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Thread: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grand Mal View Post
    Just curious, does 'reconstruct our demographics and start over' mean what I think it means?
    To be clear, I think by 'reconstruct our demographics' you mean without black people, and maybe without latino people. That what you mean?
    It does sound like that's what he means.

    He's forgetting that there was a time when the gang wars were fought by Italian, Irish and other White immigrant gangs. Today, in Chicago, you have Black gangs. It's more about who is poor than it is about race. But for a racist everything is about race.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Yes it would probably lower the murder rate. That's what we see when other countries do it.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    CALL FOR ACTION TO PREVENT GUN VIOLENCE IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    https://curry.virginia.edu/prevent-gun-violence


    School shootings and widespread community gun violence are far greater in the United States than other nations. America cannot be great and realize its promise of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness if our children are not safe from gun violence.

    Although security measures are important, a focus on simply preparing for shootings is insufficient. We need a change in mindset and policy from reaction to prevention. Prevention entails more than security measures and begins long before a gunman comes to school. We need a comprehensive public health approach to gun violence that is informed by scientific evidence and free from partisan politics.

    A public health approach to protecting children as well as adults from gun violence involves three levels of prevention: (1) universal approaches promoting safety and well-being for everyone; (2) practices for reducing risk and promoting protective factors for persons experiencing difficulties; and (3) interventions for individuals where violence is present or appears imminent.
    Click on the link to read their recommendation.
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    If we were turned into an absolutely monarchy with King Donald I’d be perfectly happy since he’s so far doing a good job governing despite the totally crap allegations he’s being subjected to

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Checkerboard Strangler View Post
    CALL FOR ACTION TO PREVENT GUN VIOLENCE IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    https://curry.virginia.edu/prevent-gun-violence

    Click on the link to read their recommendation.
    more unconstitutional nonsense


    A ban on assault-style weapons, high-capacity ammunition clips, and products that modify semi-automatic firearms to enable them to function like automatic firearms.
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    You know that Reagan signed the Brady Bill - right?
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    I'm smart on the gun issue and what we need to do about it.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Without a doubt ILLEGALS are a huge cultural problem

    by definition they are not interested in assimilating because they refuse to follow the law

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    There are perhaps some laws that could be modified / created however most laws;

    1. Create new criminals that wouldnt otherwise be criminals.
    2. Place more restrictions on law abiding citizens to exercise their rights
    3. Makes it more difficult for people to defend themselves against dangerous crimimals.

    For this problem to be solved,
    1. Schools need to become harder target somehow
    2. Current laws and regulations need to be enforced with mandtory sentencing (plea bargains and parole harm the efectiveness pf using laws as a deterret)
    3. Several societal changes are needed, our addiction to violence, lack to desire to learn true, glorifying people that kill innocent people, lack of personal accountability, ability to sue at will with no consequence, multiple ways for politicials to divide citizens, and the way we communicate mainly to disagree without absolute hatred and labeling.

    Sadly, the last will likely only get worse.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by bluesmoke View Post
    What do you mean “sheltering kids”? What does that look like? When you say “Teaching a kid respect” do you mean teaching the “sheltered kid”, the bully, or both? They can both be steadily taught respect and still end up as is. The either/or of only two choices you give, as if there were no other, is a false dilemma. That “the other teaches that it's always someone else.” is just as much a falsehood as your nonsense claim "I'm willing to bet over time...most that were bullied are somewhat better off for it.", for which anecdotal evidence is insufficient support. The fact is, society more often makes the victim the “someone else” rather than the offending bully. The victim has to bear the burden and sort it out alone. That’s the way it’s been throughout history.

    That you say “I'm not for bullying” doesn’t change the fact of your being an apologist for the outcomes of bullying.
    You missed the point that bullying is going to happen regardless. You're never going to stop it.
    When (and if) you have kids you may understand what it's like to be intrusive on someone's life your responsible for.

    You have to teach them to not be a bully and how to handle being bullied.

    Sheltering kids is blaming the schools for bullies and acting as if your child does nothing wrong, it's always someone else. Maybe you can remember back in the days when parents automatically took the side of teachers pretty much regardless of circumstances because a) teachers dont have a reason to single out a kid and b) kids f-ing lie. your kid, my kid, everyone's kid.
    Today, too often, parents will take their child's side in everything, even against other kids. That is sheltering. That teaches their child they can do no wrong, which can create bullies and the softies that cannot take being bullied to the point they need to bring in guns.

    So to the other point about being an apologist for bullying, yea kind of, because I'm not going to be able to stop it and neither are you or anyone else. Tech your kid how to react and use it positively. And if you can't because it goes to far, that's when other measures need taken, I suggested karate as a great example. Their bully may have to be stopped on your kids own because you're not going to be able to hover around and fix everything for them.
    Last edited by AustralianuS; 03-08-18 at 01:18 PM.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by jdog View Post
    I think while we are at it, we need to identify which model of car is involved in the most DUI deaths and ban that model of car......

    It makes every bit as much sense as blaming murders on guns.
    There is a huge difference between guns and cars, so this is not a good example. Cars are made for transportation and in modern life many can not do without them. Guns have only one purpose, that is to kill and as we see in other countries we could do without or at least fewer of them and it would save lives. The problem in this country is that we are fifty or a hundred years past where gun control would do any good. We have somewhere between 270 million and 310 million and guns in the country. That makes it far too late for any gun control to stop those who wish to use those guns for evil purposes. Forget the car example as it is about as poor a one as you could bring up. Stick to the fact it is far too late for gun control and you will have a good argument.

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by AustralianuS View Post
    I think a good place to start would be to investigate where illegal handguns are coming from. Personally, I don't think the govt cares that there is a black market for guns or that so many people are killed by them. It almost never makes national news when 1-2 people are killed during a robbery, so it must not be a national problem. Although I'm willing to bet, the biggest piece of the pie of that 73% or murders is done in that or similar fashion.


    The lunatic shooting up schools is so limited in numbers, people are asking for the impossible to stop this. I said in another thread a made up % of how many people "we" are actually looking for, and in some of those already rare cases, if the nutso doesn't have previous experience breaking the law, not even a Psych is going to know what they are capable of.
    MSM needs to ensure these people are NOT famous. Don't show the face, don't share the name. Increase security and/or limit entry points to schools.

    And see something, say something. And parent your kid. Bullying sucks, it's not fun, but it's not so bad that schools need shot up. I'm willing to bet over time, most bullies regret their actions and most that were bullied are somewhat better off for it.
    Easy answer.....

    For every country that on a national level reduced and regulated guns. The gun violance was reduced substantially. Canada has more guns per capita than US but they are regulated. Same with Italy, Ireland, Portugal and France and of course australia, guns are not illegal but are regulated. Australia is a great example....When they started to regulated Guns the gun violance dropped 3X.

    IF We in US are serious about gun safety and want reduce gun murders it has to be on a Federal Level...because if one state or city tries to regulate the guns and neighboring cities or states don't then it won't solve anything.

    At the same time in US states

    On the other hand ....if you don't mind children getting mowed down and school shooting after school shootings helps you getting a hardon and your answer is a generic answer thoughts and prayers ...Then leave things as is.

    Diving Mullah

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    Re: Would Gun Control/Gun Ban Help Lower The Murder Rate In This Country?

    Quote Originally Posted by AustralianuS View Post
    You missed the point that bullying is going to happen regardless. You're never going to stop it.
    When (and if) you have kids you may understand what it's like to be intrusive on someone's life your responsible for.

    You have to teach them to not be a bully and how to handle being bullied.

    Sheltering kids is blaming the schools for bullies and acting as if your child does nothing wrong, it's always someone else. Maybe you can remember back in the days when parents automatically took the side of teachers pretty much regardless of circumstances because a) teachers dont have a reason to single out a kid and b) kids f-ing lie. your kid, my kid, everyone's kid.
    Today, too often, parents will take their child's side in everything, even against other kids. That is sheltering. That teaches their child they can do no wrong, which can create bullies and the softies that cannot take being bullied to the point they need to bring in guns.

    So to the other point about being an apologist for bullying, yea kind of, because I'm not going to be able to stop it and neither are you or anyone else. Tech your kid how to react and use it positively. And if you can't because it goes to far, that's when other measures need taken, I suggested karate as a great example. Their bully may have to be stopped on your kids own because you're not going to be able to hover around and fix everything for them.


    Your saying I missed the point that bullying will always be with us is a falsehood. Just because I didn’t make a declaratory statement saying so is meaningless. When I discuss the subject of murder, I may not say that “murder will always be with us”, but that doesn’t mean I don’t recognize the truth that murder, like bullying, will always be with us. Just because you tell someone that bullying will always be with us doesn’t mean that person didn’t know that before.

    Everything you’ve said about what children should be taught is elementary and redundant, though I most certainly agree but for your insistence on framing that is and should be done as false dilemma. However, just to edify, it is not so much the physical aspect of martial arts to defend oneself against bullying, but the self-confidence gained in the discipline of martial arts. By far, most bullying is mental/emotional. Bullies look for those who appear weak is where the self-confidence comes in. And, using “emotional judo” will help deflect the language of bullying, which is abusive, without resorting to violence.

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