• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Vice: A House Divided

calamity

calamity

Privileged
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Monthly Donator
Joined
Feb 12, 2013
Messages
160,900
Reaction score
57,844
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Centrist
Pretty good hour can be spent watching the video below. Vice interviews some of the key players in Washington over the past few years to lay out the groundwork which led us to the current political mess we are in....and, yes, we are in a mess. You can take that much to the bank.



My take...Democrats blew a great opportunity, basically folding with four aces, while Republicans played their pair of deuces like they held a Royal Flush. Was it all D screw ups? No. RW media went at it full speed, and hammered on Obama relentlessly, eventually turning those pair of deuces into a King-high full house. But...that came with a price---the Right lost control of their brand. And, there was the opening where in walks Trump.
 
calamity said:
Pretty good hour can be spent watching the video below. Vice interviews some of the key players in Washington over the past few years to lay out the groundwork which led us to the current political mess we are in....and, yes, we are in a mess. You can take that much to the bank.



My take...Democrats blew a great opportunity, basically folding with four aces, while Republicans played their pair of deuces like they held a Royal Flush. Was it all D screw ups? No. RW media went at it full speed, and hammered on Obama relentlessly, eventually turning those pair of deuces into a King-high full house. But...that came with a price---the Right lost control of their brand. And, there was the opening where in walks Trump.
Click to expand...


I don't have an hour, but that's never stopped me from voicing an opinion. ;)

There's only one reason why the Dems lost the election. They ran Hillary Clinton, fulfilling a promise made to her many years ago.

Edit...I should add, "...in my opinion."
 
MaggieD said:
I don't have an hour, but that's never stopped me from voicing an opinion. ;)

There's only one reason why the Dems lost the election. They ran Hillary Clinton, fulfilling a promise made to her many years ago.

Edit...I should add, "...in my opinion."
Click to expand...

They lost far more than the presidency over the past 8 years. 100 seats, at least, in the House and another 20 in the Senate. D problems run much deeper than just Hillary Clinton.
 
MaggieD said:
I don't have an hour, but that's never stopped me from voicing an opinion. ;)

There's only one reason why the Dems lost the election. They ran Hillary Clinton, fulfilling a promise made to her many years ago.

Edit...I should add, "...in my opinion."
Click to expand...

The Democrats are losing because they are the Party of "bread and circuses;" of feelings and emotions; race politics; pie-in-the-sky social welfare regardless of economic effects; diversity for it's own sake turning the nation from melting pot into a segregated buffet...and equality of outcome rather than equality of opportunity.

IMO they are "socialist-light," somewhere to the right of Bernie Sanders and left of Leon Trostsky.

That has really created the divide in the USA we are seeing today, with people turning from the ideal of being an American toward the ideal of being a citizen of the global community.

Well, whichever way you look at it, this is bound to cause a backlash.

Oh! Yeah...IMO ;)
 
Captain Adverse said:
The Democrats are losing because they are the Party of "bread and circuses;" of feelings and emotions; race politics; pie-in-the-sky social welfare regardless of economic effects; diversity for it's own sake turning the nation from melting pot into a segregated buffet...and equality of outcome rather than equality of opportunity.

IMO they are "socialist-light," somewhere to the right of Bernie Sanders and left of Leon Trostsky.

That has really created the divide in the USA we are seeing today, with people turning from the ideal of being an American toward the ideal of being a citizen of the global community.

Well, whichever way you look at it, this is bound to cause a backlash.

Oh! Yeah...IMO ;)
Click to expand...

Watching it all unfold in the video was fascinating.

Step by step as the GOP gained seats and more power, the real power within the GOP slipped away. Due to fragmentation, before long, even though they owned both the House and Senate--and now the presidency--they became as weak as they were when they had fewer seats than the Dems and Obama was president. Amazing.
 
calamity said:
Watching it all unfold in the video was fascinating.

Step by step as the GOP gained seats and more power, the real power within the GOP slipped away. Due to fragmentation, before long, even though they owned both the House and Senate--and now the presidency--they became as weak as they were when they had fewer seats than the Dems and Obama was president. Amazing.
Click to expand...

The problem with many of the old-school Republican's is that they are really RINO's. They don't speak to their base...only to their own personal goals and advancement.

They learned nothing from the Tea Party rebellion, and nothing from the results of this election (which in at least 3 "Blue" States cut across party lines).

Both Parties are wearing thin. I wonder what will end up replacing them.
 
calamity said:
Watching it all unfold in the video was fascinating.

Step by step as the GOP gained seats and more power, the real power within the GOP slipped away. Due to fragmentation, before long, even though they owned both the House and Senate--and now the presidency--they became as weak as they were when they had fewer seats than the Dems and Obama was president. Amazing.
Click to expand...

The strength of a party in a system geared to individual mandates instead of party mandates is the diversity of the party members. Party leadership has more a moderating role than one of control. It is not as easy to dictate a direction, but the system has been good at adapting to changing circumstances, has been relatively progressive and no more prone to getting stuck in a rut than other less individual based systems.
 
Captain Adverse said:
The problem with many of the old-school Republican's is that they are really RINO's. They don't speak to their base...only to their own personal goals and advancement.

They learned nothing from the Tea Party rebellion, and nothing from the results of this election (which in at least 3 "Blue" States cut across party lines).

Both Parties are wearing thin. I wonder what will end up replacing them.
Click to expand...

My suspicion is that both parties will rejuvenate from within.
 
calamity said:
Watching it all unfold in the video was fascinating.

Step by step as the GOP gained seats and more power, the real power within the GOP slipped away. Due to fragmentation, before long, even though they owned both the House and Senate--and now the presidency--they became as weak as they were when they had fewer seats than the Dems and Obama was president. Amazing.
Click to expand...

Regarding congress : REDMAP worked. It will continue to pay dividends for some time to come. That, and the senate would be a tough pull for Repubs without a bunch of reliably red, relatively unpopulated states.

IMHO, of course...
 
Captain Adverse said:
The problem with many of the old-school Republican's is that they are really RINO's. They don't speak to their base...only to their own personal goals and advancement.

They learned nothing from the Tea Party rebellion, and nothing from the results of this election (which in at least 3 "Blue" States cut across party lines).

Both Parties are wearing thin. I wonder what will end up replacing them.
Click to expand...

According to the video, all this "rebellion" is making it impossible to actually, you know, govern. I know you may not buy this, but governing is sort of important....IMHO.
 
<alt>doxygen said:
Regarding congress : REDMAP worked. It will continue to pay dividends for some time to come. That, and the senate would be a tough pull for Repubs without a bunch of reliably red, relatively unpopulated states.

IMHO, of course...
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure the map will flip Blue again. It's inevitable. Dems were caught flat-footed when they lost control of media and message...not to mention how to get big money, like the GOP did after Citizens United. They have since caught on. As Donald Trump is learning the hard way.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom