• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

CNN: Democrats Who Crossed-over to Vote Trunp. What They Think One Year Later.

Captain Adverse said:
Every one of your stated "sentiments" can as easily be attributed to many on your side of the argument.

In fact, it is just more of the "deluded, racist, sexist, etc., etc. Trumpsters gonna love that Trump" ad hominin responsive viewpoint that prevents any kind of rational discussion.
Click to expand...

Did I say it was just conservatives?

No I did not.

And I've been on the perusuasion science kick since I got here.

I DID say its a ten billion dollar industry and they wouldn't be getting that kind of money if it didn't work.

I wonder how many of THEM are getting a 1% tax cut like I am at a bit over median wage? A TEMPORARY 1% tax cut.

Further divide and conquer is the rule of the day. If we talked to each other we'd realize how thoroughly we're being s rewed.
 
Captain Adverse said:
...And yet for some strange reason CNN in panel after panel seems unable to do so. :roll:

This was another CNN panel, and one would hope that they would have mentioned the parameters to the "random" selection of person's seeking to be on it (without trying to stack the panel by pre-screening specifically for Trump opponents) before selecting them. They always seem so surprised and confused by not being able to find any of those "Trump regretor's" you keep touting.

In fact, it is clear that the panel commentary was edited by CNN to limit the damage, selecting those answers they thought most reflective of all respondents while least problematic for use in the broadcast.

It was the CNN summation...



...I used in the OP.

The rest of your "KGB word over..." is a red herring with nothing to do with the OP. So forgive me if I ignore it.
Click to expand...

"CNN in panel after panel seems unable to do so". Well, it seems CNN is (1) unable to use the internet, (2) are unable to ask themselves how it is that Trump's approval rating has gone DOWN in the past year, including to some extent among his own voters, and (3) unable to ask themselves why it is that among the several elections held since then, the Democrats have been consistently overperforming even in what had been strongly-Republican areas.

In other words, I strongly suspect you've got a problem with confirmation bias. You're seeing what you want to see, and you are not looking at the whole picture. In fact, you'll find that Trump's support has - in some polls - even grown...but his support among women has dropped by an even greater degree, resulting in his overall lower approval rating.
 
I may have grown-up deep in a large northern city, with Euro immigrant family roots, but it was a blue-collar working-class neighborhood filled with a lot of folk similar to these. Yeah, many of my neighbor's last names ended in "ski", and some had accents & spoke with broken English, but they were the same type of salt-of-the-earth working folk like these. They'd walk or take a bus to the factory or loading docks at 7:00 in the morning, lunch-pail & thermos in hand, and on the way home they'd cash their checks at the corner bar on Fridays. And every one was a Dem. And for many, their union card was the top I.D. in their wallet.

These are exactly the type of people that were the Dem's core base, that I remember. But somehow, the Dems lost their way and ceded them to Trump. And it's going to be extremely hard I think, to get them back. The working-class populist economic message is a powerful one.
 
Chomsky said:
I may have grown-up deep in a large northern city, with Euro immigrant family roots, but it was a blue-collar working-class neighborhood filled with a lot of folk similar to these. Yeah, many of my neighbor's last names ended in "ski", and some had accents & spoke with broken English, but they were the same type of salt-of-the-earth working folk like these. They'd walk or take a bus to the factory or loading docks at 7:00 in the morning, lunch-pail & thermos in hand, and on the way home they'd cash their checks at the corner bar on Fridays. And every one was a Dem. And for many, their union card was the top I.D. in their wallet.

These are exactly the type of people that were the Dem's core base, that I remember. But somehow, the Dems lost their way and ceded them to Trump. And it's going to be extremely hard I think, to get them back. The working-class populist economic message is a powerful one.
Click to expand...

Exactly the point the Democrats missed during the campaign...depending on the noise from the hard core "Blue States" of New York and California while forgetting the "rust belt" which they then lost because they failed to recognize the growing discontent and made no effort to address their needs.
 
yankintx said:
This belongs in the conspiracy theory forum. To suggest a Dem crossing over to vote for Trump, now that would be a conspiracy. Perhaps that is what Trumps sham Election Senate Committee was looking for, it took them a year to figure out no Dem was dumb enough to vote for Donald Trump. :doh
Click to expand...
Please tell me this post is facetious?

Some of my own life-long-Dem family members crossed over. And they still like him!
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Come now, CA - you know as well as I do that it's every bit as easy to find those who voted for Trump, who sorely regret doing so now, and who would never do so again. That's the nature of the internet - you can always find someone who thinks as you do, or who thinks the way you believe they should. It's a confirmation-bias tool of epic scale.

That being said, Trump took the word (and apparently continues to take the word) of an ex-KGB colonel in charge of the Kremlin over that of our NSA/FBI/CIA. That in and of itself should have disqualified Trump from ever having any support from any American who remembers what patriotism is.
Click to expand...
Yes, but the topic isn't "right, wrong, or should be". The topic is, "what do Trump's cross-over Dems think of him?".

And from the crossover Dems I know, these guys seem typical. In real life, I can't say I run into former Trump supporters. His supporters will hem & haw, and make excuses, but they still back the guy. And the polls bear this out.
 
Captain Adverse said:
Exactly the point the Democrats missed during the campaign...depending on the noise from the hard core "Blue States" of New York and California while forgetting the "rust belt" which they then lost because they failed to recognize the growing discontent and made no effort to address their needs.
Click to expand...
But it wasn't just this election. The rustbelt has been ignored by both parties for several decades! Many never forgot Clinton being a proponent of NAFTA. And NAFTA came to epitomize everything wrong in this group's economic difficulties. But the the GOP never offered a better choice. Then along came Trump.
 
Chomsky said:
Yes, but the topic isn't "right, wrong, or should be". The topic is, "what do Trump's cross-over Dems think of him?".

And from the crossover Dems I know, these guys seem typical. In real life, I can't say I run into former Trump supporters. His supporters will hem & haw, and make excuses, but they still back the guy. And the polls bear this out.
Click to expand...

That may well be...but the numbers (and the special elections) show not just that the opposition against him is energized, but also that his overall support has lessened...and that decrease in support has to come from somewhere.
 
Being from Ohio, most who voted for Trump are pleased with his first year and some who didn't vote for him have said he has surprised them. Neighboring states like WV, Kentucky MI and PA I get the impression it is the same. Those who worked for coal companies, natural gas, steel workers, etc. all blue collar workers in this part of the country have been called back to work. We all get our utilities from coal and natural gas. This has been a brutal Winter. If the Obama regulations had remained, most folks in these parts would not be able to pay their utility bills because they made them way too costly. It was Trump's administration that slashed all the jobs killing regulations (hidden taxes) on these businesses and in turn made it more affordable for most to heat their homes.

I have also read because of the Trump administration's Tax reform and cutting of regulations has opened up jobs opportunities in the Black communities where today they are now at just over 6% of unemployed. A far cry 12 months ago when Trump took office and the unemployment rate among Blacks was way up there in double digits.

And then another wonderful thing that happened last week was Chrysler is bringing its operations for their best seller the RAM truck from Mexico back to Michigan producing thousands of new jobs.

Because of the Tax reform, more companies will be returning. It isn't just blue collar jobs that benefit but a lot of engineering and high tech jobs as well.

Now when you throw politics into the mix, I think the left is concerned over the number of blue collar and the increase in acceptance in the Black communities of Trump. These people get it. They see him getting government out of the way so they can work and provide for their families. The left is worried. They have done little for the Black community but every election year they were out there trying to buy their votes. Most folks want an opportunity to work for a living, provide for their families. They don't want government handouts as a solution.
 
Chomsky said:
Yes, but the topic isn't "right, wrong, or should be". The topic is, "what do Trump's cross-over Dems think of him?".

And from the crossover Dems I know, these guys seem typical. In real life, I can't say I run into former Trump supporters. His supporters will hem & haw, and make excuses, but they still back the guy. And the polls bear this out.
Click to expand...

Yep. Nobody so far in my mostly conservative family that has voted for Trump has regretted it.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
That may well be...but the numbers (and the special elections) show not just that the opposition against him is energized, but also that his overall support has lessened...and that decrease in support has to come from somewhere.
Click to expand...
Fair point.

But then Trump wasn't on the ballot in those special elections, and his personal appeal (for some) is an important part of the quotient.

I think what we're seeing in those special elections is not a large erosion of Trump supporters, but rather a huge backlash injection of anti-Trump detractors. Many of the last, may not have bothered to come-out in 2016. For instance, the huge black (esp black female) contingent that gave Doug Jones the scrape-by win in Red Alabama.
 
Chomsky said:
Please tell me this post is facetious?

Some of my own life-long-Dem family members crossed over. And they still like him!
Click to expand...
Well, for what it's worth, my family are life-long Republicans, and are pledging to vote Democrat in the next election cycles.

This, in Dallas TX no less, is just an example of how the electoral map has been turned upside down by the alt-right in this country. The old rules and guarantees no longer apply for either party right now, and not a single vote can be taken for granted.
 
TheGoverness said:
Yep. Nobody so far in my mostly conservative family that has voted for Trump has regretted it.
Click to expand...
To be fair we're both in the heart of the GOP voter base (TX), which has never seen a Republican candidate it wouldn't support.

All that said, I have personally heard conservative minded people voice disgust with Trump, and discuss voting Democrat for the first time in their lives.
 
MovingPictures said:
Well, for what it's worth, my family are life-long Republicans, and are pledging to vote Democrat in the next election cycles.

This, in Dallas TX no less, is just an example of how the electoral map has been turned upside down by the alt-right in this country. The old rules and guarantees no longer apply for either party right now, and not a single vote can be taken for granted.
Click to expand...
Well, I do love my family Trumpers. They're otherwise good loving people, who seem to be suffering from a temporary lapse of judgment. But if you're good with it, maybe we could strike a trade? :mrgreen:
 
Chomsky said:
I may have grown-up deep in a large northern city, with Euro immigrant family roots, but it was a blue-collar working-class neighborhood filled with a lot of folk similar to these. Yeah, many of my neighbor's last names ended in "ski", and some had accents & spoke with broken English, but they were the same type of salt-of-the-earth working folk like these. They'd walk or take a bus to the factory or loading docks at 7:00 in the morning, lunch-pail & thermos in hand, and on the way home they'd cash their checks at the corner bar on Fridays. And every one was a Dem. And for many, their union card was the top I.D. in their wallet.

These are exactly the type of people that were the Dem's core base, that I remember. But somehow, the Dems lost their way and ceded them to Trump. And it's going to be extremely hard I think, to get them back. The working-class populist economic message is a powerful one.
Click to expand...
I think you're getting far too caught up in Republican messaging, no offense my friend.

People make the move from one political party for different reasons, many which are have to do with personal beliefs changing along the way. There hasn't been some massive exodus of voters from the Democratic party to the GOP, nor is there some working class populism that is taking the country by storm.

All that's old news. The issue for Democrats is that their voter base just doesn't get out and vote. So many elections have been fumbled that should have been easy for the DNC: 2000, 2004, 2010, 2016, etc.

However, when Democrats get high voter turn outs, they win in landslides that are near impossible for the GOP to beat -- even with a lack of independents.

Our infighting and need to have exactly what we want to get out and vote, is what's costing us election after election. Meanwhile, the GOP and it's voting base happily take the spoils of our foolishness.
 
Chomsky said:
Well, I do love my family Trumpers. They're otherwise good loving people, who seem to be suffering from a temporary lapse of judgment. But if you're good with it, maybe we could strike a trade? :mrgreen:
Click to expand...
You can have my mother!

I'll send you some Xanax for the experience.
 
NeverTrumpGOP said:
No it's quite easy to brainwash Trump supporters. Just ask Russians. Or Trump!

In fact, I'd say that Trump supporters have been way more partisan than even libertarians!
Click to expand...

It appears that AT's have been affected by the Russians than anyone else has.
 
Captain Adverse said:
...And yet for some strange reason CNN in panel after panel seems unable to do so. :roll:

This was another CNN panel, and one would hope that they would have mentioned the parameters to the "random" selection of person's seeking to be on it (without trying to stack the panel by pre-screening specifically for Trump opponents) before selecting them. They always seem so surprised and confused by not being able to find any of those "Trump regretor's" you keep touting.

In fact, it is clear that the panel commentary was edited by CNN to limit the damage, selecting those answers they thought most reflective of all respondents while least problematic for use in the broadcast.

It was the CNN summation...



...I used in the OP.

The rest of your "KGB word over..." is a red herring with nothing to do with the OP. So forgive me if I ignore it.
Click to expand...

Greetings, Captain Adverse. :2wave:

I was quite surprised to hear a panel of everyday ordinary people give Trump such a no-nonsense seal of approval on what he has tried to achieve his first year as POTUS! They apparently believe he intends to keep his campaign promises, and they definitely agree with that and will protect his back come H*** or high water! :thumbs:
 
Captain Adverse said:
I just ran across this video which may be an eye-opener to those who think Trump has lost any support among Democratic crossover voters.



Each issue was raised; Immigration, Racism, Trump Tweets, Trump lies, Economics, Media bias.

"One year later these voters couldn't be happier, they see achievement. Most of all they see a President just like them."

Perhaps this will open the eyes of "resistors" to the reality of what maintains Trump's support among those who voted for him despite all the MSM propaganda efforts to paint his Administration in the worst picture possible.

Maybe not though, it is hard to overcome assumption bias. :coffeepap:
Click to expand...


It's interesting, but it doesn't really say much. The first major, substantial test of the American people's judgment of the Trump presidency will be the 2018 elections, and the cumulative standing of Trump's favorables is already filling in some of that picture. I think it's pretty fair to say that even if he holds onto this particular swath of voters, they make up a minority of the country, let alone the Democratic party.
 
vesper said:
Being from Ohio, most who voted for Trump are pleased with his first year and some who didn't vote for him have said he has surprised them. Neighboring states like WV, Kentucky MI and PA I get the impression it is the same. Those who worked for coal companies, natural gas, steel workers, etc. all blue collar workers in this part of the country have been called back to work. We all get our utilities from coal and natural gas. This has been a brutal Winter. If the Obama regulations had remained, most folks in these parts would not be able to pay their utility bills because they made them way too costly. It was Trump's administration that slashed all the jobs killing regulations (hidden taxes) on these businesses and in turn made it more affordable for most to heat their homes.

I have also read because of the Trump administration's Tax reform and cutting of regulations has opened up jobs opportunities in the Black communities where today they are now at just over 6% of unemployed. A far cry 12 months ago when Trump took office and the unemployment rate among Blacks was way up there in double digits.

And then another wonderful thing that happened last week was Chrysler is bringing its operations for their best seller the RAM truck from Mexico back to Michigan producing thousands of new jobs.

Because of the Tax reform, more companies will be returning. It isn't just blue collar jobs that benefit but a lot of engineering and high tech jobs as well.

Now when you throw politics into the mix, I think the left is concerned over the number of blue collar and the increase in acceptance in the Black communities of Trump. These people get it. They see him getting government out of the way so they can work and provide for their families. The left is worried. They have done little for the Black community but every election year they were out there trying to buy their votes. Most folks want an opportunity to work for a living, provide for their families. They don't want government handouts as a solution.
Click to expand...

Greetings, Vesper. :2wave:

Very well said! :thumbs: What I have been seeing lately, at least in my extended family, is the lack of "die-hard" commitment to the Dem party that seemed to be the rule in the past for everyone over age 45. They aren't changing parties or anything (that I know of), they just haven't bothered to vote in the last couple of elections. One of my brothers - who was named after FDR, believe it or not - said he didn't like either candidate in the last election well enough to vote for them - like we believe he would have ever voted for Trump! :lamo
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom