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Las Vegas Massacre

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LunaRose

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The largest mass shooting in our country took place last night in Las Vegas at the Jason Aldean concert. A 64 year old white male kills 50 people and injures another 400. This brings up two talking points off the top of my head.

1) This incident dwarfs the Ariana Grande bombing massacre. White men are responsible for 64% of the mass shootings in this country, out of the 10 largest mass shootings 5 are white males, and now a white male is responsible for the largest mass shooting in the U.S. to date... Should we feel threatened by white males in this country because of it? Do you think innocent white males will be troubled or persecuted today because of what happened last night?

2) Gun Laws... Should a non military civilian be allowed to carry multiple automatic assault weapons? How did he obtain them? And should there be stricter laws on obtaining a gun?
 
LunaRose said:
1) This incident dwarfs the Ariana Grande bombing massacre. White men are responsible for 64% of the mass shootings in this country, out of the 10 largest mass shootings 5 are white males, and now a white male is responsible for the largest mass shooting in the U.S. to date... Should we feel threatened by white males in this country because of it? Do you think innocent white males will be troubled or persecuted today because of what happened last night?
Click to expand...

Just because there have been many mass shootings committed by white males, doesn't mean that people should be scared of all white men. That's ridiculous.

That's like saying because one radical Muslim decides to run over people with a truck, we should be scared of all Muslims.
 
LunaRose said:
2) Gun Laws... Should a non military civilian be allowed to carry multiple automatic assault weapons? How did he obtain them? And should there be stricter laws on obtaining a gun?
Click to expand...

People already cannot own automatic assault weapons. They are illegal.
 
TheGoverness said:
Just because there have been many mass shootings committed by white males, doesn't mean that people should be scared of all white men. That's ridiculous.

That's like saying because one radical Muslim decides to run over people with a truck, we should be scared of all Muslims.
Click to expand...

Re Bold Section

I expect that is her point. Had this been done by a muslim for whatever reason, there would be people wanting to ban muslims, deport them all etc in the US, saying they can not be trusted etc.
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Re Bold Section

I expect that is her point. Had this been done by a muslim for whatever reason, there would be people wanting to ban muslims, deport them all etc in the US, saying they can not be trusted etc.
Click to expand...

Of course there would be; that always happens when a Muslim commits an act like this. But it is a ridiculous argument.
 
LunaRose said:
The largest mass shooting in our country took place last night in Las Vegas at the Jason Aldean concert. A 64 year old white male kills 50 people and injures another 400. This brings up two talking points off the top of my head.

1) This incident dwarfs the Ariana Grande bombing massacre. White men are responsible for 64% of the mass shootings in this country, out of the 10 largest mass shootings 5 are white males, and now a white male is responsible for the largest mass shooting in the U.S. to date... Should we feel threatened by white males in this country because of it? Do you think innocent white males will be troubled or persecuted today because of what happened last night?

2) Gun Laws... Should a non military civilian be allowed to carry multiple automatic assault weapons? How did he obtain them? And should there be stricter laws on obtaining a gun?
Click to expand...

It sounds like white men are less likely to engage in mass shootings when compared to their presence in society. Buying an automatic weapon in the U.S. legally is difficult. It requires a federal license for which the holder must pay a fee and undergo inspections. I think the fee renews annually. It is probably more likely that the shooter bought it illegally or had it adapted (illegally) for select fire. We don't know how he obtained it or them. The laws are incredibly strict. Every law that doesn't fly in the face of the second amendment has been passed. Laws wouldn't have prevented this. This was an act of evil and evil people do evil things.
 
TheGoverness said:
Of course there would be; that always happens when a Muslim commits an act like this. But it is a ridiculous argument.
Click to expand...

There is potentially a big difference between the two scenarios. Islam is a political movement with a religious bent.
So to be comparable we'd have to understand the religious-political bent of this shooter to get apples to apples.

Folks are mostly in knee-jerk mode right now. I'm waiting to hear what is behind all this. Could be as simple as a psycho wanting to make a name.

Is a white psycho more deadly than a black or brown psycho. Well, statistically / historically, maybe today. But in general, the potential should be about even.
The more important question for the U.S. is what is wrong with our culture that breeds this madness?
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Re Bold Section

I expect that is her point. Had this been done by a muslim for whatever reason, there would be people wanting to ban muslims, deport them all etc in the US, saying they can not be trusted etc.
Click to expand...

Why, was he killing people out of a belief in a White God?

You guys should really stop recycling this nonsense time after time after time without actually thinking about it.
 
TheGoverness said:
Just because there have been many mass shootings committed by white males, doesn't mean that people should be scared of all white men. That's ridiculous.

That's like saying because one radical Muslim decides to run over people with a truck, we should be scared of all Muslims.
Click to expand...

Which, in case you missed it, is what a ton of people, including those on this board, keep claiming.
 
TheGoverness said:
People already cannot own automatic assault weapons. They are illegal.
Click to expand...

Not entirely accurate, if you have the money you can. It is ridiculously expensive so for the average person it is illegal.
 
Nap said:
Technically, you can it is just heavily regulated and is extremely expensive. It would be more accurate to say it is illegal for the average citizen.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I meant illegal for people without..

that thread says a Class III license. I don't know. I'm a gun amateur.
 
Winston said:
Yeah, I meant illegal for people without..

that thread says a Class III license. I don't know. I'm a gun amateur.
Click to expand...

For a class 3 license you typically have to be a gun dealer.

The other way is finding a gun made before 1986.

Turtle has more knowledge on it if you are curious of the potential avenues of acquiring one, I don't have that kind of money so never bothered finding out the details.
 
LunaRose said:
The largest mass shooting in our country took place last night in Las Vegas at the Jason Aldean concert. A 64 year old white male kills 50 people and injures another 400. This brings up two talking points off the top of my head.

1) This incident dwarfs the Ariana Grande bombing massacre. White men are responsible for 64% of the mass shootings in this country, out of the 10 largest mass shootings 5 are white males, and now a white male is responsible for the largest mass shooting in the U.S. to date... Should we feel threatened by white males in this country because of it? Do you think innocent white males will be troubled or persecuted today because of what happened last night?

2) Gun Laws... Should a non military civilian be allowed to carry multiple automatic assault weapons? How did he obtain them? And should there be stricter laws on obtaining a gun?
Click to expand...

5/10 should be exactly what you get...it should actually be around 6/10 being white males... They aren't meeting their mass murder quota... because white people are like 60% of the population.
 
TheGoverness said:
Of course there would be; that always happens when a Muslim commits an act like this. But it is a ridiculous argument.
Click to expand...

I think she was simply pointing out the ridiculousness of the argument.
 
celticwar17 said:
5/10 should be exactly what you get...it should actually be around 6/10 being white males... They aren't meeting their mass murder quota... because white people are like 60% of the population.
Click to expand...

The white people who are 60% of the population are not all males. About half are female and an unknown percentage are male children who are too small to handle the equipment necessary for mass murder. White males are indeed outperforming other groups in this activity.
 
TheGoverness said:
Just because there have been many mass shootings committed by white males, doesn't mean that people should be scared of all white men. That's ridiculous.

That's like saying because one radical Muslim decides to run over people with a truck, we should be scared of all Muslims.
Click to expand...

You’re screwing up the narrative. Stop the rational thought and jump on the emotional bandwagon.
 
bearpoker said:
The white people who are 60% of the population are not all males. About half are female and an unknown percentage are male children who are too small to handle the equipment necessary for mass murder. White males are indeed outperforming other groups in this activity.
Click to expand...

Males commit the vast amount of violence in any group, especially mass murder. It would still be around 60% to be expected.

If you want to make a case that males are more violent and dangerous than females... I will probably agree with you.

Now, when you get Islamic terrorists in the united states. They compose of less than 1 percent of the population... and even less than that if you are talking about immigrants who practice islam.

so if even 1, 2, or 3 commit an event of mass murder IT COMPLETELY skews the proportion data against them. Statistically only less than 1/100 mass murders should be committed by an Muslim and 6/10 should be committed by a white person, or even 8/10 should be committed by a christian. when you have a member of islam committing 2-3 attacks, it makes members from that ethnic group 30X more dangerous statistically than any other.

This... is math

And As you correctly pointed males are vastly more dangerous than females statistically.
 
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celticwar17 said:
Males commit the vast amount of violence in any group, especially mass murder. It would still be around 60% to be expected.

If you want to make a case that males are more violent and dangerous than females... I will probably agree with you.

Now, when you get Islamic terrorists in the united states. They compose of less than 1 percent of the population... and even less than that if you are talking about immigrants who practice islam.

so if even 1, 2, or 3 commit an event of mass murder IT COMPLETELY skews the proportion data against them. Statistically only less than 1/100 mass murders should be committed by an Muslim and 6/10 should be committed by a white person, or even 8/10 should be committed by a christian. when you have a member of islam committing 2-3 attacks, it makes members from that ethnic group 30X more dangerous statistically than any other.

This... is math

And As you correctly pointed males are vastly more dangerous than females statistically.
Click to expand...

That's true but it was not the point of my post. You said that white males were under performing because 60% of the population is white, so six out of ten mass murderers should be white males. In fact white males are less than 30% of the population so they are more that twice as likely to commit mass murder than the population as a whole.
 
bearpoker said:
That's true but it was not the point of my post. You said that white males were under performing because 60% of the population is white, so six out of ten mass murderers should be white males. In fact white males are less than 30% of the population so they are more that twice as likely to commit mass murder than the population as a whole.
Click to expand...

You are technically right, but the problem in doing that though is you are attributing the race of the male as if it is relevant to the proportion issue in the 30%... when it doesn't... the determining factor of the difference is because they are male... not because they are white. Because all ethnic groups who have committed mass murder, the vast majority of them are male, it is nothing special to white people. You are measuring a trend in Male vrs Female not an ethnic group vrs ethnic groups. As an ethnic group, white people commit around the exact mass murder you would expect them to proportionally. While ethnic groups like Islamic immigrants commit significantly more than their population proportion.

This is also goes into another issue. african americans(mostly the men) commit 50% of the murders in the USA... but are only 12% of the population... They are committing 4x+ more murders than their than everyone else...

I think with school shooting white people actually commit more than their share of incidents(including white hispanics)... though it's more like 1.2x ... rather than 30x ...4x trends you see elsewhere.
 
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Seems to me the big problem is not white males, black males, Muslim males... but males. Why are so many of the people on death row guys? Step up ladies, start shooting, do your part!

The gender conversation is one worth having.
 
LunaRose said:
The largest mass shooting in our country took place last night in Las Vegas at the Jason Aldean concert. A 64 year old white male kills 50 people and injures another 400. This brings up two talking points off the top of my head.

1) This incident dwarfs the Ariana Grande bombing massacre. White men are responsible for 64% of the mass shootings in this country, out of the 10 largest mass shootings 5 are white males, and now a white male is responsible for the largest mass shooting in the U.S. to date... Should we feel threatened by white males in this country because of it? Do you think innocent white males will be troubled or persecuted today because of what happened last night?

2) Gun Laws... Should a non military civilian be allowed to carry multiple automatic assault weapons? How did he obtain them? And should there be stricter laws on obtaining a gun?
Click to expand...




1. false relationship and strawman

2. Automatic weapons are already illegal, what law do you want to add here?
 
Winston said:
FYI: Citizens can't own fully auto machine guns. I thought they could too once upon a time. They can't. It's already illegal.

Check this threead out for info.
https://www.debatepolitics.com/gun-...guns-full-auto-semi-auto-assault-weapons.html
Click to expand...

Actually that is not true. There are 1000's if legal machine guns in the hands of civilians. Most were made before 1968. "Dealers" can also get the newest and most deadly automatic assault weapons for "testing". There is a huge industry in Nevada where tourists can "test" all the best machine guns. It will be interesting to see how this shooter got all of his machine guns.

Machine Guns Are Legal: A Practical Guide to Full Auto - The Firearm BlogThe Firearm Blog

https://www.battlefieldvegas.com
 
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