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New York Is Named After A Horrendous Slave Trader (Oh Noes)

I love how the qualifications change so quickly. :lamo

Yeah, I've noticed this subtle change as well. It's now because "they took up arms." Why are the statues up to begin with if that's true?
 
Did he fight a war against this country? If not(and he didn't), then your comparison is sad and pathetic.

So, it's not about slavery, after all?

Now, it's about fighting against the US?

If we all maintained that hateful rhetoric, Japan and German would still be our enemies, instead of our allies.

I'm amazed at how low the democrats have sunk since Jimmy Carter, in an attempt to heal and bring the nation together, posthumously restored US citizenship to leaders of the Confederacy. There was a time when being a liberal meant live-and-let-live. Even Ronald Reagan laid a wreath at a German memorial in Bitburg where SS soldiers were buried. All that good will (attempts to heal old wounds) has left the building -- all that remains is seething hatred that's quickly reaching a boiling point.
 
So, it's not about slavery, after all?

Now, it's about fighting against the US?

If we all maintained that hateful rhetoric, Japan and German would still be our enemies, instead of our allies.

I'm amazed at how low the democrats have sunk since Jimmy Carter, in an attempt to heal and bring the nation together, posthumously restored US citizenship to leaders of the Confederacy. There was a time when being a liberal meant live-and-let-live. Even Ronald Reagan laid a wreath at a German memorial in Bitburg where SS soldiers were buried. All that good will (attempts to heal old wounds) has left the building -- all that remains is seething hatred that's quickly reaching a boiling point.

The Republicans just voted in the most hate filled president ever. He spews hate at anyone and everyone, almost daily. And you are talking about the Dems hatred? And you're talking about uniting people and healing? With TRUMP in office?

My God!
 
The Republicans just voted in the most hate filled president ever. He spews hate at anyone and everyone, almost daily. And you are talking about the Dems hatred? And you're talking about uniting people and healing? With TRUMP in office?

My God!

It takes quite a bit to push back against the hate the string pullers are creating in this country. Convinced by the immense propaganda being spread, it's understandable people are reacting as you are.

People should stop allowing themselves to be puppets to this effort, and objective.
 
It takes quite a bit to push back against the hate the string pullers are creating in this country. Convinced by the immense propaganda being spread, it's understandable people are reacting as you are.

People should stop allowing themselves to be puppets to this effort, and objective.

Well then Trump is the biggest 'string puller'. Daily he insults everyone, except White Nationalists and Nazis of course.

That's not the way to unite the country. Trump promised to be a uniter. Just another lie by him. He's anything but a uniter. He's just the opposite.
 
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So, it's not about slavery, after all?

Now, it's about fighting against the US?

If we all maintained that hateful rhetoric, Japan and German would still be our enemies, instead of our allies. .

ummm I don't recall any monuments in the U.S. to Hitler, Goering, Rommel, Hirohito, Tojo, Yamamoto, etc.

Let's break it down simply. Many years after the Civil War, some of the losing states erected statues and monuments to the leaders and generals of the failed rebellion. The main purpose of secession was to preserve the condition of slavery.
Memorials to the fallen soldiers are one thing. Germany certainly has several war memorials to those who died defending the Fatherland in WWI and II. But there are not memorials to the Kaiser or the Generals.

Generally speaking, countries don't erect monuments to the losing side of a war.
 
The Duke of York is a title, not a given name, and York is a place in England. Why don't we rename New England as well because England once owned slaves?

In time
 
You forget the feudal aspect of monarchy. Cities would have been named for the Duke using the name of the Duchy. Normal practice.

Nope, because the Duke was named after the town/city..
 
New York was originally a Dutch Settlement they named New Amsterdam. The Dutch surrendered New Amsterdam to the English who named it New York, to honor the Duke of York.

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City

and the Duke of York got his name from being the Duke/nobility of the region/area in the UK, that has gotten its name from.. the city of York.
 
and the Duke of York got his name from being the Duke/nobility of the region/area in the UK, that has gotten its name from.. the city of York.

Well, yes. However, New York was named in the Duke of York's honor. The interesting point being attempted stands.
 
Well, yes. However, New York was named in the Duke of York's honor. The interesting point being attempted stands.

Sure. But was it named after the Duke of York for his role in the Royal African Company, or for his position as Duke and heir presumptive?

The Confederate statues were erected to memorialize the Confederacy, the basis of which was slavery.
 
The Republicans just voted in the most hate filled president ever. He spews hate at anyone and everyone, almost daily. And you are talking about the Dems hatred? And you're talking about uniting people and healing? With TRUMP in office?

My God!

What you seem to be missing is what led to the election of Trump. Nothing happens in a vacuum.
 
ummm I don't recall any monuments in the U.S. to Hitler, Goering, Rommel, Hirohito, Tojo, Yamamoto, etc.

Let's break it down simply. Many years after the Civil War, some of the losing states erected statues and monuments to the leaders and generals of the failed rebellion. The main purpose of secession was to preserve the condition of slavery.
Memorials to the fallen soldiers are one thing. Germany certainly has several war memorials to those who died defending the Fatherland in WWI and II. But there are not memorials to the Kaiser or the Generals.

Generally speaking, countries don't erect monuments to the losing side of a war.


Your argument reminds me of a very similar situation -- China and Tibet. Tibet exerted independence from the PRC, and that worked for awhile but in the 1950s, China invaded Tibet and took them back. China also destroyed Tibetan Art and treasures, and the western world saw China as being a total ass. And, of course they were, and often, still are, when it comes to treating the Tibetan people with respect and decency. And now, our very own alt-Left is following in China's dubious footsteps.

Fascinating.
 
Maybe we should go back to NY's original name.

New Amsterdam.

Nahh. Then you'd have to deal with the whole Dutch/Afrikaner/apartheid thing and you're right back to square one.

How about we rename it New Gauis? I never owned slaves. Oh wait, I did own a couple of dogs which no doubt pisses off someone, somewhere.
 
The Duke of York is the title given to a person. New York was named after a Duke of York. I provided those links for a reason...



England also gave up slave ownership before us...

Yeah but only by about 20 years. In the grand timescale of humanity that doesn't mean a whole lot.
 
It takes quite a bit to push back against the hate the string pullers are creating in this country. Convinced by the immense propaganda being spread, it's understandable people are reacting as you are.

People should stop allowing themselves to be puppets to this effort, and objective.

Yep. I suppose you can’t blame people for feeling as they do. When you are told daily by the media how DJT hates “everyone” then the subconscious is convinced it is true and as a consequence one manifests hatred. I doubt DJT hates “everyone.” I don’t feel hated by DJT, I’m sure his family doesn’t feel hated by him. It’s interesting the paradigms people create within their own minds.

Well then Trump is the biggest 'string puller'. Daily he insults everyone, except White Nationalists and Nazis of course.

That's not the way to unite the country. Trump promised to be a uniter. Just another lie by him. He's anything but a uniter. He's just the opposite.

As ocean515 pointed out, “It takes a quite a bit to push back against the hate…” The feelings you feel aren’t entirely your fault. There are “string pullers,” as Ocean515 said, that are creating these feelings of hate and these people are the media. Follow me on this…when a person allows a constant stream of information, right or wrong, into their mind the subconscious accepts the information as truth. It does this because the subconscious is unable to differentiate between fact and fiction. So, in your reality, DJT hates “everyone,” except White Nat’lists and Nazis because that’s the paradigm your subconscious created. So in order to eliminate the “biggest string puller,” you must first eliminate the lesser ones, which is the media. It’s a simple solution. Turn off the tv, radio, stop reading the paper, listening to friends who talk politics, and just take a break from all the hoopla for a few days. During this time when your monkey mind, the conscious mind that continually chatters and won’t shut up, begins to dwell on politics, stop it and say to yourself, “Today is such a nice day,” or, “I feel good,” or some other positive thing. Say it out loud or silently it doesn’t matter. At the same time feel that nice day, or, feel that good feeling. Do this for a few days as an experiment, may be two weeks, and see if there is a change in yourself. Sounds silly but it works.

Anyway, good luck with it. We all have bouts of negativity at times, no biggie.
 
Your argument reminds me of a very similar situation -- China and Tibet. Tibet exerted independence from the PRC, and that worked for awhile but in the 1950s, China invaded Tibet and took them back. China also destroyed Tibetan Art and treasures, and the western world saw China as being a total ass. And, of course they were, and often, still are, when it comes to treating the Tibetan people with respect and decency. And now, our very own alt-Left is following in China's dubious footsteps.

Fascinating.
Was Tibet's motive for seeking impendence freedom for themselves, or the right to harm others?
After China invaded Tibet, how many monuments to an oppressive Tibetan regime have been erected?

They are not at all similar when it comes to the reasons people want the removal of the statues.

Should Austria celebrate its heritage by erecting statues of Hitler? Was Iraq wrong to tear down statues of Sadaam Hussein? Ukrainians wrong to tear down statues of Lenin?

You erect statues and build monuments for ideas you support and want to honor. Honoring a rebellion whose intent was to maintain slavery as an institution? Is that really an ideal you think our country should celebrate?
 
New York, both the city and the state, is named after the house of York and particularly for James Stuart, then Duke of York, one of the most successful slavers in colonial American history.

New York Is Named After A Slave Trader | The Daily Caller

I have to tell you volsrock this article took me on quite a journey today in research. I learned so much today and at the end, I am so thankful I was born in the U.S.A. . That my immigrant parents on my father's side were fortunate to make it here fleeing the Bolsheviks and my mother's side which comes from one of the original persons on the Mayflower who befriended the Shawnee Indians who saved their lives in territory that is now titled Ohio and West Virginia. My ancestors would have starved to death or froze to death if it were not for the Shawnee. The chief of the tribe gave his daughter in marriage to my great great grandfather and they reproduced that resulted in my mother's heritage. I have accounts of my great great grandmother was a beautiful woman inside and out. But in those days it was frowned upon to marry another race. I don't know her Indian name they called her Polly.

Yes the Duke of York was James Stuart and later became the King of England, Scotland and Ireland known as James the II in England and Ireland and James the VII in Scotland. Early on in the colonies the Dutch had already set up shop and they too were into slavery. In fact when the Americas were discovered, all of Europe was into slavery because they need the added manpower to reproduce for their own crown. James Stuart Duke of York defeated the Dutch and overtook their presence. They too were involved in the slave trade. Dutch West India Company and their port for entrance of slaves was called New Amsterdam. But that was changed to New York when the Duke took charge.

I also learned today that William Penn had a long history of friendship with the Duke of York and his father the King of England owed a debt of gratitude to the Penn family . So that is when the King of England issued a tract of land and named it Pennsylvania in the family's honor. William Penn was a slave owner and a Quaker.

I also read the account of a person with heritage to the South that owned no slaves but fought for the confederacy. Their religious leaders claimed it was biblical to own slaves. These people fought because they were told by their religious leaders that it was proper to own slaves.
Good thing a number of them didn't listen to them because they were involved in the Underground Railroad risking their lives to free slaves in the deep South.

Now all this brings me to this....those calling for the removal of all Confederate statues and several have extended it to any statue of a Founder who once owned slaves shows a complete meltdown of critical thinking. Unless you are willing to put yourself in a position of those operating in that time frame of what the world was like at that time, you need to STFU.

After my journey today through the history of England, France, Holland, Germany etc.......I am so thankful for our Founders and their wisdom of putting Freedom of Religion at the top of the heap! Because they lived through the disasters of those who did not.
 
Was Tibet's motive for seeking impendence freedom for themselves, or the right to harm others?

Tibet did -- at one time -- have a mild form of slavery.


They are not at all similar when it comes to the reasons people want the removal of the statues.

They are identical, actually. In both cases, the dominate (victor) wants to eradicate all cultural memories of the losing side. It's just what mean people do. Nothing new.
 
Sure. But was it named after the Duke of York for his role in the Royal African Company, or for his position as Duke and heir presumptive?

The Confederate statues were erected to memorialize the Confederacy, the basis of which was slavery.

It would appear history records that it was named in honor of the Duke of York.

History also records the Duke of York was a slave trader.
 
Yep. I suppose you can’t blame people for feeling as they do. When you are told daily by the media how DJT hates “everyone” then the subconscious is convinced it is true and as a consequence one manifests hatred. I doubt DJT hates “everyone.” I don’t feel hated by DJT, I’m sure his family doesn’t feel hated by him. It’s interesting the paradigms people create within their own minds.



As ocean515 pointed out, “It takes a quite a bit to push back against the hate…” The feelings you feel aren’t entirely your fault. There are “string pullers,” as Ocean515 said, that are creating these feelings of hate and these people are the media. Follow me on this…when a person allows a constant stream of information, right or wrong, into their mind the subconscious accepts the information as truth. It does this because the subconscious is unable to differentiate between fact and fiction. So, in your reality, DJT hates “everyone,” except White Nat’lists and Nazis because that’s the paradigm your subconscious created. So in order to eliminate the “biggest string puller,” you must first eliminate the lesser ones, which is the media. It’s a simple solution. Turn off the tv, radio, stop reading the paper, listening to friends who talk politics, and just take a break from all the hoopla for a few days. During this time when your monkey mind, the conscious mind that continually chatters and won’t shut up, begins to dwell on politics, stop it and say to yourself, “Today is such a nice day,” or, “I feel good,” or some other positive thing. Say it out loud or silently it doesn’t matter. At the same time feel that nice day, or, feel that good feeling. Do this for a few days as an experiment, may be two weeks, and see if there is a change in yourself. Sounds silly but it works.

Anyway, good luck with it. We all have bouts of negativity at times, no biggie.

I'm sure there is great expectation that the billions being invested in messaging and influence will create the desired result in those easily swayed by the carefully crafted effort.
 
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