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Mitt Romney's comments re POTUS statement...

One nutjob who was an avowed Nazi.

I understand. If he had been a BLM protester, would we blame it all on BLM?

It may sound like I'm defending Neo-Nazis. I don't mean to sound that way, because I think they're nutjobs. Anyone who would claim kinship with them is a nutjob. I have little interest in them. If they were demonstrating in my town, I wouldn't go. And I hope no one ELSE would go.

But unless our courts are prepared to deny them the right to assemble? They shouldn't be attacked. And if the courts ever did that? It would be frightening.

Can you, at the. very least agree on the sentence above?
 
He didn't, it's one of the issued talking points being regurgitated by leftist loons.

He refused to call out Nazis by name. You can't solve the problem if you can't even name it.
 
Well, rejection is to be expected occasionally. ;)

Is that it basically? The "on both sides" comment? Not to make light of it and CERTAINLY not to defend the neo's, but is it not TRUE that there was violence on both sides? As I tried to make sense of it, I understood it was when Antifa and BLM came with clubs, etc., that the violence began...

Do you remember the Nazus marching in our Skokie, IL; heavily Jewish ;;;
 
He refused to call out Nazis by name. You can't solve the problem if you can't even name it.

trump can't get past the 1st step of the 12-step program he needs to enter ;;;
 
Saying "three people" is wrong. And, if it were a BLM or Antifa member who drove into that crowd, would we say the same? "Antifa murdered three people..." One nutjob did that.

I'm trying to understand.

If a member of BLM or Antifa had done something like this(which they didn't by the way. Try and remember that). BLM, Antifa, President Obama, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, and every other liberal leader in the country would have immediately and very strongly condemned that action and made absolutely certain that it was know that is not something that these groups support.

But in this case, after a Nazi murdered 3 people, the Daily Stormer which is the website of record for these **** heads came out and attacked on of the dead woman for being a fat, ugly whore. The Republican president who was elected by this pieces of ****, took two full days to criticize the Nazis at all, and then retracted the statement, and tried to act like both sides are equally as bad.

When one side has Nazis on it, both sides are never equally evil, and to imply that they are is to sympathize with Nazis. The reality is Donald Trump knows full well he can't win re-election without the support of Racist White people. They are his primary base. That is why they are the one group of people he refuses to denounce publicly or viciously attack. He's more afraid of loosing the support of Nazis than he is moderate Americans.
 
There is a ideological/cultural war being waged and funded by interests who require chaos in order to achieve their objective.

That fact explains the reaction and the tidal wave of response they are paying for.

There is no rational explanation for the reaction to the Presidents comments, the misrepresentation of them, and the choice to ignore the message in all of them.

The people of the Nation are being played, on purpose, and with objective in mind.

I hope people learn for themselves, and wake up to this fact.

I can't HELP thinking that way... that there is a faction in this country that LOVES this.

Do you remember the Nazus marching in our Skokie, IL; heavily Jewish ;;;

Sorry to say I do. Ha! But I DON'T remember any melee.... ? May have been, but nothing like Charlottesville.
 
You are of the opinion that there is a puppet-master somewhere, who orchestrated the killing of Heather Heyer?

The evidence shows the person who orchestrated the killing was some racist moron named James Field from Ohio.

I'm surprised you didn't know that.
 
If a member of BLM or Antifa had done something like this(which they didn't by the way. Try and remember that). BLM, Antifa, President Obama, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, and every other liberal leader in the country would have immediately and very strongly condemned that action and made absolutely certain that it was know that is not something that these groups support.

But in this case, after a Nazi murdered 3 people, the Daily Stormer which is the website of record for these **** heads came out and attacked on of the dead woman for being a fat, ugly whore. The Republican president who was elected by this pieces of ****, took two full days to criticize the Nazis at all, and then retracted the statement, and tried to act like both sides are equally as bad.

When one side has Nazis on it, both sides are never equally evil, and to imply that they are is to sympathize with Nazis. The reality is Donald Trump knows full well he can't win re-election without the support of Racist White people. They are his primary base. That is why they are the one group of people he refuses to denounce publicly or viciously attack. He's more afraid of loosing the support of Nazis than he is moderate Americans.

Three people were,not murdered.

I absolutely see your point re their website. I saw something on it, probably here. Despicable. You have a point.
 
Drawing a moral equivalence between the Neo-Nazi who killed Heather Heyer and Heather Heyer is wrong..

It would have been, had he done such a thing.
 
But not condemning both alt right and alt left antifas for violence is at least as depraved as condemning one or the other.

False. There was no violence from the left, and even if you believe there was it was only as a reaction to the violence from the Right.

That's like a guy punching a woman, then her boyfriend punching that guy to protect her. Even if they both used violence they are not remotely equal. One was a glaring assault, the other was retaliation for that assault.
 
I understand. If he had been a BLM protester, would we blame it all on BLM?

It may sound like I'm defending Neo-Nazis. I don't mean to sound that way, because I think they're nutjobs. Anyone who would claim kinship with them is a nutjob. I have little interest in them. If they were demonstrating in my town, I wouldn't go. And I hope no one ELSE would go.

Not all crazy people are Nazis, but all Nazi's are crazy people.

Not all crazy people are BLM, but are all BLM crazy people?

I just don't see the equivalence here.

One group fights for white supremacy and the genocide of all non-European stock. The other fights for equal treatment of African Americans in the justice system and society. One sad commentary on how low American discourse has sunk, is that the pundits and the right treated Colin Kaepernick like he was saluting Hitler during the National Anthem. Did BLM ever cause a genocide and do they advocate for it? No. Do they advocate genocide against whites? No.

But unless our courts are prepared to deny them the right to assemble? They shouldn't be attacked. And if the courts ever did that? It would be frightening.

Can you, at the. very least agree on the sentence above?

Any law that targets someone's ideology like that would not pass judicial review. The laws should remain as is. The police shouldn't have let this situation get so out of control. We have the National Guard rolling in (in ND) on the Sioux who brought prayers and drums, and the local PD let Neo-Nazis (who did bring guns) throw down with counter-protestors, what could happen?

I support the first ammendment as is, and I don't support censorship, etc. Neo-nazis can be nazi if they please. But, they will be met with opposition.
 
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I can't HELP thinking that way... that there is a faction in this country that LOVES this.

Given the amount of money they are spending, they must not only love it, they are counting on it.

People have to start asking themselves why, all of a sudden, the Nation is pulling itself apart over political and cultural issues.

Who is feeding all this fear and hatred?

Why are they spending billions of dollars to promote it?

I certainly hope people open up their eyes to what is going on.

It requires objectivity to do so, which seems to be increasingly erased from people.

One thing I've learned over the many years I've lived is that just about everything is connected.
 
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The night before the Nazis were carrying torches and chanting, "The Jews will not replace us!"`

Do you think some of them are "fine people"?
 
I'm one of over 10 million who Liked Romney's Facebook page. This came up on my newsfeed...

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Now, some of you may remember I've had a recent brain transplant and have been more vocal about DTs words. But I don't understand the apparent enormity of reaction about things he said re Charlottesville.

What is so egregious about what he said to produce the all-out desire to have his head on the plate?

Is it because he said there was violence on both sides? Because he didn't mention the new-Nazis, BLM and Antifa by name? I simply don't get it.

Help me out here. And if you'd be kind enough to pull these egregious statements, I would be very grateful.

Thank you.
Some words come to mind from Romney's post but LIKE isn't one of them.
Self-congratulatory, self-important, vainglorious ... words like that.
 
False. There was no violence from the left, and even if you believe there was it was only as a reaction to the violence from the Right.

That's like a guy punching a woman, then her boyfriend punching that guy to protect her. Even if they both used violence they are not remotely equal. One was a glaring assault, the other was retaliation for that assault.

That's explicitly not true.
They assaulted two journalists, aka not nazis.
 
Saying "three people" is wrong. And, if it were a BLM or Antifa member who drove into that crowd, would we say the same? "Antifa murdered three people..." One nutjob did that.

I'm trying to understand.

Yes, because people like to attribute the actions of a few, to the entire group as a whole.
 
The night before the Nazis were carrying torches and chanting, "The Jews will not replace us!"`

Do you think some of them are "fine people"?

It's more complicated than that.
Would it be fair for me to say that, all the counter protest attendees were Antifa.
No, because it's not true.

It's overly simplistic to describe it as a "Nazi rally."
 
Help me out here.

Absolutely Maggie. The issue is this...

Is it because he said there was violence on both sides?

No.

It's that he equated the bigotry of both sides as the same and equally worthy of condemnation. It's that he treated the hatred and bigotry of Nazi's and the KKK, organizations build and founded upon the notion that entire races are inferior and meant for enslavement and/or death, with Black Lives Matters and Antifa...groups that may engage or even encourage violence, that may have extremists that hold hateful views, but who are no where on the same scale as the wide scale systematic hatred based purely on something as fundamental as the color of ones skin, the religion that one has, or the genetics that one carried.

If he had ONLY spoken of the violence, likely there would have been some complaints; after all, the worst instance of violence was perpetrated by only one side of the incident. However, the issue is his statement did not speak only of the violence.

"this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides"

You, and others Maggie, keep talking about how people are upset that Trump was simply condemning violence on both sides; but he didn't. That's not what he said. He didn't simply speak of the violence on many sides. He spoke and condemned, equally condemned, the hatred and specifically the bigotry on many sides. And no matter how one views BLM or even ANTFIA, I've yet to hear a reasonable and rationale explanation on how in the world the hatred and bigotry that one can assign to either of them even approaches that of a group like the Nazi's or the KKK.

Were all the protesters Nazi's or the KKK or White Supremacists? No. And not all the counter protesters were Antifa or BLM or other such groups. Ultimately, both sides are clearly referring to the more extreme elements making up the contingents on each side.
 
But where did he do that?

It was how he spoke it Maggie. Even republicans are saying that his speech emboldened white supremacists. You know there comes a time with trump that he needs to say to himself "maybe it's me that is the problem".
 
Three people were,not murdered.
Excuse me. Three deaths, one murdered, and a bunch more injured. Regardless when you drive a car into a group of people, it is lucky that only one person died. The police who died were not technically killed by the Nazis, but they wouldn't have needed to be in the air at all if it wasn't for the Nazis.

I absolutely see your point re their website. I saw something on it, probably here. Despicable. You have a point.

America has been over this already. Nazis are bad guys. Klan members are bad guys. We've literally fought two of the deadliest wars in American history in order to stop these **** heads from murdering and enslaving innocents. If you're fighting them, you are automatically the good guy. Now some people might choose to use some unsavory tactics that are a bit over the top, but even those people are still ten thousand times better people than Nazis.

Not I, nor any liberal would support pre-emptive violence against anyone including Nazis or Klan members, but if someone punches a Nazi, I'd probably have to fist bump them while arresting them. They are the scum of the earth, and if our president is making excuses for them, or spending equal time criticizing those who would fight them, then he is not fit for office.
 
Not all crazy people are Nazis, but all Nazi's are crazy people.

Not all crazy people are BLM, but are all BLM crazy people?

I just don't see the equivalence here.

One group fights for white supremacy and the genocide of all non-European stock. The other fights for equal treatment of African Americans in the justice system and society. One sad commentary on how low American discourse has sunk, is that the pundits and the right treated Colin Kaepernick like he was saluting Hitler during the National Anthem. Did BLM ever cause a genocide and do they advocate for it? No. Do they advocate genocide against whites? No.

Any law that targets someone's ideology like that would not pass judicial review. The laws should remain as is. The police shouldn't have let this situation get so out of control. We have the National Guard rolling in on the Sioux who brought prayers and drums, and the local PD let Neo-Nazis (who did bring guns) throw down with counter-protestors, what could happen?

I support the first ammendment as is, and I don't support censorship, etc. Neo-nazis can be nazi if they please. But, they will be met with opposition.

And opposition is fair.

..........

Thanks to all participating in this thread. This is the DP I've come to know and love. Disagreement. Agreement. Teaching. Learning. This thread's got it all.
 
The night before the Nazis were carrying torches and chanting, "The Jews will not replace us!"`

Do you think some of them are "fine people"?

Trump is the best at saying something that is vague enough, that it can be interpreted to be highly redeeming to his supporters and highly inflammatory to his critics.
 
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