Violence as a response to speech is indefensible.

Manc Skipper said:

The nazi attackers cannot be legally resisted? Nobody takes a swing at me without getting his rebel flag stuffed where the sun don't shine.

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I never said they couldn't. All are equal under the law, and when I say that violence is not a valid response to speech it applies to all sides. Breaking the law, be it neo-nazi or antifa or whoever is a matter for the police who should have erected a wall -- in riot geared police of barricades -- between the two groups.

Violence is never a viable option for advancing an agenda- at least not in a long-term sense. Physical violence may intimidate and dominate a people for a time but it never lasts. The principle appetite of a man's soul is to be free. No matter how many are tortured, how many are killed, people eventually rise and reclaim their rights as free beings. That is why I struggle to understand the current spate of violence. Do not deny another's right to free assembly and free speech. Let the court of public opinion uphold or condemn. Smashing a person's face may very well be gratifying in some personal and perverse way, but it accomplishes nothing in the grand scheme of things. Allow even the most degenerate to exercise their rights. The poverty or wealth of their positions will become readily apparent.

Mason66 said:

You are talking like white supremacists are killing people on a daily basis all over the country.
If that is the case please post a few links to the stories.

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You can support your own straw man.

jmotivator said:

No, violence against speech is never justified.

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Seems pretty obviously false to me. I think a parent would be justified in reacting with overwhelming violence to someone making a credible threat to the lives of their children, for example.

jmotivator said:

The first two sentences are absolutely true, though.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/14/opinion/sunday/when-is-speech-violence.html

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...n-is-speech-violence-and-what-s-the-real-harm

It is this very paradigm that is used here and elsewhere to justify violence as a response to speech, as if the words of the neo-nazi marcher and the physical assault are equal... or on many cases the physical assault is seen as more acceptable than the speech.

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Well if you compare rapists and wife beaters, i suspect there may be a variety of opinions on their relative horror.

I don't think it makes sense to use the equivocations implied by such comparisons. Antifa violence is wrong. Nazi violence is wrong. And i think Nazi ideas are wrong, too. While violence is illegal, ideas are not, as it should be.

calamity said:

lol...not being worried to death about Nazis and KKKers gaining traction is most definitely a white privilege. It's probably at the very heart of defining it.

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At the rate their numbers are declining, the group is putting most endangered species to shame.

But if people want to hide in their closets from some goose-stepping boogeymen, then that is their hang up.

Its my choice not to let it be mine.

jmotivator said:

If the 500 guys have a legal permit and are not physically attacking anyone then no, you have no right to assault them.

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Correct... but that is not what happened.

Oborosen said:

At the rate their numbers are declining, the group is putting most endangered species to shame.

But if people want to hide in their closets from some goose-stepping boogeymen, then that is their hang up.

Its my choice not to let it be mine.

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Actually their numbers have been on the upswing ever since we elected Obama---something about electing a black president drove white nationalist types nuts.

calamity said:

Actually their numbers have been on the upswing ever since we elected Obama---something about electing a black president drove white nationalist types nuts.

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I know right?
What is it about electing a person to the white house, that drives mentally deficient people so nuts?

Absentglare said:

Well if you compare rapists and wife beaters, i suspect there may be a variety of opinions on their relative horror.

I don't think it makes sense to use the equivocations implied by such comparisons. Antifa violence is wrong. Nazi violence is wrong. And i think Nazi ideas are wrong, too. While violence is illegal, ideas are not, as it should be.

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Did you see the puff piece in the NYT today that on the brave antifa who fight Nazi aggression?

We are heading to a very bad place when the paper of record is supporting violence against speech.