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Teacher vs Police Salary

Gaius46 said:
I'm not arguing that teaching is more dangerous than being a cop, though in some inner cities it may well be. I'm simply refuting the idea that lots of cops get killed in the line of duty. That's a fallacy.

Going further we don't pay people based only how dangerous their jobs are. That may factor into it but it's only one of many factors.
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That's why I looked at it from the perspective of how much society benefits...or could benefit.
 
imagep said:
Teachers have a job that requires a college degree and state licensing and more training (student teaching at no pay) than cops have.
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it's hard to say which one should be paid more because they're both needed. You should because we're taking Public Funding to pay for these things in order to pay the teachers more we have to take money from somewhere else. If you pay police less to pay teachers more you're going to lose all your good police and bad police is worse than no police at all.

I'd say as long as the people are willing to do the job for the money that's available then that's where the pay should be.

Its also fairly rare that cops get killed on the job, it's less dangerous than many professions. Being a police officer is just above painters and just below grounds keepers in most ranking of deadly jobs. Maybe we should start paying our grounds keepers more.
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well the danger of death isn't the only thing involved in being a police officer. But a police officer goes out into a danger zone everyday.

What do you think the most dangerous job a police officer does is?

At this point people are willing to do the job we can get enough people good at it and honest about it so the pay is right for teachers and police.
 
biglawnmower said:
why did you refuse to cite the accusation you just made? you quoted the question:



you made the claim. im simply asking you to back it up.

are you admitting your claim was false?
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It wasn't a claim. It was speculation. Is that so hard to understand? It has nothing at all to do with the point I'm making and I regret writing because it gives people like you something to hang on to when you don't want to actually discuss the matter at hand.

So I'll say it again. It is irrelevent. It has nothing to do with my point that job lots of cops do not get killed on the job. If you wish to discuss that we can. If you're going to continue to harp on a throwaway line save us both the trouble and don't bother.
 
Lursa said:
That's why I looked at it from the perspective of how much society benefits...or could benefit.
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That's an important point part of picture to be sure. So is supply and demand. So is the investment in training to get the job. Teachers need at least bachelor's degrees if not masters degrees. Cops often need nothing more than an associates, if that much.
 
CLAX1911 said:
Better education won't reduce crime do you can only educate people that want to be educated.
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Garbage nonsense. Good teachers find ways to make even relatively boring subjects interesting. An environment has a boatload to do with fostering education and reducing crime.


CLAX1911 said:
Also did you know that a lot of police in the US do it on a voluntary basis. I worked as a police officer for a year without getting paid a cent.
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You do realize there are a ton of teachers in the US that do it on a voluntary basis too right?
 
CLAX1911 said:
What will happen if they go up anymore these people will simply move out of the city like what we saw happened in Detroit.
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I'm talking about a federal law. Moving out of a city or state won't help you escape a federal law. You see the problem that you have here is that you're paying for education and police using only property taxes because at the city level it's virtually impossible to collect income taxes. By making it a federal law which requires the state as whole to help out you can ensure that wealthier cities, districts, and neighborhoods are chipping in to make sure there is sufficient funding for poorer and more rural communities.

In Minnesota, we have higher income taxes, and much of that money is distributed around the state so that even in relatively small rural communities and poorer urban neighborhoods can still afford relatively decent schools. Unfortunately, the new Tax law is trying to punish states with relatively high-income taxes to make it harder for them to do so. Why?

Because ****ty selfish Republicans like the ones who run Texas don't want tax dollars to be used to benefit anybody but themselves. They want to use the money to send their own children to exponentially more lavish schools that they don't need meanwhile six blocks over you have minority children who can afford no school at all. Then when they inevitably turn to crime they want to hire more police who will lock up those minorities and throw them in the for-profit prison that the rich white people run.
 
biglawnmower said:
police have much more dangerous jobs. they are American heroes and should make 6 figure salaries at least.
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If we did a better job of educating the populace we likely wouldn't need any cops at all. The sad reality is there are way too many former bullies and people with delusions of grandeur going into police work because they want a badge and a gun so they can go around playing dirty harry all day. While many officers do fine work, and important work, it is dangerous to assume anyone is a hero just because they're wearing the uniform of one.
 
Gaius46 said:
That same site quotes the number of sworn officers in the United States at "more than 900,000." That gives the average cop over a 20-year career a little less than a 1 in 300 chance of dying in the line of duty.
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And that likely doesn't even reflect the reality that many of those deaths are from simple car accidents they cause themselves not shootouts. Not that it makes it okay, but the reality is most police officers will never actually be shot at even once in their entire career.
 
MrWonka said:
Just a thought I had today. What do you think about a law that would require teachers salaries to match or exceed that of police officers with equivalent experience in each district? Right now the average salary of a police officer in the United States is $59,000, the average salary of a teacher is $58,000. State by state the salaries for the two professions are relatively close.

What I've noticed is that Republican states seem to want to target unions, particularly teachers unions. Yet for some reason, they never mess with the police unions. Apparently hired guns and prison cells are the only way conservatives know how to fight crime. The idea of better-educating people so they can more easily find legitimate jobs never seems to occur to them. So why not tie them together and make sure we're never creating more criminals before we hire police to jail them?
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Google Info Bot said:
According to the Sacramento Bee , the average teacher salary in 2011 was $67,871. Districts with the highest average teacher salaries in California are located near Santa Barbara, San Francisco and Los Angeles. ... According to EdSource , starting teachers earn $45,637 in Los Angeles and $38,347 in San Diego.Apr 4, 2012
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This is a bit dated, but it goes to show that more money doesn't buy success. California is in strong competition for the coveted last place in education achievement.
 
MrWonka said:
Garbage nonsense. Good teachers find ways to make even relatively boring subjects interesting.
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so you know absolutely nothing of the profession.

I'm sorry to wreck your fairytale of worldview but there are some people that just refuse to learn no matter how good the teacher is. Sorry.

An environment has a boatload to do with fostering education and reducing crime.
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okay so you think the problem was Nicholas Cruz was that his math teacher was boring?




You do realize there are a ton of teachers in the US that do it on a voluntary basis too right?
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are they strictly volunteers? Meaning they get absolutely no pay?

I don't believe you.
 
MrWonka said:
Garbage nonsense. Good teachers find ways to make even relatively boring subjects interesting. An environment has a boatload to do with fostering education and reducing crime.
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Yes. And education does reduce crime.

https://all4ed.org/press/crime-rates-linked-to-educational-attainment-new-alliance-report-finds/

https://economics.handels.gu.se/digitalAssets/1439/1439011_49-55_research_lochner.pdf

http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-08_REP_EducationAndPublicSafety_PS-AC.pdf

You do realize there are a ton of teachers in the US that do it on a voluntary basis too right?
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*nods*
 
MrWonka said:
I'm talking about a federal law. Moving out of a city or state won't help you escape a federal law.
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Lol, good luck with that.

You see the problem that you have here is that you're paying for education and police using only property taxes because at the city level it's virtually impossible to collect income taxes. By making it a federal law which requires the state as whole to help out you can ensure that wealthier cities, districts, and neighborhoods are chipping in to make sure there is sufficient funding for poorer and more rural communities.
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so you're talking about redistribution of wealth through the force of government?

I don't think that's going anywhere.

In Minnesota, we have higher income taxes, and much of that money is distributed around the state so that even in relatively small rural communities and poorer urban neighborhoods can still afford relatively decent schools. Unfortunately, the new Tax law is trying to punish states with relatively high-income taxes to make it harder for them to do so. Why?
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because state or any income tax places the highest burden on the middle class. Property tax and sales tax places the highest burden the people who purchased the most and has the biggest most valuable properties so it's distributed properly versus just taking it. My state doesn't have an income tax.

Because ****ty selfish Republicans like the ones who run Texas don't want tax dollars to be used to benefit anybody but themselves. They want to use the money to send their own children to exponentially more lavish schools that they don't need meanwhile six blocks over you have minority children who can afford no school at all.
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I don't know what you know about Texas but despite this nonsense we are part of the US and we do have to provide Public School to everyone so it's not about affording you get public schooling regardless.

I think it's incredibly selfish of a state and its politicians to burden the middle class with heavy taxes and income tax heavily burdens the middle class. Not the upper class they have all sorts of loopholes because in such a system they can buy off politicians that's why our federal tax code is in such disarray.

Sales tax and by extension property tax Texas the people who have higher value to property or purchase more assets higher they're for placing the highest burden on the wealthiest people.

Selfish Democrats despise the middle class they want everyone poor.

Then when they inevitably turn to crime they want to hire more police who will lock up those minorities and throw them in the for-profit prison that the rich white people run.
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So you're suggesting to minorities commit more crimes because they're minorities? Maybe it's because I live in a very diverse City that I'm just not that racist.
 
biglawnmower said:
can you cite which inner cities being a teacher is more dangerous than being a police officer.

appreciate the sources that verify your claims
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Do you have sources that indicate otherwise?
 
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