America, I apologize for the South's hypocrisy

As a native Southerner, I'd like to apologize to the rest of the country. My region repeatedly claims that we place God above all else, but our actions tell a different story, especially when we mix religion, politics and the mistreatment of women and girls. We have politicians who feel no compunction, even, misusing the story of a sacred virgin birth to ignore child molestation.

America, I apologize for the South's hypocrisy (opinion) - CNN

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Amen,

Are there any other Southerners ready to fall on their sword and throw out a mea culpa.

calamity said:

Amen,

Are there any other Southerners ready to fall on their sword and throw out a mea culpa.

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Raised in the MS Delta, and I do apologize for the racism, the tribalism, and the willful ignorance of my family there. All that, btw, is why I'll never live there again.

So the guy is guilty then?

I have enough of my own sins to answer for...thanks goodness God doesn't ask me to answer for others...

celticwar17 said:

So the guy is guilty then?

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He could be proven beyond any doubt to be innocent, not merely not guilty - innocent.

And it's still seriously ****ed up to compare child molestation with Joseph and the virgin Mary.

Glen Contrarian said:

Raised in the MS Delta, and I do apologize for the racism, the tribalism, and the willful ignorance of my family there. All that, btw, is why I'll never live there again.

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Oh please.... look no farther than the democrat party for the tribalism and racism... whom literally ask White guys to not apply for their positions, because they have too many. Whom constantly endorse social groups defined by their race and ethnicity... whom claim that culture is not something that is shared equally by every human being on earth, but something that can be claimed and regulated by a certain race of which owns it.

I've lived in the South my entire life, and I've only met 1 racist white family.... in my entire life, ONE... and they were more your Malcolm X kind of racists, whom were friends with another black family which also agreed it's better for the race's to be "separate but equal". I actually had a 2 hour long debate with them on how I thought their views were wrong.... and it was quite civil.

Other than that, I simply never met someone outright racist. I've actually never heard a white person say the word nigger as an insult... I've had black people in my life, my entire life. And have seen many black college students with the confederate flag in their own living room...

Glen Contrarian said:

Raised in the MS Delta, and I do apologize for the racism, the tribalism, and the willful ignorance of my family there. All that, btw, is why I'll never live there again.

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I lived in the South for 10 years. The first two years were a culture shock. The next eight I spent hoping more Yanks would move down there to normalize the place. Unfortunately, most of the Yanks I met who did move down there chose to be more like Romans in Rome than Barbarians at the gate.

celticwar17 said:

Oh please.... look no farther than the democrat party for the tribalism and racism... whom literally ask White guys to not apply for their positions, because they have too many. Whom constantly endorse social groups defined by their race and ethnicity... whom claim that culture is not something that is shared equally by every human being on earth, but something that can be claimed and regulated by a certain race of which owns it.

I've lived in the South my entire life, and I've only met 1 racist white family.... in my entire life, ONE... and they were more your Malcolm X kind of racists, whom were friends with another black family which also agreed it's better for the race's to be "separate but equal". I actually had a 2 hour long debate with them on how I thought their views were wrong.... and it was quite civil.

Other than that, I simply never met someone outright racist. I've actually never heard a white person say the word nigger as an insult... I've had black people in my life, my entire life. And have seen many black college students with the confederate flag in their own living room...

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I live in Chicago. I’ve met more than just a few here. I have lots of family in Kentucky. Don’t know any there. Racism and all that goes with it isn’t, by any means, seen only in the south. And just sayin... blue collar affirmative action did more to hurt race relations in the north than anything else in our history.

calamity said:

I lived in the South for 10 years. The first two years were a culture shock. The next eight I spent hoping more Yanks would move down there to normalize the place. Unfortunately, most of the Yanks I met who did move down there chose to be more like Romans in Rome than Barbarians at the gate.

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Yeah, and we spend our time hoping they won't...:lol:

MaggieD said:

I live in Chicago. I’ve met more than just a few here. I have lots of family in Kentucky. Don’t know any there. Racism and all that goes with it isn’t, by any means, seen only in the south. And just sayin... blue collar affirmative action did more to hurt race relations in the north than anything else in our history.

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Other than some experiences I've had with some black people, The most often racist people I've heard/known were Asian parents of chinese/korean friends xD A lot of them are quite cautious of whom their children can date.

A Korean girl whom was a friend of mine actually was disowned from her family for dating a black guy. She was in the middle of college, and completely disowned, they dropped all contact and financial aid, permanently...

For two decades a photo portrait of W.T. Sherman graced my office wall. I'm aware of the sins of the South. Nonetheless it seems somehow too easy to strike a pose using animus toward the South to promote a political agenda. I'd rather we stood for ourselves rather than against each other.

celticwar17 said:

Other than some experiences I've had with some black people, The most often racist people I've heard/known were Asian parents of chinese/korean friends xD A lot of them are quite cautious of whom their children can date.

A Korean girl whom was a friend of mine actually was disowned from her family for dating a black guy. She was in the middle of college, and completely disowned, they dropped all contact and financial aid, permanently...

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It is definitely an equal opportunity attitude. And it exists in varying degrees and forms everywhere I have lived in the US.

Jack Hays said:

For two decades a photo portrait of W.T. Sherman graced my office wall. I'm aware of the sins of the South. Nonetheless it seems somehow too easy to strike a pose using animus toward the South to promote a political agenda. I'd rather we stood for ourselves rather than against each other.

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We are standing for ourselves, The Constitution and American values when we reject the glorification of those who left the US and killed Americans to preserve slavery. We will no more honor them than any other foreign murderers killing Americans for tyranny, like ISIS.

celticwar17 said:

Other than some experiences I've had with some black people, The most often racist people I've heard/known were Asian parents of chinese/korean friends xD A lot of them are quite cautious of whom their children can date.

A Korean girl whom was a friend of mine actually was disowned from her family for dating a black guy. She was in the middle of college, and completely disowned, they dropped all contact and financial aid, permanently...

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Koreans are the worst I have found, by a lot, they stick close together and while they will gladly work and take money from the rest they have no interest in the melting pot idea.....off time is spending time with other Koreans time.

One time I was allowed to eat my break meal with the Korean KP's at my chow hall (all of them were Korean almost), it was a rare honor.

Hawkeye10 said:

Koreans are the worst I have found, by a lot, they stick close together and while they will gladly work and take money from the rest they have no interest in the melting pot idea.....off time is spending time with other Koreans time.

One time I was allowed to eat my break meal with the Korean KP's at my chow hall (all of them were Korean almost), it was a rare honor.

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I never worked with Koreans, but I spent several years working alongside the Japanese. With them, even when you're right about something, often, they won't acknowledge your value. But, they aren't quite as bad as the Germans. With them, you're wrong, even when you are right.

ecofarm said:

He could be proven beyond any doubt to be innocent, not merely not guilty - innocent.

And it's still seriously ****ed up to compare child molestation with Joseph and the virgin Mary.

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Who is accused of child molestation?

calamity said:

Amen,

Are there any other Southerners ready to fall on their sword and throw out a mea culpa.

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I really don't know anything about this Roy Moore or the author of this article Issac Bailey. I don't think I care enough about Roy Moore to find out more about him.

I'm also not from the South and I'm not sure if there is some deeper cultural connotation behind "Southern churches" use of the phrase "spiritual warfare" when they use it, as the author of this article seems to indicate:

That's right. A man in a high-profile political race representing the supposed "family values" party, after being named in an eye-popping report alleging that when he was a 32-year-old man he tried to have a sexual relationship with a 14-year-old girl, not only did not drop out of the race or hide in shame, he doubled down. Moore denied the allegations and evoked the term "spiritual warfare," which is well known in Southern Christian churches, black and white, to elicit as much sympathy from the faithful as possible.

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If Roy Moore was married then he was trying to commit adultery. If he was married (and assuming the 14 year-old was not married, which I doubt she was). Adultery is a sin--not a secular crime. If neither were married then Roy Moore was guilty of trying to have premarital sex. Another sin. One which I'm guilty of. Via drug addiction/drug use I have committed adultery too, with a married person or persons. And I'm as sexually sinful as the best of them when ever drugs (use) are put in the picture or the seeking of after money is gone.

I think I had on TV news in passing, that this thing (accusation or charge) with Roy Moore trying to seduce a 14 year-old girl took place in the 1970s. If that is the case while the age difference would have been a bit taboo in 1970s USA it would have been something that seemed shocking. You take in the North in 1980s Milwaukee when Milwaukee had the highest black teenage pregnancy rate in the country. Local medical or health reports showed that most (as in over 50%) the teenage black girls were getting impregnated by young adult men (usually Black-American men). I think--if I remember correctly--most the men were in their 20s or maybe even some in their 30s. A 24 year-old and and a 16 or 17 year-old is not as big an age and emotional maturity gap as a 32 year-old from a 14 year-old though. Nonetheless, young men have often been known to try to seduce teenage girls.

In the 1990s I used to see cars (usually drug dealers by the look of it) of young Black-American men clearly in their 20s parked along Washington High School as school got out, trying to seduce young black teenage girls. This was the North and not the South. And these were fully secular people.

Back to differences in era... I think my black grandmother (from the South) got married when she was still a teen. And I think a young teen. Like age 15 is popping in my head. I think my grandfather--her husband--was in his 20s. I think. I don't recall for certain. But I think this is what I heard. They both are deceased now but back in the era of their youth I don't think that was all that uncommon back then. At least not unheard of.

I don't buy this "child abuse" stuff about willing 14 year-old kids. Actually, I think in Brazil, some expats or a sociologist online I think said this, that a 30 or 40 year-old man courting or dating a 14 year-old is a bit taboo but so long as the man gets the permission of the girl's parents, its not seen as this high crime and crazy sexual abuse as Americans today now imagine it in their minds to be.

Frankly, there is nothing, nada, zilch, immoral about a 14 year-old girl and 30 something old man marrying each other. Gay marriage is always immoral according to orthodox Christian teachings (not my teachings--one does not like it they can take it up with the Ultimate Boss in the heavens, I did not make the rules, I'm subject to the rules and prosecution both on earth and in heaven).

That said... usually, not always though, an older man can manipulate a young teenage girl because she is usually less emotionally mature than him. But there are some pretty manipulative teens that can become seducers and take advantage of lonely adults. Be the adult a man or a female high school teacher.

He says many conservative Christians pledge allegiance more to the GOP than to the church

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I agree with this.

But Christian Americans that are Democrats do the same thing with their political party.

Mason66 said:

Who is accused of child molestation?

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He is. But if you prefer "sex with a minor", that also should not be compared to Joseph and the virgin Mary. By a Christian no less.

ecofarm said:

He is. But if you prefer "sex with a minor", that also should not be compared to Joseph and the virgin Mary. By a Christian no less.

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When was he accused of having sex with a minor?

Mason66 said:

When was he accused of having sex with a minor?

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Well, he "can't remember" if he dated HS students in this 30s. You can call it "having a loving relationship with a minor" if you want. The comparison is nonetheless ludicrous and was made with the presumption of inappropriate sexual contact with a 14 year old.

If you dated HS students in your 30s, you'd remember, right?

calamity said:

I lived in the South for 10 years. The first two years were a culture shock. The next eight I spent hoping more Yanks would move down there to normalize the place. Unfortunately, most of the Yanks I met who did move down there chose to be more like Romans in Rome than Barbarians at the gate.

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I liked certain aspects of the South. Like I've said in the past... I used to enjoy going on the college campus of Hampton University. Beautiful campus too. I had never seen anything like that in the Black-American world. I felt like I was getting a taste of a movie, like Spike Lee's School Daze. It was new (to me) and it was beautiful.

I know black Southerners from Georgia and some other Southern cities would tell us black guys from the North that Virginia is not the South. But to most of from the North it was Southern.

Some things I dodn't care for about the South. I found the black from there to be far (not a little) more "color struck" than Northern black men. A lot of those Southern black people took that light skin vs dark skin very seriously. At least more serious than we usually do in the North.

I've never been to Mississippi so I don't know about that. I hear some parts of that state are really stuck in a long gone era. I've briefly been North Carolina, Tennessee, and Florida. Northern Florida had the biggest damn (and some small town in Georgia I drove through) Confederate Rebel Flags I've ever seen flying from poles. Mid Florida or there about... would not fit in well with a lot of Southern stereotypes. You have a lot of Latinos down there. Like the young Peruvian woman I met with dark brown-red, sweaty, cleavage showing in all its glory. And she acting in a manner--to me--like she was coming down off of cocaine and craving more. That was my impression at least. Maybe it was just the Florida sun and my million dollar smile that was making her act that way.

calamity said:

I never worked with Koreans, but I spent several years working alongside the Japanese. With them, even when you're right about something, often, they won't acknowledge your value. But, they aren't quite as bad as the Germans. With them, you're wrong, even when you are right.

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I feel like I am in a glorious time warp jsyk, we are not supposed to talk like this anymore.

Shant be too long before its a crime I spect.

Free speech and free minds are yesterday.

Conformity is where it's at today.

With chains if need be.

BOO!

celticwar17 said:

Oh please.... look no farther than the democrat party for the tribalism and racism... whom literally ask White guys to not apply for their positions, because they have too many. Whom constantly endorse social groups defined by their race and ethnicity... whom claim that culture is not something that is shared equally by every human being on earth, but something that can be claimed and regulated by a certain race of which owns it.

I've lived in the South my entire life, and I've only met 1 racist white family.... in my entire life, ONE... and they were more your Malcolm X kind of racists, whom were friends with another black family which also agreed it's better for the race's to be "separate but equal". I actually had a 2 hour long debate with them on how I thought their views were wrong.... and it was quite civil.

Other than that, I simply never met someone outright racist. I've actually never heard a white person say the word nigger as an insult... I've had black people in my life, my entire life. And have seen many black college students with the confederate flag in their own living room...

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Yeah, I can't say who you know or don't, or who you've "met" but 1) there are racists everywhere, and 2) the South has at least its fair share of them. During my lifetime Jim Crow was the law of the land all across the South and to believe the casual and widespread racist attitudes at the heart of Jim Crow are near dead here is just delusional. You're not doing the South or the people here any good by advancing story lines that we know are just false. Whether you've "met" racists or not, they're common in our region.

And I've heard "nigger" as an insult or just a casual reference to blacks in general 1,000 times, easy, and I've lived in TN, GA, NC, and VA - heard it at every stop. My wife had an interview in MS and our HOST on a drive around town used that word in casual conversation to refer to a black neighborhood. We were struck speechless by it - still shocked by it years later

I will say I get tired of the stereotype of Southerners as all a bunch of backwards, racist white trash. Those people exist, but they're the exception and there are an awful lot of really good people in this region. I'm proud of the region's progress in recent decades but we have to be honest about ourselves and this region to keep that up.

FWIW, for me to believe "many" blacks have the Confederate flag in their living room will need pics unless those flags have something to do with some kind of football team - HS or college. I'm 54 and I've never seen a black person outside a football player (for a nearby HS) sporting the Confederate flag on anything - car, shirt, house, belt buckle, bandana, etc.

JasperL said:

Yeah, I can't say who you know or don't, or who you've "met" but 1) there are racists everywhere, and 2) the South has at least its fair share of them. During my lifetime Jim Crow was the law of the land all across the South and to believe the casual and widespread racist attitudes at the heart of Jim Crow are near dead here is just delusional. You're not doing the South or the people here any good by advancing story lines that we know are just false. Whether you've "met" racists or not, they're common in our region.

And I've heard "nigger" as an insult or just a casual reference to blacks in general 1,000 times, easy, and I've lived in TN, GA, NC, and VA - heard it at every stop. My wife had an interview in MS and our HOST on a drive around town used that word in casual conversation to refer to a black neighborhood. We were struck speechless by it - still shocked by it years later

I will say I get tired of the stereotype of Southerners as all a bunch of backwards, racist white trash. Those people exist, but they're the exception and there are an awful lot of really good people in this region. I'm proud of the region's progress in recent decades but we have to be honest about ourselves and this region to keep that up.

FWIW, for me to believe "many" blacks have the Confederate flag in their living room will need pics unless those flags have something to do with some kind of football team - HS or college. I'm 54 and I've never seen a black person outside a football player (for a nearby HS) sporting the Confederate flag on anything - car, shirt, house, belt buckle, bandana, etc.

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I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that the specific term you heard on that drive in MS was 'nigger-town', or some variant of it.

And you're right about calling bull****. I've grew up in a mixed area, have known black people my entire life, from homeless to doctors to naval officers to you-name-it, and w/out exception, they wouldn't own, display or tolerate a confederate flag under any, and I mean ANY circumstances.

JasperL said:

Yeah, I can't say who you know or don't, or who you've "met" but 1) there are racists everywhere, and 2) the South has at least its fair share of them. During my lifetime Jim Crow was the law of the land all across the South and to believe the casual and widespread racist attitudes at the heart of Jim Crow are near dead here is just delusional. You're not doing the South or the people here any good by advancing story lines that we know are just false. Whether you've "met" racists or not, they're common in our region.

And I've heard "nigger" as an insult or just a casual reference to blacks in general 1,000 times, easy, and I've lived in TN, GA, NC, and VA - heard it at every stop. My wife had an interview in MS and our HOST on a drive around town used that word in casual conversation to refer to a black neighborhood. We were struck speechless by it - still shocked by it years later

I will say I get tired of the stereotype of Southerners as all a bunch of backwards, racist white trash. Those people exist, but they're the exception and there are an awful lot of really good people in this region. I'm proud of the region's progress in recent decades but we have to be honest about ourselves and this region to keep that up.

FWIW, for me to believe "many" blacks have the Confederate flag in their living room will need pics unless those flags have something to do with some kind of football team - HS or college. I'm 54 and I've never seen a black person outside a football player (for a nearby HS) sporting the Confederate flag on anything - car, shirt, house, belt buckle, bandana, etc.

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From all the studies I've seen that have tried to determine the most racist places by geographical area, It typically shows that the midwest is the most racist geographical area.

I'm not going to give you pictures of friends xD but I've seen it MANY TIMES... typically in a house where both black and white people stay, but i've seen it in a dwelling with just black people living there too.I wouldn't say it's common, but I;ve definitely seen multiple times. And if you want to see some, just google it.... You said you are 54, I'm talking about college students.

I typically hang out with people my age or younger(I'm 27), and those I do meet which are older.... never seen a single one. I've never heard a white person make openly racist comments unless on Youtube or news articles or something(accept the one example I mentioned before). I've heard things like, "there is a lot of crime in the black community"... but that's the extent of it. And i've lived in some of the most southern places amongst the most southern people.

My last year of college I was in a house with 4 other guys(I didn't know any of them, they all knew each other and grew up in northern-ish Georgia, where all the chickens are).... one of them was black and was the best friend of one of them. They set up a huge confederate flag in our living room with a stuffed bobcat. And half the time the people who were hanging out there were like 6+ black guys from their home town.


My point is not to say there is no racist people in the south, or that racism isn't an issue at all... but I find it to be WAAAYYY overblown to the point where people are now being dramatic....

We don't need any aid or encouragement to "keep it up"... the entire united states is bombarded with Anti-racism talk 24/7 in every facet of our society...Most minorities in this country have experienced little no racism their entire lives(and that is self reported!)