How much do we spend on Health care, is it enough for single payer?

independentusa said:

$10,345 per person: U.S. health care spending reaches new peak | PBS NewsHour
As of July 2016 we were spending over 10 thousand dollars per year for every person in the USA. That is over 3.8 trillion dollars. I would think that if we put all the money together we spend on health care we could set up a single payer system similar to other industrialized nations. Even a two tiered system similar to Medicare with the second tier being a supplement could work.

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I pay for all my care out of pocket, because I'm young and kind of healthy, and I am an American living in Canada. I had a real bad bout of heartburn a few months back, went into the ER to make sure wasn't a heart attack. They billed me $300 bucks total. A few years earlier, at a time when I had no insurance and was living in the States, I went in for the exact same reason. Bill was 3200 bucks.

Now, I am not on Canada's single payer healthcare, because only people under a certain income get the free version. And I have no private insurance, because the cost of premiums would be way more than any cost I incur paying out of pocket. And the hospital I went to did nothing different, and the doctors make about the same. So why the difference in prices? Maybe it's the American hospitals jacking up all their prices 500-600 percent just because they can...

independentusa said:

Yes, and who is paying for all of those MRI machines, we are. And most are running at less than 50% capacity. SO we have to make up the difference by paying a lot more for the MRI's and facilities get doctors to use the MRI's and other equipment for procedures where a cheaper X-ray would do. Having been part of the health care system for over 40 years I can tell you that there is no competition in health care to bring prices down and keep the system lean. Instead we have a bloated system with way too much high, and I mean high priced equipment either sitting around doing little or over used to help pay for it.

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You are right. I know folks in MRI and CT service business. The margins in that business is off the charts.

Our entire political system completely ignore competition and supply of medical services. I saw that CO just enabled pharmacists to write perscriptions for the sales of birth control. It is that type of deregulation that will help lower costs.

I've come to believe there should be no primary care doctor. That needs to be relegated as a nurse role.

There is so much reform that could help. One of which is making it so hospitals don't have to charge an arm and leg because they get stuck holding the bill when people or insurance companies don't pay. Our system is a complete cluster. It is amazing how many die from mistakes and then we get told we have the best system because I can get an MRI tomorrow if I wanted.

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We now have Nurse practitioners and Physician assistants because of, you guessed it the military. Years ago during the Viet Nam war the military paid doctors for their schooling and then thy had to give 6 years of service. The problem was that these doctors right out of Med school had to do their internship and their residencies while in the service. Of course they all wanted to be specialists at the time so we ended up with no GP's to man our GOP clinics at our hospitals and clinics. So they began to train nurses to give an initial exam and then send them to the specialist clinics they needed. Since then this has caught on with the private facilities to lower costs where possible. Like many other areas such as surgery, we have learned a lot about health care from wars.

independentusa said:

There is a major difference between what a single payer system would be like in the USA and Canada. In the USA the providers system is privately owned while in Canada it is almost all government owned. Huge difference. It would make the likelihood of such waits almost impossible in the USA as the provider systems here would be vying for each patient.

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Why would they compete for customers if you remove profit from the equation. In fact what would motivate them to stay in buisiness if you remove profits from it. Would that not lead to gov owned and operated health providers?

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independentusa said:

No, you have the proper amount of equipment, which is not as little as the Canadian system or as much as in our system. We used to have Regional health care planning which did just that, but Reagan ended that for what he called competition. The only problem is there is no real competition in our health care provider system

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Which is the govs fault.

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independentusa said:

$10,345 per person: U.S. health care spending reaches new peak | PBS NewsHour
As of July 2016 we were spending over 10 thousand dollars per year for every person in the USA. That is over 3.8 trillion dollars. I would think that if we put all the money together we spend on health care we could set up a single payer system similar to other industrialized nations. Even a two tiered system similar to Medicare with the second tier being a supplement could work.

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Wow....FFS

ObamaCare was the Federal Govt taking over and trying to centrally plan and run our Health insurance industry.

The VA left thousands of veterans to languish on hidden waiting list with no care until they died, no one has been held accountable

Vermont passed its singlepayer law back in 2011, it has yet to be implemented because the tax increases necessary would tank its economy.

California shelved its singlepayer bill after realizing its technically bankrupt, and has no way to come up with the 400 billion needed to fund it

After all these examples of Govt corruption and incompetence, its hard to believe there are still intelligent individuals still pushing for singlepayer

Fenton said:

Wow....FFS

ObamaCare was the Federal Govt taking over and trying to centrally plan and run our Health insurance industry.

The VA left thousands of veterans to languish on hidden waiting list with no care until they died, no one has been held accountable

Vermont passed its singlepayer law back in 2011, it has yet to be implemented because the tax increases necessary would tank its economy.

California shelved its singlepayer bill after realizing its technically bankrupt, and has no way to come up with the 400 billion needed to fund it

After all these examples of Govt corruption and incompetence, its hard to believe there are still intelligent individuals still pushing for singlepayer

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Well it works great in canada

It didn't take over our health care insurance industry, it legislated some requirements. It is the same thing when they require you to wear seat belts. The government didn't take over your driving, just required you to wear a seat belt for safety. The government does this kind of thing in many industries. Andd maybe the GOP should stop sutting the VA and they might be abel to do their job better. The GOP talks a good game when it comes to Vets, but they hurt not help.

independentusa said:

$10,345 per person: U.S. health care spending reaches new peak | PBS NewsHour
As of July 2016 we were spending over 10 thousand dollars per year for every person in the USA. That is over 3.8 trillion dollars. I would think that if we put all the money together we spend on health care we could set up a single payer system similar to other industrialized nations. Even a two tiered system similar to Medicare with the second tier being a supplement could work.

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The real question is not how much it costs, but who pays for it. For those not already on a government paid system the vast majority of people are covered by their employers.

So moving to a single payer system would be a great benefit for corporations and help level the playing field with other countries. But how will the government pay for this?

How is having too much equipment the governments fault? We once had a program to insure sufficient but not an overabundance of equipment, but Reagan ended that program. It was called Regional Health Care Planning. Like I have said many times, he thought competition would bring down health care prices, it didn't. In fact since there is no real competition in health care provision, it actually lead to high costs.

independentusa said:

How is having too much equipment the governments fault? We once had a program to insure sufficient but not an overabundance of equipment, but Reagan ended that program. It was called Regional Health Care Planning. Like I have said many times, he thought competition would bring down health care prices, it didn't. In fact since there is no real competition in health care provision, it actually lead to high costs.

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You might to consider the above while thinking about the cost of Lasik eye surgery. Costs have actually gone down, not up. Why, because the user has to pay and is thus cost sensitive.

Through taxes of course. And many of companies that presently pay for their employee's insurance would get a cost break as Medicare pays less for administration by a lot, 6.8% for Medicare to over 25%of total cost for private insurance.

So you want us to all go without health insurance to bring down costs. I don't think anyone would want to go there.