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Seattle's Minimum Wage Killed the 'Five-Dollar Footlong'

HowardBThiname said:
"Vent about taxes?"

It was about how boosting the minimum wage was hurting their business, and as a result, how they had to pass that expense on to their customers and remove a loss leader. What they're saying is that they're being pinched. It won't be long before we see some doors closing, if there haven't been already. This kind of thing always has a large negative ripple effect.
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Not Yet:

An approximate, back-of-the-napkin tally for noteworthy Seattle restaurants this year: 290 openings, 85 closures.
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https://www.seattletimes.com/life/f...t-lots-more-seattle-area-restaurant-closures/
 
JMR said:
LOL

I had one of my greatest vacations in Seattle. It is beautiful. (No, No, don't believe me...don't even think of moving there!!) Had Starbucks before the rest of the world heard about it, had a salmon thrown at me at Pike's Market, drove through some of the most beautiful places in the country and ate at some incredible restaurants. Yes, you are right, don't move there. :)( missing Seattle)
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Both Seattle and Portland...both very beautiful cities...at least, during that two week period each year when it's not raining.

Oregonians don't tan...they rust.
 
Mycroft said:
Well, I'd consider that a good thing.
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I spent most of the summer in my back yard last year, with my new pup..... spending big money on my back yard years ago turned out to be a great idea.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Hey - it's your loss, since things are going SO terrible that they're looking at starting a foot ferry from Olympia to Colman Dock in Seattle. It's going SO terrible that we've got the hottest (or close to the hottest) real estate market in the nation. It's going SO terrible that real estate is still going up, up, up even all over Kitsap County (since we've got four ferries going (two to Seattle, one to West Seattle, and one to Edmonds)). Whether you like it or not, Seattle's the economic heart of our entire state. Yes, other parts of the state really contribute, but none do so to the point that Seattle does.

BUT for all those who live outside Puget Sound, Washington, it's terrible here - it's all third-world living conditions, soup lines, children working at sweat shops...so don't move here - it's terrible! Listen to ol' Hawkeye10! Don't let anybody make you think otherwise!
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Hopefully Thurston County voters aren’t dumb enough to fall for the “fast ferry” pitch. Has the Kitsap County boat actually been running lately? I seem to get alerts about canceled sailings all the time
 
EMNofSeattle said:
Hopefully Thurston County voters aren’t dumb enough to fall for the “fast ferry” pitch. Has the Kitsap County boat actually been running lately? I seem to get alerts about canceled sailings all the time
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As if the regular ferries do fine.....they are the picture of mismanagement to include the failure to fund:

Washington State Ferries management in San Juans | Guest Column | The Journal of the San Juan Islands


Glenn seems to have no understanding of how bad things are in this state public sector wise, even after finding an Amtrak Cascades Train on 5 not long ago.
 
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Mycroft said:
Both Seattle and Portland...both very beautiful cities...at least, during that two week period each year when it's not raining.

Oregonians don't tan...they rust.
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A few years back, we had a record of something like 88 days with no rain.

Back to the Future!
 
HowardBThiname said:
"Vent about taxes?"

It was about how boosting the minimum wage was hurting their business, and as a result, how they had to pass that expense on to their customers and remove a loss leader. What they're saying is that they're being pinched. It won't be long before we see some doors closing, if there haven't been already. This kind of thing always has a large negative ripple effect.
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Yes, they wrote a note to their customers complaining about all of the taxes. One Subway out of 10 did that. That is the story.
 
99percenter said:
Didn't subway kill the 5 dollar footlong everywhere and start a 6 dollar one?
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JMR said:
You know, you are right on that!

Subway Launches "$6 Footlong Sub of the Day" Deal | Brand Eating



It seems the 5 dollar sub has been out since last February????
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99percenter said:
yep. I found article. Seems like it was a bad idea creating a jingle with a price attached to it.
Subway offering $6 footlong - Business Insider
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Try reading the linked article sometime.
From linked aticle:
You probably remember Subway's famous "five-dollar footlong" promotion as much for the obnoxiously catchy jingle as for the sandwiches themselves. (Sorry for getting that stuck in your head all day.)

The sandwich chain recently resurrected the promotion in a national advertising campaign promising foot-long subs for just $4.99...
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Right there at the very beginning, too. Impossible to miss for anyone intellectually honest enough to pay attention.
 
Kal'Stang said:
I'd forgotten about the minimum wage there being set to $15/hr...combine that with that sugar tax that they just initiated....what business is going to want to stay there?
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A post on the actual thread topic. What a concept!

To me the story is only partly about the wage level itself. The primary focus of the story is about how this Subway franchisee (and Costco, apparently, re the sugar tax) are fighting back by simply reminding customers and shining the light of day on exactly *why* prices are going so high. If I were one of them I would also include on my sign who it was passed by and the names and mailing addresses and work phone numbers of those elected representatives responsible, and encourage people to write or call with their approval/disapproval.
 
I think it will be interesting to see if the other 9 (if accurate) sub shops do the same, as the one in the article. Otherwise, perhaps all we have is a squeaky wheel here, pissed-off that they have to pay the Seattle minimum wage.

But I think the bigger concept missed here, is that in a country as economically diverse as ours, how can one price or one wage fit all? What the market will bear in wages, services, and products, will likely not be the same in Appalachia, as in Mid-town Manhattan. Will it?

I live in one of the higher taxed and cost-of-living areas of the country. I'm extremely happy with my local (village) government, though I admit there's much about the higher-level state government that could be better in terms of cost-effectiveness. But while the taxes, property values and wages aren't cheap, I feel the quality-of-life is excellent; and for that, I'm willing to pay.

I see it as "you get what you pay for". If you want to live in a nice area with good schools and quality of life for your family, it's going to cost you. Not everybody wants that, and that's fine, I can respect that. As long as they respect that some of us feel otherwise, and we vote with our feet & dollars, just as the should.
 
Crovax said:
What are you talking about. Subway used to be cheap but they raised their prices and got a toaster to compete with Quiznos. Subway was way overpriced, $5 foot longs was a way for them to actually keep regular customers.
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And their people aren't that bright. If I wanted my sandwiches toasted, I'd go to Quiznos. Every time I walk into a Subway, I have to explain very slowly, using very small words, that I don't want my sandwich toasted, I just want the meat warmed up. They seem to have a problem with that.
 
Kal'Stang said:
I'd forgotten about the minimum wage there being set to $15/hr...combine that with that sugar tax that they just initiated....what business is going to want to stay there?
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Those small-businesses that want to profit off the high-wage consumer-base in the area, and are willing to price their products commensurate with the market.

If your logic held through, there'd be no businesses in L.A., San Fran, NYC, Chicago, or other high-tax high-wage areas. But that's not true, and we know businesses thrive there, and some make their owners very wealthy. If you're in a brick & mortar business for yourself, you go where the money's at. It's that simple.
 
radcen said:
A post on the actual thread topic. What a concept!

To me the story is only partly about the wage level itself. The primary focus of the story is about how this Subway franchisee (and Costco, apparently, re the sugar tax) are fighting back by simply reminding customers and shining the light of day on exactly *why* prices are going so high. If I were one of them I would also include on my sign who it was passed by and the names and mailing addresses and work phone numbers of those elected representatives responsible, and encourage people to write or call with their approval/disapproval.
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Before you do that though, you'd better know your customer base very well. Because you will alienate any working stiffs who depend upon the minimum wage, along with other customers that feel a social obligation to support the minimum wage.

The political winds do not blow the same, everywhere in the country. That's how the $15 minimum wage in those localities came about, in the first place.
 
Chomsky said:
Before you do that though, you'd better know your customer base very well. Because you will alienate any working stiffs who depend upon the minimum wage, along with other customers that feel a social obligation to support the minimum wage.

The political winds do not blow the same, everywhere in the country. That's how the $15 minimum wage in those localities came about, in the first place.
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Actually, I would fear backlash from the local government more. Sudden increase in inspections, sudden 'to the letter' compliance expectations, and so on.
 
Chomsky said:
Those small-businesses that want to profit off the high-wage consumer-base in the area, and are willing to price their products commensurate with the market.

If your logic held through, there'd be no businesses in L.A., San Fran, NYC, Chicago, or other high-tax high-wage areas. But that's not true, and we know businesses thrive there, and some make their owners very wealthy. If you're in a brick & mortar business for yourself, you go where the money's at. It's that simple.
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I don't know of any other cities that has a a 15 dollar minimum wage along with a sugar tax that takes a 16 dollar case of Gatorade and raises it to a 26 dollar product. Do you?
 
radcen said:
Actually, I would fear backlash from the local government more. Sudden increase in inspections, sudden 'to the letter' compliance expectations, and so on.
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Well then, it seems you're claiming you know the customer base well.
 
Chomsky said:
I think it will be interesting to see if the other 9 (if accurate) sub shops do the same, as the one in the article. Otherwise, perhaps all we have is a squeaky wheel here, pissed-off that they have to pay the Seattle minimum wage.

But I think the bigger concept missed here, is that in a country as economically diverse as ours, how can one price or one wage fit all? What the market will bear in wages, services, and products, will likely not be the same in Appalachia, as in Mid-town Manhattan. Will it?

I live in one of the higher taxed and cost-of-living areas of the country. I'm extremely happy with my local (village) government, though I admit there's much about the higher-level state government that could be better in terms of cost-effectiveness. But while the taxes, property values and wages aren't cheap, I feel the quality-of-life is excellent; and for that, I'm willing to pay.

I see it as "you get what you pay for". If you want to live in a nice area with good schools and quality of life for your family, it's going to cost you. Not everybody wants that, and that's fine, I can respect that. As long as they respect that some of us feel otherwise, and we vote with our feet & dollars, just as the should.
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Chomsky said:
Those small-businesses that want to profit off the high-wage consumer-base in the area, and are willing to price their products commensurate with the market.

If your logic held through, there'd be no businesses in L.A., San Fran, NYC, Chicago, or other high-tax high-wage areas. But that's not true, and we know businesses thrive there, and some make their owners very wealthy. If you're in a brick & mortar business for yourself, you go where the money's at. It's that simple.
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States are allowed to add onto the national minimum, so that aspect is taken care of. There needs to be some sort of level playing field locally. *Most* states would be fine with a single MW, and I believe that most states should have a consistent wage throughout the entire state. Any differences between places like a state capital and an outlying area would be minimal. There would be some exceptions. Take California, for example: SF and LA should not be expected to be as low as Alturas. That would be unreasonable. On the other hand, SF and LA should not be allowed to raise the MW individually, it should be regional. (It could get complicated, yes, but it's already complicated.)
 
Kal'Stang said:
I don't know of any other cities that has a a 15 dollar minimum wage along with a sugar tax that takes a 16 dollar case of Gatorade and raises it to a 26 dollar product. Do you?
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Only the loony liberals could achieve such stupidity.
 
JMR said:
This is maybe the fourth thread I've seen today opening with a story from Reason.com...

Anyway, why should people expect a $4.99 foot long sandwich? It's a giveaway for Subway trying to compete with McDonalds. Now they have a reason to say they aren't going to do it anymore. But McDonalds has to raise their minimum wage also. So cost of BicMac on the rise! Maybe people will feel bad? Maybe people will be mad at those horrible employees who got a raise? Maybe people will pack their own lunch? Tune in...this isn't over yet.
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The McDonald’s by my house (California) has put in self ordering kiosks. You walk in, punch in your combo or whatever and pay with your CC and off you go. After all, Miss Muffet does the same thing when you give her your order. If you do it yourself it saves wages.
 
Chomsky said:
Well then, it seems you're claiming you know the customer base well.
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One cannot speak blindly. It would depend on *knowing* one's customer base, and the law in question. Anti-smoking laws in a bar would probably be a no-brainer, for example. I'd bet that most customers are smokers, or at least sympathetic to smokers.

Also, even with an issue like MW, many people support the concept... until it hits them directly. If the comments I have read at random are any indicator, many people are idealists and are of the impression that the business will simply absorb the cost because they're obscenely wealthy and can.
 
Cephus said:
Only the loony liberals could achieve such stupidity.
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Sad part is that now they are trying to get it instituted statewide because they know that it will never be sustainable unless it covers an area larger than Seattle. (sugar tax that is)
 
Kal'Stang said:
Sad part is that now they are trying to get it instituted statewide because they know that it will never be sustainable unless it covers an area larger than Seattle. (sugar tax that is)
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Of course. Hopefully they fail, but with the loony liberal northwest, you never know.
 
Kal'Stang said:
I don't know of any other cities that has a a 15 dollar minimum wage along with a sugar tax that takes a 16 dollar case of Gatorade and raises it to a 26 dollar product. Do you?
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You're not going to address the general concept put forth in my post, are you? Rather than trying to promote Seattle as some rare exception?

Seattle isn't the only place with high wages and high taxes, where small businesses flourish. It occurs across the country, and I gave you plenty of examples. And those examples are the antithesis of the dying and shuttering towns across America, regardless of their often dirt-cheap labor, minimal property & lease values, and low tax structures.

I'll repeat it again: In small businesses that sell goods and services through brick-and-mortar locations, you go to where the money is, and price your product commensurate with the local market. Why are you fighting this? If your theory was true, there'd be no hot-dog carts or dry-cleaners in Manhattan, yet we see many thrive! :doh
 
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