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Trump is the beginning of the end of the Republican party

SonOfDaedalus

SonOfDaedalus

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Trump is not part of some emerging group of voters. He's the result of an accident where Democrats ran a very unpopular candidate forcing voters to choose the lesser of two evils.

Trump is president whereas Mitt Romney lost in 2012. But Trump actually received a slightly smaller share of the vote than Romney did — a bit below 46 percent for Trump versus a bit above 47 percent for Romney.
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https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/18/16305486/what-really-happened-in-2016

Trump is actually destroying the Republican party. Even after Trump is gone, the base will want another Trump--another vile loudmouth extremist. Just as Trump got a smaller share than Romney, the next Republican will get an even smaller share. Slowly, the Republican party will become a marginalized party.

The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
 
SonOfDaedalus said:
Trump is not part of some emerging group of voters. He's the result of an accident where Democrats ran a very unpopular candidate forcing voters to choose the lesser of two evils.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/18/16305486/what-really-happened-in-2016

Trump is actually destroying the Republican party. Even after Trump is gone, the base will want another Trump--another vile loudmouth extremist. Just as Trump got a smaller share than Romney, the next Republican will get an even smaller share. Slowly, the Republican party will become a marginalized party.

The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
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I always in enjoy a good fantasy story.
 
You can say the same of democrats. Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll both go away.



SonOfDaedalus said:
Trump is not part of some emerging group of voters. He's the result of an accident where Democrats ran a very unpopular candidate forcing voters to choose the lesser of two evils.



https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/18/16305486/what-really-happened-in-2016

Trump is actually destroying the Republican party. Even after Trump is gone, the base will want another Trump--another vile loudmouth extremist. Just as Trump got a smaller share than Romney, the next Republican will get an even smaller share. Slowly, the Republican party will become a marginalized party.

The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
Click to expand...
 
SonOfDaedalus said:
The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
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The Republican party is not going to die. Predictions of its demise have been made for years and years and years. It is not going to happen, they have way too much money. The party will, if necessary, reform, just like it has under Trump. Trump has pushed the party towards being a party of hate and those at the top do not seem to know how to fight back within the party, without alienating their voters. Either the party will tilt too much towards hate and lose power, forcing reform once more, or the party will split. Either way, the Republican party is not going to die.
TobyOne said:
You can say the same of democrats. Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll both go away.
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The best solution would be for the moderate wings of both parties to split away and join together. Three parties of power would be a great thing for this country.
 
Slyfox696 said:
The Republican party is not going to die. Predictions of its demise have been made for years and years and years. It is not going to happen, they have way too much money. The party will, if necessary, reform, just like it has under Trump. Trump has pushed the party towards being a party of hate and those at the top do not seem to know how to fight back within the party, without alienating their voters. Either the party will tilt too much towards hate and lose power, forcing reform once more, or the party will split. Either way, the Republican party is not going to die.

The best solution would be for the moderate wings of both parties to split away and join together. Three parties of power would be a great thing for this country.
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I said the party will become a marginalized party like the other hate parties in Europe.

But you're right, at that point, it would split off. But without all the bigots I can't imagine Republicanism which is really corporatism will find any support.

I do worry about a liberal split between moderates and socialists.

I think you're right that ultimately, the Mitt Romney's and Bush's of the world will have to become moderate Democrats.
 
Seems like wishful dreaming? The republican party is not going anywhere.
They have the money and are a part of the political process.. like it or not.
 
SonOfDaedalus said:
The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
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Well, that's just assuming that the American people have that level of class. I am starting to doubt it now. I never would have imagined there were this many vulgar and ignorant people in this country. But all you have to do is look at the size of these Trump rallies to realize this is a very real movement in America. And it's not going to go away anytime soon. One very real and sobering possibility is this is what America has become. This may be our new cultural values and what America means: rude, loud, vulgar, low-class, heartless, ignorant.

MAGA!
 
SonOfDaedalus said:
Trump is not part of some emerging group of voters. He's the result of an accident where Democrats ran a very unpopular candidate forcing voters to choose the lesser of two evils.



https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/18/16305486/what-really-happened-in-2016

Trump is actually destroying the Republican party. Even after Trump is gone, the base will want another Trump--another vile loudmouth extremist. Just as Trump got a smaller share than Romney, the next Republican will get an even smaller share. Slowly, the Republican party will become a marginalized party.

The Republican party we once knew is already dead. It's been reshaped into a hateful party by Trump. Once Trump is gone in a few years, the party will slowly die because it has been pushed to the extreme fringes.
Click to expand...

The only thing I see dying in the Republican Party are those aligned with the GOP Elite Establishment...even though that's happening far too slowly.

The same thing SHOULD be happening in the Democratic Party, but their Elites have been more successful in their underhanded tactics to hold their rank and file in line.

Our country, as a whole, would be well served if ALL of the Elites...both Parties...went away.
 
ataraxia said:
Well, that's just assuming that the American people have that level of class. I am starting to doubt it now. I never would have imagined there were this many vulgar and ignorant people in this country. But all you have to do is look at the size of these Trump rallies to realize this is a very real movement in America. And it's not going to go away anytime soon. One very real and sobering possibility is this is what America has become. This may be our new cultural values and what America means: rude, loud, vulgar, low-class, heartless, ignorant.

MAGA!
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By golly, I agree with you! You tell those nasty Republicans like Peter Fonda and Robert De Niro and Stephanie Wilkinson that we just won't tolerate their rude, vulgar, classless behavior! Roar your disapproval of nasty Republicans harassing a Cabinet member in a Mexican restaurant and preventing progressive speakers at universities from having their say!
 
nota bene said:
By golly, I agree with you! You tell those nasty Republicans like Peter Fonda and Robert De Niro and Stephanie Wilkinson that we just won't tolerate their rude, vulgar, classless behavior! Roar your disapproval of nasty Republicans harassing a Cabinet member in a Mexican restaurant and preventing progressive speakers at universities from having their say!
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Trump started it. What, you want to elect someone who says they will cover the legal fees for anyone who punches his protestors, and then expect classy behavior back? Don't dish it out if you can't take it.
 
Mycroft said:
Our country, as a whole, would be well served if ALL of the Elites...both Parties...went away.
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What sense does this make though? Why are there elites...because they are at the top of their game? The best at their political endeavors, and you want to punish the best? How very capitalistic of you.

Worse, what do you think happens when you remove the leaders, and don't change the system Mycroft? Really crank up the voltage on that tinfoil hat and THINK. Really strain.
-> People below them, move up into leadership, and become the next generation of elites. Your position is a foolish one at best.

But just think, you're so opposed to elites, but you put the worst of the worst, the most elitist asshole in the world, into the highest office!?! This guy:
2FD9465400000578-3387426-All_for_show_Though_Trump_pictured_in_2001_often_criticizes_Hill-a-66_1.jpg

Trump happens to be a rare breed of elites who gets there by lying, fraud, and gaming the system. At least most political elites are just well connected....
 
Every few years some writer has to pronounce the death of a political movement and a party. Sometimes if we are lucky we get several obituaries.

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
 
ataraxia said:
Well, that's just assuming that the American people have that level of class. I am starting to doubt it now. I never would have imagined there were this many vulgar and ignorant people in this country. But all you have to do is look at the size of these Trump rallies to realize this is a very real movement in America. And it's not going to go away anytime soon. One very real and sobering possibility is this is what America has become. This may be our new cultural values and what America means: rude, loud, vulgar, low-class, heartless, ignorant.

MAGA!
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Just out of curiosity, what is your opinion of the latest push amongst leftists to accost civil servants in their homes, to abuse them in restaurants, gas stations, and the like?
 
cpwill said:
Just out of curiosity, what is your opinion of the latest push amongst leftists to accost civil servants in their homes, to abuse them in restaurants, gas stations, and the like?
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I don't like it. But I can certainly understand it.

I can see how some people would be that upset by the election of a pu**y-grabbing president, who thinks global warming is a Chinese hoax, who has decimated global alliances which have taken decades to build, who tells his supporters he will cover the legal fees of his supporters if they punch his protestors, who cusses like a pimp, whose lies are meant to maliciously and dangerously lie and hurt entire groups of people (Mexican immigrants are all murderers and rapists, he saw Muslims celebrating on NJ rooftops on 9/11), who openly lies at least 6-7 times a day, etc...

But despite this, have any leftists talked of "second amendment remendies"? You remember that, don't you?
 
Its only because Leftists don't have any guns and are afraid of them anyway. You don't want a civil war with the 2A crowd, amigo.


ataraxia said:
I don't like it. But I can certainly understand it.

I can see how some people would be that upset by the election of a pu**y-grabbing president, who thinks global warming is a Chinese hoax, who has decimated global alliances which have taken decades to build, who tells his supporters he will cover the legal fees of his supporters if they punch his protestors, who cusses like a pimp, whose lies are meant to maliciously and dangerously lie and hurt entire groups of people (Mexican immigrants are all murderers and rapists, he saw Muslims celebrating on NJ rooftops on 9/11), who openly lies at least 6-7 times a day, etc...

But despite this, have any leftists talked of "second amendment remendies"? You remember that, don't you?
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TobyOne said:
Its only because Leftists don't have any guns and are afraid of them anyway. You don't want a civil war with the 2A crowd, amigo.
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What's funny are rightists who think having a gun makes them a real man. Any fool can play that game. It's not that hard.

Congressional baseball shooter fired at least 70 rounds - CNNPolitics

But hey, their guns are all these rightists got, so they will cling to them like their life depended on it. Take those away, and they got nothing. Poor things. Must be hard to rely on something you buy on sale at the store to define your manhood. No wonder they are so afraid it will be taken away.
 
ataraxia said:
I don't like it. But I can certainly understand it.

I can see how some people would be that upset by the election of a pu**y-grabbing president, who thinks global warming is a Chinese hoax, who has decimated global alliances which have taken decades to build, who tells his supporters he will cover the legal fees of his supporters if they punch his protestors, who cusses like a pimp, whose lies are meant to maliciously and dangerously lie and hurt entire groups of people (Mexican immigrants are all murderers and rapists, he saw Muslims celebrating on NJ rooftops on 9/11), who openly lies at least 6-7 times a day, etc...
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Sure. :roll: acting in a low, crass, vulgar way towards each other is bad, except when we do it, its excusable, because someone else said some bad stuff.


But despite this, have any leftists talked of "second amendment remendies"? You remember that, don't you?
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What, you mean like the leftist who shot up a GOP Congressman softball practice?
 
Trump and Clinton, two candidates who could only have ever won against each other.

The state of American democracy genuinely hurts, sometimes.
 
Fiddytree said:
Every few years some writer has to pronounce the death of a political movement and a party. Sometimes if we are lucky we get several obituaries.

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
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The GOP is a dead, regional party, which is why it controls the majority of state governments, both houses of Congress, and the White House.
 
Jesse Booth said:
Trump and Clinton, two candidates who could only have ever won failed to lose against each other.
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I really am not sure either of them really could have won.

The state of American democracy genuinely hurts, sometimes.
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2016 was the first year I began to wonder if the American people were even worth the sacrifices my friends had made. It was a rough moment.
 
ataraxia said:
Trump started it. What, you want to elect someone who says they will cover the legal fees for anyone who punches his protestors, and then expect classy behavior back? Don't dish it out if you can't take it.
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Trump started it? Surely you jest?

Look back at the 8 years of Obama and even before that, for examples of how the left ran roughshod over anyone and everyone that got in their way. Look at the rise in the popularity of intellectuals like Jordan Peterson from Canada. Look at the hatred shown toward people like Ben Shapiro. Look at the riots that occurred on campuses when a speaker that was anything right of far left was booked to appear and give a lecture. Those things happened LONG before Trump was elected.

I don't like the guy, at all, but Trump didn't start this. In fact, the animus that your posts and many people (including the majority of the media) are showing and have historically shown toward the people that are also the majority of his voters (not nut cases, but legitimately concerned and marginalized people), is one of the major reasons Trump won the election.

But let's just ignore that fact, and continue to attack the people, you know, those people in the basket of deplorables, and see how that works out this time. It sure didn't work out very well for the left in 2016.
 
cpwill said:
2016 was the first year I began to wonder if the American people were even worth the sacrifices my friends had made. It was a rough moment.
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Some of my family have bled for this country. I'm almost glad most of them didn't have to see the state of affairs today, ****ed up as that is to say.
 
Beaudreaux said:
Trump started it? Surely you jest?

Look back at the 8 years of Obama and even before that, for examples of how the left ran roughshod over anyone and everyone that got in their way. Look at the rise in the popularity of intellectuals like Jordan Peterson from Canada. Look at the hatred shown toward people like Ben Shapiro. Look at the riots that occurred on campuses when a speaker that was anything right of far left was booked to appear and give a lecture. Those things happened LONG before Trump was elected.

I don't like the guy, at all, but Trump didn't start this. In fact, the animus that your posts and many people (including the majority of the media) are showing and have historically shown toward the people that are also the majority of his voters (not nut cases, but legitimately concerned and marginalized people), is one of the major reasons Trump won the election.

But let's just ignore that fact, and continue to attack the people, you know, those people in the basket of deplorables, and see how that works out this time. It sure didn't work out very well for the left in 2016.
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I would say that it was George Wallace, governor of Alabama & pro-segregation Presidential candidate, that started us down this insane road.

There's an article on the subject somewhere on JSTOR about it - I'll see if I can dig it up.
 
It doesn't make you a man. It just makes you a winner in the coming war.




ataraxia said:
What's funny are rightists who think having a gun makes them a real man. Any fool can play that game. It's not that hard.

Congressional baseball shooter fired at least 70 rounds - CNNPolitics

But hey, their guns are all these rightists got, so they will cling to them like their life depended on it. Take those away, and they got nothing. Poor things. Must be hard to rely on something you buy on sale at the store to define your manhood. No wonder they are so afraid it will be taken away.
Click to expand...
 
Jesse Booth said:
I would say that it was George Wallace, governor of Alabama & pro-segregation Presidential candidate, that started us down this insane road.

There's an article on the subject somewhere on JSTOR about it - I'll see if I can dig it up.
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Wallace definitely added to the animus, but it started way before him, and comes in waves that are like the tide in that they rise and fall and have less impactful times and more impactful times. Right now, we're in a very impactful time where the pendulum has swung from one side where the right was marginalized in our society to now when the pendulum has swung back to where the left feels the return impact of the waves.

Hoover's time was another pendulum swing in the tidal forces that led to Roosevelt and our country and the right in our country are still feeling the impact of that tidal shift in who was on top and who was marginalized by politics, the economy, and society as a whole.

Hatred knows no ideology other than just plain hatred for hatred's sake.

The left is showing just as much as the right, and has been for a while now. Like I said in another post, that animus is one of the major reasons that Trump was elected, by a hell of a lot of folks that got tired of being called names, and being treated as if their lives, their culture (religion, and so forth) and their future, were not important to the country or to our government.
 
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