to be a hotbed of socialism, when it's actually more free than the USA, then there could be something in it.

The UK is #8 on the economic freedom index, the US is #18.

The US is #17 in terms of human freedom, whereas the UK is #9.

The US might have been born in rebellion, but the old rapacious capitalist UK hasn't been standing still
 
AlbqOwl said:
Given that the Trump administration is backtracking fascist kinds of executive orders, removing onerous regulations that encroached on civil liberties, and has been steadily moving to restore more authority to the states and assistance to the private sector, I would say that we are now moving away from fascism instead of toward it as we were before.
Click to expand...

You're talking about the old definition of Fascism. The new definition has been updated to include a better sense of the modern American sentiment. As such, the new definition of Fascism is, "support of or failure to vehemently decry anything Donald Trump does, says, might do, could do, would do if he were allowed to, probably did but we don't know about it because the right wing media cabal keeps that information from us AND anything Trump did, might have done, possibly contemplated, would have contemplated if he was smart enough to contemplate or anything we have reason to believe he did or will do."
 
independentusa said:
It seems under Trump and his supporters we are going to align ourselves with fascist states around the world starting with Russia. Although Russia may have even gone farther as they seem to be a dictatorship, Trump seems to be heading us in that direction. When I think of all that the GOP under Trump has done to suppress voting rights, especially of those of color and aligning themselves with white supremacy groups, not only across this country but across the world, I think it is only time until we get to where they are heading us. Some are saying that Trump is only realigning us, he is doing so with the most dictatorial countries in the world. Along with his moves to turn us toward the most fascist countries in the world, he is trying to end the free press. His "fake news" crap rings true only to his ardent supporters. Only until the only media left is propaganda machines for Trump, the GOP and his supporters will they be happy. His supporters remind me of those in Germany who wanted a strong leader and were willing to give up their freedoms to get one. They see Trump's TV persona as the man they want. Too bad the real Trump is not strong, but foolish and very weak. In the face of real pressure by the real strong men of the world he just collapses and becomes their lapdog. Look at how he crumbled when confronted by the leaders of China, North Korea and the latest, Putin. But what Trump is able to do is to head this country toward fascism.
Click to expand...

There are some fundamental parts of the USA that has Fascist aspects, like the abundance of government programs/organizations/and grants, but that was waaaaay before Trump... but I think it's more safe to say the USA is mixed, and the USA has tons of checks and balances put into it's system.... and a constitution.

You seem to not like fascism... Democrats are essentially the fascist party of the USA. They will find way more in common with fascists than conservatives/libertarians.... Fascism is the opposite of economic freedom, which contradicts American Conservative and libertarian ideology.

People seem to forget fascism is essentially socialism... but to a lesser degree. Fascism is the Government picking and choosing certain utilities and businesses it's wants to control. Typically progressive income taxation, where the poor do not pay any taxes. Has very malleable laws, with little checks and balances to the controlling party. People also seem to think Fascism=racism... they seem to go hand and hand... but no, you can be a fascist and a racist, you can also be a fascist and not a racist.... it is not a core of the Fascist political system.

Modern day China is a very good example of a fascist country.

Perhaps when you say Fascism, you mean Nationalism, or just "Things I don't like"?
 
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The answer to the OP, done properly, would be involved.

Don't feel like typing it.

For over a century, the Left has been suppressed.

If you go down the list, of the 14 traits of fascism, we usually have a few of them simmering at some level. But nailing down how much, where and when, can't be covered in a forum. Not adequately.

There's reasons why Trump could get as close as he has to becoming a dictator.

So far, our institutions have been able to keep some semblance of rule of law. But you know Trump is going to go for it.

So we will see.
 
Lutherf said:
You're talking about the old definition of Fascism. The new definition has been updated to include a better sense of the modern American sentiment. As such, the new definition of Fascism is, "support of or failure to vehemently decry anything Donald Trump does, says, might do, could do, would do if he were allowed to, probably did but we don't know about it because the right wing media cabal keeps that information from us AND anything Trump did, might have done, possibly contemplated, would have contemplated if he was smart enough to contemplate or anything we have reason to believe he did or will do."
Click to expand...

LOL. Well there is that too. :)

Yes, the left has redefined a LOT of terms due to President Trump's election.

So those of us who share the President's vision for America are consigned to be racist, fascist, Nazis, sexist, homophobic, Islamophobic, protectionist, uneducated, low information, clinging to our religion and our guns, selfish, greedy, deplorable smelly shoppers at Walmart. Further we are incapable of thinking for ourselves and take our marching orders from (name the rightwing personality of choice.) And if we are white women, we vote as our husbands, boyfriends, or sons tell us to vote. And whatever sin is named a sin by the Left, we are guilty of. And President Trump is the leader of all that.

And since that is their ONLY message and they are promoting absolutely nothing that will make America stronger, more prosperous, more free, and more of the place everybody wants to live, they wonder why they are losing elections.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Given the the UK is commonly held to be a hotbed of socialism, when it's actually more free than the USA, then there could be something in it.

The UK is #8 on the economic freedom index, the US is #18.

The US is #17 in terms of human freedom, whereas the UK is #9.

The US might have been born in rebellion, but the old rapacious capitalist UK hasn't been standing still
Click to expand...

Hmm...

From the Heritage Economic Freedom index which, I presume, is where you pulled those numbers - https://www.heritage.org/index/country/unitedstates
While the U.S.’s economic freedom ranking has dropped due to comparatively better improvements in other countries, the increase in its overall score would seem to indicate that the decade-long decline in America’s economic freedom may have been arrested. There are signs of renewed labor market dynamism and increased growth, and major regulatory and tax reforms are spurring business confidence and investment. The continuing decline in the score for government integrity reflects a growing perception of cronyism, elite privilege, and corruption.
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We suffered a "decade-long decline"? Which administration was in charge during that decade?

Also, there is a continuing decline in government integrity. That would be the government that establishment Republicans and Democrats want to keep in place.
 
late said:
For over a century, the Left has been suppressed.
Click to expand...

wpid-data-laughs-o.gif
 
independentusa said:
It seems under Trump and his supporters we are going to align ourselves with fascist states around the world starting with Russia. Although Russia may have even gone farther as they seem to be a dictatorship, Trump seems to be heading us in that direction. When I think of all that the GOP under Trump has done to suppress voting rights, especially of those of color and aligning themselves with white supremacy groups, not only across this country but across the world, I think it is only time until we get to where they are heading us. Some are saying that Trump is only realigning us, he is doing so with the most dictatorial countries in the world. Along with his moves to turn us toward the most fascist countries in the world, he is trying to end the free press. His "fake news" crap rings true only to his ardent supporters. Only until the only media left is propaganda machines for Trump, the GOP and his supporters will they be happy. His supporters remind me of those in Germany who wanted a strong leader and were willing to give up their freedoms to get one. They see Trump's TV persona as the man they want. Too bad the real Trump is not strong, but foolish and very weak. In the face of real pressure by the real strong men of the world he just collapses and becomes their lapdog. Look at how he crumbled when confronted by the leaders of China, North Korea and the latest, Putin. But what Trump is able to do is to head this country toward fascism.
Click to expand...

Well, let's see.

#1: Check.
#2: Check.
#3: Check.
#4: Check.
#5: Check.
#6: No. The mass media is one of Traitor Trump's biggest targets of criticism, but it still hasn't fallen.
#7: Check.
#8: Check.
#9: Check.
#10: Check.
#11: Check.
#12: Check.
#13: Check.
#14: Not quite that bad but we're getting there.

So, 12-for-14. Is that close enough? I do not know, but it's certainly worth considering. Keep in mind that the affirmative answers above do not not entirely depend on what Traitor Trump has done, but he certainly has worsened the situation.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Given the the UK is commonly held to be a hotbed of socialism, when it's actually more free than the USA, then there could be something in it.

The UK is #8 on the economic freedom index, the US is #18.

The US is #17 in terms of human freedom, whereas the UK is #9.

The US might have been born in rebellion, but the old rapacious capitalist UK hasn't been standing still
Click to expand...

Considering what I've seen my country do since the turn of the millennium, I have had second thoughts about whether we should have broken off from you guys the way we did. Canada took a much calmer route and they're doing just fine.
 
independentusa said:
It seems under Trump and his supporters we are going to align ourselves with fascist states around the world starting with Russia.
Click to expand...

How stupid. The President wants to establish a good relationship with Russian leadership to prevent a nuclear ameggedon, and that's "aligning with a fascist state"?

When I think of all that the GOP under Trump has done to suppress voting rights, especially of those of color
Click to expand...

What has he done? Are you making stuff up?

and aligning themselves with white supremacy groups
Click to expand...

:roll:
 
No, Not yet to the thread title question. But getting closer daily.
 
Harshaw said:
Q give Data the gift of laughter.
Click to expand...

Star Chamber(First Red Scare) the extermination of the IWW (Wobblies), McCarthy era (Second Red Scare), Nixon's war on the Left, the rise of Right wing propaganda, and manipulation, in the 80s, and the dramatic shift to the Right that caused.
 
late said:
Star Chamber(First Red Scare) the extermination of the IWW (Wobblies), McCarthy era (Second Red Scare), Nixon's war on the Left, the rise of Right wing propaganda, and manipulation, in the 80s, and the dramatic shift to the Right that caused.
Click to expand...

And yet the Left gets everything they want. Except for on guns.
 
Looks like we can add "fascist" to "racist" and "Nazi" to the list of words that no longer mean anything.
 
Harshaw said:
What do they NOT get?
Click to expand...

This is nuts.

Good schools, decent infrastructure, measures to deal with climate change, starting with an incremental Carbon Tax, a return to fighting racism, single payer health care, progressive taxation,clean elections, end gerrymandering, and there's lots more where that came from... The lesser issues, reforming the Ag Dept, updating science bureaucracy and funding, getting NASA back on track, I refuse to type them all.

It's the thousands of ways Republicans have f***ed the country. (Mostly Republicans...)
 
late said:
This is nuts.

Good schools, decent infrastructure, measures to deal with climate change, starting with an incremental Carbon Tax, a return to fighting racism, single payer health care, progressive taxation,clean elections, end gerrymandering, and there's lots more where that came from... The lesser issues, reforming the Ag Dept, updating science bureaucracy and funding, getting NASA back on track, I refuse to type them all.

It's the thousands of ways Republicans have f***ed the country. (Mostly Republicans...)
Click to expand...

Most of that stuff isn't actually "Left," but that which is, with the exception of single-payer health care -- and that's coming -- you have it all.

The Left is not "suppressed" in this country.
 
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