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Do you personally subscribe to Trump's "Never apologize" philosophy?

And this is what is so sad--the irrationality of those who both blindly support and despise Trump. Whether it's an inability to fairly criticize the President or give credit where it's due, I just don't understand the irrationality.

I compare it to working for a company who pays you well, but treats you like you are ignorant. That is how many of us feel about Trump. Agree with some of the policies, but have little respect for the man behind them.
 
And this is what is so sad--the irrationality of those who both blindly support and despise Trump. Whether it's an inability to fairly criticize the President or give credit where it's due, I just don't understand the irrationality.

I don't either as it is a fairly new phenomenon. Polarization, mega partisanship, putting party over country, loss of a proper perspective among the two parties. Perhaps due to both major parties shrinking, both parties driving out middle America, the center, center left and center right, the more moderate out of their parties leaving only the hard core ideologues.

Take a look at the opposing party approval numbers for several presidents for their first sixteen month and the range.
Trump 7-9% approval from Democrats. Unheard of low numbers. Democrats never gave Trump a chance to govern. As I stated many times, the Democrats set out to destroy Trump the day after the election and if they also destroy the country, that okay with them as long as they get Trump.
Obama 14-41% approval from Republicans. Republicans were will to give Obama a chance at the beginning of his presidency at 41%. It was the ACA that drove Republican approval numbers down from 41% to 14% in May of 2010.
G.W. Bush Not a good example because of 9-11. His range among Democrats 26-82%. But the 82% was the few days after 9-11. Still Bush had a 33% approval rating when he first took office from Democrats even after the Florida recounts. A third were willing to give Bush a chance. Not so with Trump or even close.
Bill Clinton 14-33% among Republicans. Again like Bush, Republicans gave Clinton a 33% approval rating when he took office. After dropping to 14% in August of 1993, by May of 1994, sixteen months in office, Republicans were giving Bill a 26% approval rating. Even Republicans were going up and down with Bill.
G.H.W. Bush 25-80% among Democrats. Desert Storm brought the 80% approval for Bush. 38% of Democrats approved of the elder Bush when he took office.
Reagan 24-47% among Democrats. 39% when Reagan took office, falling to 24% in May of 1982 among Democrats.

From Reagan through Obama, the opposing party from 33-41% approved of the president. Meaning at least a third of the opposing party were willing to give the president a chance and would fluctuate, go up and down depending on what the president was doing and events taking place. Not so with Trump. No chance from the Democrats given, no honeymoon as give other presidents, no quarter so to speak. I'm no fan of Trump, but the Democrats down right hatred of him is unprecedented and that began the day after the election. No chance given at all. Polarization, hyper partisanship, pure hatred for Hillary's loss. The problem with all of that as I pointed out numerous times, it was Hillary herself who lost the election. The numbers prove that. But when you nominate someone as disliked and unwanted as Trump was, what do you expect. Don't blame Trump for Hillary's loss, look in the mirror. It was the decisions, choices, actions taken by the two major parties in 2016 that lead to a President Trump.

This whole thing is 100% pure asinine.
 
Trump's approval is both self induced and caused to a certain extent by the media. There's no doubt that on Cable News, Fox is pro Trump, CNN and MSNBC are anti-Trump. They've taken sides. I haven't watched the over the air networks news in more than 20 years, so I can't talk about them. Trump's approval has been amazing steady. Within a six point margin of 38-44 hardly ever going over or under those numbers and his disapproval numbers between 52-58. I've never seen that steadiness. It almost seems that no matter what good or bad things go on in the country or what good or bad things Trump does, his number aren't going to move much.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_trump_job_approval-6179.html

Obama's range was 20 points, usually between 43-63 depending on what was happening. G.W. Bush is a bad example because of 9-11, he ranged between 51-90% on approval for his first 16 months. Bill Clinton between 39-59 for his first 16 months, another 20 point range. G. H. W. Bush ranged from 51-80%, a 30 point swing. But the elder Bush popularity shot up due to Desert Storm. Reagan, 45-69% for his first 16 months and so on. So presidents usually range in the 20 point range depending on events, etc. Trump is unique in that he doesn't fall into normal. It seems he has solid support from roughly 40% of the general public which will never leave him regardless of what he does or the events that happen. Probably around 54% give or take that will never approve of him.

Talk about having steady support, you could almost draw a straight line at 84% of Republicans approving of Trump from inauguration day till today. Same for Democrat and their approval, draw a straight line at 8%. Independents are different, no straight line in their approval. Independents has ranged between 30-42%. Today, Trump is at 37% approval among independents.

What does all of that mean? It means Republicans and Democrats have made up their minds about Trump and neither are going to change their minds regardless of what Trump does or doesn't do, what events or happenings take place in the world. Partisanship set in stone, cement or what have have. Independents, probably around 15% of them will go up or down depending on how they view Trump and the happening in the world. Most folks have made up their minds about Trump and as I stated with the exception of some independents, their mind's ain't gonna change.
I agree to a certain extent but not completely. Trump can lose or expand his support depending on how things unfold. I don't believe it is as cemented as you do, but I do agree to a certain degree that there is truth in your opinion.

The reason I say what I do is because Trump is involved in many big things that are going go change at least some people's minds about him.

If people believe he has gotten Noko to surrender their nuclear weapons program that will win people over. If they think he got played by Kim he will some support.

The conclusion of the mueller investigation is going to change people's minds about him.

Daca as border security are both unresolved issues that will shape opinions

What he does with healthcare is going to influence people

The health of the economy is huge

What's next with Iran is another big question.

I could go on and on but my point is that Trump has held office for less than 1 1/2 years and I believe many people are taking a wait and see approach. While I think you rightly point out that many people find his personality off putting, I think they are more concerned about how effective he governs.

Imo I think the real question people ask themselves is the right track, wrong track one. I'm willing to go out on a limb and tell you it would not surprise me if Trump picks up seats in both houses in the midterms if he continues to compile political victories between now and then. Trump has a positive message and I think more people see that as the right track than those that think Trump has us on the wrong track.

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It goes without saying that all but the most radical of Trump suporters recognize that he has significant ego and self esteem issues. Whether these conditions-or an incorrect assumption that he is always right- drives his non apology is open for debate. What I am most curious to learn is how many posters here think that refusing to apologize is actually a character strength instead of a character flaw. Personally, I have apologizes countless times in my life and have felt better in doing so. There have also been numerous times that I was apologized to and gained a measure of respect for those who did the apologizing. The other thought is that if you actually think that never apologizing is okay, is this the philosophy that you have instilled upon your children as well?

I can't remember Obama apologizing about the you can keep your doctor B.S. or his other blunders. Presidents don't do it because it is fodder for what we call journalists to crap all over anyone who ever admits they made a mistake. Although my saying is " The only people who make no mistakes are either dead or do nothing".
 
I agree to a certain extent but not completely. Trump can lose or expand his support depending on how things unfold. I don't believe it is as cemented as you do, but I do agree to a certain degree that there is truth in your opinion.

The reason I say what I do is because Trump is involved in many big things that are going go change at least some people's minds about him.

If people believe he has gotten Noko to surrender their nuclear weapons program that will win people over. If they think he got played by Kim he will some support.

The conclusion of the mueller investigation is going to change people's minds about him.

Daca as border security are both unresolved issues that will shape opinions

What he does with healthcare is going to influence people

The health of the economy is huge

What's next with Iran is another big question.

I could go on and on but my point is that Trump has held office for less than 1 1/2 years and I believe many people are taking a wait and see approach. While I think you rightly point out that many people find his personality off putting, I think they are more concerned about how effective he governs.

Imo I think the real question people ask themselves is the right track, wrong track one. I'm willing to go out on a limb and tell you it would not surprise me if Trump picks up seats in both houses in the midterms if he continues to compile political victories between now and then. Trump has a positive message and I think more people see that as the right track than those that think Trump has us on the wrong track.

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The one thing Trump has going for him now is the economy. With 26 seats in the senate up for re-election vs. just 9 for the GOP, the Republicans should pick up seats with those numbers regardless of Trump. Indiana, West Virginia, Missouri, North Dakota, Montana are traditional Republican states which currently have Democratic senators. Some think Rick Scott has a chance of defeating Nelson in Florida also. So there is a possible six. But Arizona, Nevada, Tennessee, Republican held seats looks very iffy at this point. If McCain calls it quits, Arizona would have two senate races, both seats are about 50-50.

The house also looks about a 50-50 shot that the Dems take control. If the election were held today, I would say the Democrats get their 23 seat net gain to do just that. But the election isn't today. Hard to tell what the future holds.

North Korea and the economy could very well sway independents into the Trump camp. Although I doubt it will move any Democrats. They're too well entrenched for movement. Healthcare, I would say as of today that is playing against Trump and the GOP. Will the economy offset that? Who knows? Iran, I don't think independents care much about Iran as long as things remain quiet. Independents did go for Trump 46-42 over Clinton with 12% voting third party. Independents really didn't like either major party candidate. In fact, Gallup tag independents at 54% disliking both major party candidates. Indies just disliked Clinton more than Trump.

One in Four Americans Dislike Both Presidential Candidates

There has been a rebound in the generic congressional poll if one puts much stock in that for the GOP. The Democratic advantage is down to six points today whereas it was at 12 points in December of last year. The drop could be something as that old adage coming into play, "I like my congressman, it is the other 434 that are the problem." Again, too early to tell. But we elect our House members one district at a time, not nationally. So the generic can be a guide, but could also be way off if one party or the other wins most of the close races. The same applies to the senate.

There has been sort of a realignment taking place over the last couple of weeks. Enough to stop a potential blue wave? That may depend on how long the realignment lasts.
 
No chance from the Democrats given, no honeymoon as give other presidents, no quarter so to speak.

Trump is responsible for this. He has never tried to govern from the middle. And on DAY 1, he begins by lying about his crowd size. You're not going to get any honeymoon when you're constantly lying and tweeting nonsense.

Two words: Personal Responsibility.
 
Trump is responsible for this. He has never tried to govern from the middle. And on DAY 1, he begins by lying about his crowd size. You're not going to get any honeymoon when you're constantly lying and tweeting nonsense.

Two words: Personal Responsibility.

Trump began his lying as soon as he announced if saying one thing one day, the complete opposite the next and deny saying anything at all on the third is to be considered lying. I don't think Trump himself knows what he stands for. He's switched parties eight times and each time he probably switched his ideology to coincide with what ever his new party thought.

But no, the Democratic opposition goes much deeper than just inauguration day or waiting to determine how he governs. They begin their opposition the day after the election. How dare Trump defeat Hillary. Even though Hillary had more to do with her defeat than Trump had to do with his winning. Hillary's defeat lies right at her feet and that of the DNC and Democratic state party leaders. 2016 was an election for Hillary to lose and lose she did by her own hand. I went through all of that many time before.

I think when you look at the approval numbers on inauguration day and find them from 33-41% of the opposing party giving the new president you can tell the opposition and attempted destruction had already began. The Democrat gave Trump just 8%, not the normal 33-41. I posted those numbers already too via the different presidents.
 
I can't remember Obama apologizing about the you can keep your doctor B.S. or his other blunders. Presidents don't do it because it is fodder for what we call journalists to crap all over anyone who ever admits they made a mistake. Although my saying is " The only people who make no mistakes are either dead or do nothing".

Actually, me and several THOUSAND of my coworkers did in fact keep our physicians so try again.
 
Trump is responsible for this. He has never tried to govern from the middle. And on DAY 1, he begins by lying about his crowd size. You're not going to get any honeymoon when you're constantly lying and tweeting nonsense.

Two words: Personal Responsibility.

I remember watching the Trump victory speech thinking that maybe, just maybe, the bull**** campaign garbage was over. That lasted until his pitiful inauguration speech and him sending Spicer out on day one to make a complete idiot of himself. I new then that President Trump was the same "tactless" fool that Manhattean had mocked for years.
 
I compare it to working for a company who pays you well, but treats you like you are ignorant. That is how many of us feel about Trump. Agree with some of the policies, but have little respect for the man behind them.

I can certainly understand that. I do believe, however, that the Office of the Presidency must be respected.
 
I don't either as it is a fairly new phenomenon. Polarization, mega partisanship, putting party over country, loss of a proper perspective among the two parties. Perhaps due to both major parties shrinking, both parties driving out middle America, the center, center left and center right, the more moderate out of their parties leaving only the hard core ideologues.

That's part of it. But another part is unreasonable ill will toward those fellows who don't agree with you. When did compromise become impossible?

Take a look at the opposing party approval numbers for several presidents for their first sixteen month and the range.
Trump 7-9% approval from Democrats. Unheard of low numbers. Democrats never gave Trump a chance to govern. As I stated many times, the Democrats set out to destroy Trump the day after the election and if they also destroy the country, that okay with them as long as they get Trump.

Exactly. And I just don't understand this.

Obama 14-41% approval from Republicans. Republicans were will to give Obama a chance at the beginning of his presidency at 41%. It was the ACA that drove Republican approval numbers down from 41% to 14% in May of 2010.

G.W. Bush Not a good example because of 9-11. His range among Democrats 26-82%. But the 82% was the few days after 9-11. Still Bush had a 33% approval rating when he first took office from Democrats even after the Florida recounts. A third were willing to give Bush a chance. Not so with Trump or even close.
Bill Clinton 14-33% among Republicans. Again like Bush, Republicans gave Clinton a 33% approval rating when he took office. After dropping to 14% in August of 1993, by May of 1994, sixteen months in office, Republicans were giving Bill a 26% approval rating. Even Republicans were going up and down with Bill.
G.H.W. Bush 25-80% among Democrats. Desert Storm brought the 80% approval for Bush. 38% of Democrats approved of the elder Bush when he took office.
Reagan 24-47% among Democrats. 39% when Reagan took office, falling to 24% in May of 1982 among Democrats.

From Reagan through Obama, the opposing party from 33-41% approved of the president. Meaning at least a third of the opposing party were willing to give the president a chance and would fluctuate, go up and down depending on what the president was doing and events taking place. Not so with Trump. No chance from the Democrats given, no honeymoon as give other presidents, no quarter so to speak. I'm no fan of Trump, but the Democrats down right hatred of him is unprecedented and that began the day after the election. No chance given at all. Polarization, hyper partisanship, pure hatred for Hillary's loss. The problem with all of that as I pointed out numerous times, it was Hillary herself who lost the election. The numbers prove that. But when you nominate someone as disliked and unwanted as Trump was, what do you expect. Don't blame Trump for Hillary's loss, look in the mirror. It was the decisions, choices, actions taken by the two major parties in 2016 that lead to a President Trump.

This whole thing is 100% pure asinine.

Again, I agree. My guess is that ordinary folks are growing tired of the continual attacks on Trump, particularly those who cruise through the TV channels and catch, oh, Colbert, for example. And this reminds me of the difference between him and Jay Leno, who was part of a "kinder, gentler" TV Land. ;)
 
That's part of it. But another part is unreasonable ill will toward those fellows who don't agree with you. When did compromise become impossible?



Exactly. And I just don't understand this.



Again, I agree. My guess is that ordinary folks are growing tired of the continual attacks on Trump, particularly those who cruise through the TV channels and catch, oh, Colbert, for example. And this reminds me of the difference between him and Jay Leno, who was part of a "kinder, gentler" TV Land. ;)

Oh yes, compromise has now become a four letter word. Each party wants all or nothing. Whether than give the other party 10% of what they want for you to get 90%, they settle for nothing. I also never understood the politics of destruction. It seems to me Republicans view Democrats and Democrats view Republicans as this nation's number one enemy. More so than North Korea, Iran, Russia, you name it. Each is out to destroy the other and if the country is destroyed because of it, so be it. That kind of attitude is unfathomable for me to understand.

I too see a backlash possible for all the anti-Trump Rhetoric and actions against him. That backlash may have started already. What has Trump accomplished these last two months? Certainly nothing significant. Yet his approval has risen from 38% to 43%. The Democratic Party lead over the last two months in the generic congressional poll has dropped from 10 points down to six. What has the GOP congress accomplished over these last two months? Nothing I can think of. Two months ago I would have given odds of 60-70% on the Democrats regaining the House. Today, no better than 50-50. So what is the cause? Two months ago, independents preferred the Democratic congressional candidate in the generic poll 35-30 over the Republican candidate. Today they are split 32-32. Hence the drop from 10 points down to six. That still leaves around 35% of independents who haven't made up their mind, the don't know or not sure category. That's a huge number of undecided's.

People getting tired of all the anti-Trump bashing, that's about the only thing that has remain constant. The bashing I mean. Here's something I received today: "Is Trump-Bashing Backfiring on the Democrats?" It's very interesting.

Is Trump-Bashing Backfiring on the Democrats? - Rasmussen Reports®

Here is what caught my eye in the above poll. Among voters not affiliated with either major party, a plurality (48%) says the Trump-bashing will have no impact on their vote, but 25% are more likely to vote for a pro-Trump candidate.

That's independents, the non-affiliated. That may be why the Democrats has lost their lead among independents in the generic poll. Too much Trump bashing is beginning to backfire. It'll be interesting in two weeks when I do my monthly Perotista senate and house forecast to see the effects of this. It does seem that the year long trend in the Democrats favor may be subsiding and along with it, the expected blue wave. Time will tell whether this is an anomaly or a new trend.
 
Actually, me and several THOUSAND of my coworkers did in fact keep our physicians so try again.

Sounds like YOU are insured by the company you work for. NOT every American is so fortunate. ACA was to especially help those Americans.
 
Oh yes, compromise has now become a four letter word. Each party wants all or nothing. Whether than give the other party 10% of what they want for you to get 90%, they settle for nothing. I also never understood the politics of destruction. It seems to me Republicans view Democrats and Democrats view Republicans as this nation's number one enemy. More so than North Korea, Iran, Russia, you name it. Each is out to destroy the other and if the country is destroyed because of it, so be it. That kind of attitude is unfathomable for me to understand.

I too see a backlash possible for all the anti-Trump Rhetoric and actions against him. That backlash may have started already. What has Trump accomplished these last two months? Certainly nothing significant. Yet his approval has risen from 38% to 43%. The Democratic Party lead over the last two months in the generic congressional poll has dropped from 10 points down to six. What has the GOP congress accomplished over these last two months? Nothing I can think of. Two months ago I would have given odds of 60-70% on the Democrats regaining the House. Today, no better than 50-50. So what is the cause? Two months ago, independents preferred the Democratic congressional candidate in the generic poll 35-30 over the Republican candidate. Today they are split 32-32. Hence the drop from 10 points down to six. That still leaves around 35% of independents who haven't made up their mind, the don't know or not sure category. That's a huge number of undecided's.

People getting tired of all the anti-Trump bashing, that's about the only thing that has remain constant. The bashing I mean. Here's something I received today: "Is Trump-Bashing Backfiring on the Democrats?" It's very interesting.

Is Trump-Bashing Backfiring on the Democrats? - Rasmussen Reports®

Here is what caught my eye in the above poll. Among voters not affiliated with either major party, a plurality (48%) says the Trump-bashing will have no impact on their vote, but 25% are more likely to vote for a pro-Trump candidate.

That's independents, the non-affiliated. That may be why the Democrats has lost their lead among independents in the generic poll. Too much Trump bashing is beginning to backfire. It'll be interesting in two weeks when I do my monthly Perotista senate and house forecast to see the effects of this. It does seem that the year long trend in the Democrats favor may be subsiding and along with it, the expected blue wave. Time will tell whether this is an anomaly or a new trend.

Well said. I'm a right leaning independent and it is very irritating to me to see the nonstop bashing of Trump and refusing to give him credit for anything. I'd actually like to have honest conversations about Trump and his performance but most of the left make that all but impossible. And then when I even try going down that road, the other side does not reciprocate in any way and believe I am ripe for conversion therapy as in if I can see one of their points, surely they will be able to convince me that they are 100% right.
 
There is also a difference between admitting that you are wrong, and having to apologize for that mistake.
The two are not always one in the same.

Trump does neither. See the Central Park Five case. Tho I suppose his settlement of the Trump U case could have been spun as both, not that he would ever admit it.
 
I have yet to hear any of left wing talking heads apologize for the many things they have gotten wrong. Should they apologize too?

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Google media retractions.
 
Well said. I'm a right leaning independent and it is very irritating to me to see the nonstop bashing of Trump and refusing to give him credit for anything. I'd actually like to have honest conversations about Trump and his performance but most of the left make that all but impossible. And then when I even try going down that road, the other side does not reciprocate in any way and believe I am ripe for conversion therapy as in if I can see one of their points, surely they will be able to convince me that they are 100% right.

My sense is that one is not allowed to give Trump any credit where it's due, and that if one does, he or she is instantly branded a "Trumpanzee" or whatever. This doesn't lead to productive dialogue, nor does branding the half of the country who voted for Trump as "immoral" or "idiots."
 
Well said. I'm a right leaning independent and it is very irritating to me to see the nonstop bashing of Trump and refusing to give him credit for anything. I'd actually like to have honest conversations about Trump and his performance but most of the left make that all but impossible. And then when I even try going down that road, the other side does not reciprocate in any way and believe I am ripe for conversion therapy as in if I can see one of their points, surely they will be able to convince me that they are 100% right.

Trump has done somethings I like and some I didn't. Just like every other president before him. I'll also be the first to admit I don't care for the man. It's his obnoxious, egotistical persona that drives me up a tree. Which brings in another idea. People may be finally adjusting to that uncouth persona of his, finally getting past his repulsive behavior to see how he is governing. Trump has always been about ten points below the mood of the country with his approval ratings. To go along with that, the right track/wrong track polls, the direction of the country has seen over the last two month an increase from 34% to 40% who think this country is on the right track.

That fits into the other numbers I cited. Trump's approval on the economy has also increased from 45% to 50% since March. Although on Foreign Policy his improved since March was only 41-43%. But unless we get involved in a war or something, the economy usually over rides foreign policy. Perhaps people are finally getting used to Trump obnoxious ways and behavior. Who knows? I'll be keeping a close eye on all these numbers, the question I have is the last two months an anomaly or has a new trend developed? That I don't know either.
 
I apoligize almost daily. Whether I accidentally bump someone or I did something wrong, I apoligize as often as I can.
 
A retraction isn't an apology.

How many times do you recall obama apologizing?

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I have heard many newscasters apologize after recounting a mistake. I may be wrong, but I believe newspapers do the same at times. I believe that the thing people harp on about Obama is apparently something he said in Europe when visiting, or maybe in Latin America when he noted US previous support for brutal dictatorships there.
 
I dont think I answered the question.

I do not and never have had a do not apologize policy.

I few times a year I decide that I have made an error were an apology is warranted.
 
It goes without saying that all but the most radical of Trump suporters recognize that he has significant ego and self esteem issues. Whether these conditions-or an incorrect assumption that he is always right- drives his non apology is open for debate. What I am most curious to learn is how many posters here think that refusing to apologize is actually a character strength instead of a character flaw. Personally, I have apologizes countless times in my life and have felt better in doing so. There have also been numerous times that I was apologized to and gained a measure of respect for those who did the apologizing. The other thought is that if you actually think that never apologizing is okay, is this the philosophy that you have instilled upon your children as well?



It's not a strength. It's a weakness. But, some people have an extreme problem in the opposite direction, apologizing for every little thing.

I knew someone like that, a long time ago, it was annoying.
 
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