Sins of the father hypocrisy?

camlok said:

The charges were dropped, Renae, by the girlfriend you said he beat. That is dishonest.

Read what he says and try to address what he says. That's what honest conservatives do.

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Yeah yeah
took you long enough to look it up.

Renae said:

Yeah yeah
took you long enough to look it up.

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Why aren't you addressing your dishonesty?

What do you have against research?

If we aren't held to the sins of our fathers, why must we be baptized? Hmmm?

camlok said:

We've covered all this, Mason. Try to keep up.

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You didn't cover anything.

You gave me a vague answer about people being different.

camlok said:

Ummmm, because he is a brilliant scientist who can put together a cogent sentence, Mason. I'll let you in on a little secret, ... all words are made up. Did you think that god handed them down to people?

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Now go find that word in a real dictionary and tell us what it really means, not what some kook says it means.

SmokeAndMirrors said:

When someone talks about racism, they aren't accusing you of being guilty for the possibility that your ancestors may have owned slaves. T

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Of course you're right.

I think the right wing media explicitly pushes the narrative that (liberals/dems) are accusing them of needing to feel guilt, or being racist themselves, etc. They drum up easy support when they do it, hit hits a nerve and you can see they will rage without looking at any evidence to he contrary.

What I'm curious to know is whether you think Kal's misrepresentation (accidental or not) of white privilege, was itself an example of a "race bait"? As you can see the people who swooped right in and took the bait to attack any/all notions of white privilege as "excuses (Renae), creating obligation (Harshaw), etc.", when as you point out, it's simply characterizing a real phenomenon on a societal level (my words).

Obviously we are all aware of certain fringe groups use the concept of white privilege to attack whites (check your privilege, you should give up your job to blacks, etc.). This is unfortunate, wrong, and should be opposed IMO.
Republicans are simply better using that same deplorable tactic in reverse, but instead of a fringe of supporters, they get let's say "most Republican voters" to agree with them. That's huge.

That's what Bannon meant when he said that he loves when race becomes the topic, that the Right crushes the left on it every time. Maybe the strategy to pull from this is the Democratic party/leadership/candidates should deny those extremists the way we required Trump to deny White Nationalists. Don't let them tie them to the party.

Mason66 said:

Now go find that word in a real dictionary and tell us what it really means, not what some kook says it means.

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Good dog almighty, Mason, that was M-W!!!!!

Do you know who Noah Webster was?

Mach said:

Of course you're right.

I think the right wing media explicitly pushes the narrative that (liberals/dems) are accusing them of needing to feel guilt, or being racist themselves, etc. They drum up easy support when they do it, hit hits a nerve and you can see they will rage without looking at any evidence to he contrary.

What I'm curious to know is whether you think Kal's misrepresentation (accidental or not) of white privilege, was itself an example of a "race bait"? As you can see the people who swooped right in and took the bait to attack any/all notions of white privilege as "excuses (Renae), creating obligation (Harshaw), etc.", when as you point out, it's simply characterizing a real phenomenon on a societal level (my words).

Obviously we are all aware of certain fringe groups use the concept of white privilege to attack whites (check your privilege, you should give up your job to blacks, etc.). This is unfortunate, wrong, and should be opposed IMO.
Republicans are simply better using that same deplorable tactic in reverse, but instead of a fringe of supporters, they get let's say "most Republican voters" to agree with them. That's huge.

That's what Bannon meant when he said that he loves when race becomes the topic, that the Right crushes the left on it every time. Maybe the strategy to pull from this is the Democratic party/leadership/candidates should deny those extremists the way we required Trump to deny White Nationalists. Don't let them tie them to the party.

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I understand what you're saying, but I think there is a danger in catering to respectability politics. You just wind up with a different kind of extremism: being willing to do anything to prove you're a "real moderate."

These are the sorts of people MLK called out as the most dangerous people in America:

First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice.

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I think the best course of action is to forge our path separate from the extremists. I'll answer a point-blank question about whether I agree with X extremists, but I'm not gonna waste my time apologizing for something that someone else said. I don't support white people losing their homes and would block the hell out of any attempt to make them do so. That's it -- nothing else to say on the matter.

If someone won't listen to what I SAID, then they don't want to be convinced anyway. They're just trying to force me into wasting my time with apologetics, and I'm trying to get stuff done. I'm not gonna sit here owning a platform that isn't mine. THAT is how the right wins this debate over and over again. We get too caught up in apologizing for stuff that's not ours, and in doing so, they get to pull the "guilt by association" card when in reality there's not even any association.

I'm here doing my thing and I would love to have substantive debates with people about MY positions. But I'm not gonna let someone come at me about what some random person said as if that's inherently my problem simply for acknowledging the fact that racism exists, ya know?

It's a way of wasting our time so that no one ever gets to hear our real opinions. I'm not gonna let people waste my time, and I'm not going to engage in negative peace.

Mach said:

......

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Are you denying you said in this thread that people who benefit from privilege sometimes don't know that they do? Think carefully before you answer.

I think you need to back that up.

blueliner7 said:

Are you denying you said in this thread that people who benefit from privilege sometimes don't know that they do? Think carefully before you answer.
I think you need to back that up.

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Same response.
Please quote me if you want to debate something you believe I claimed. It's that simple.

That you refuse to do it, is curious.

Mach said:

Same response.
Please quote me if you want to debate something you believe I claimed. It's that simple.

That you refuse to do it, is curious.

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Ah, you don't want to prove your point. I don't blame you, you can't. But, just in case you'd like to try, please explain to everyone how they have hidden benefits from their white privilege. It shouldn't be that hard, you stated it as a fact earlier...I assume you have some proof?

blueliner7 said:

Ah, you don't want to prove your point. I don't blame you, you can't. But, just in case you'd like to try, please explain to everyone how they have hidden benefits from their white privilege. It shouldn't be that hard, you stated it as a fact earlier...I assume you have some proof?

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Quote my claim, that you object to please, and I'll address it.

Why would you not quote what you disagreed with? I'm really intrigued.
I do it all the time, most people do. They hit the little "quote" button built just for that purpose, and then they respond.

Try it, you'll like it. The icon looks like a little text bubble. If you refuse, it makes you look dishonest or worse.