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Senate Republicans Have Asked CBO to Score 2 Versions of Revised Health-Care Bill

Athanasius68 said:
Insurance is not health care. If a person wishes coverage for everything attached to healthcare, then a person has to pay for it.

The only moral component that kicks in here is whether this is less moral than somebody else paying for it.
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That's a meaningless statement, because in this country insurance is the system through which people are able to afford healthcare. People cannot afford healthcare without insurance, which is why medical expense is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in America.

Top 5 Reasons Why People Go Bankrupt

1) Medical Expenses

​​​A study done at Harvard University indicates that this is the biggest cause of bankruptcy, representing 62% of all personal bankruptcies. One of the interesting caveats of this study shows that 78% of filers had some form of health insurance, thus bucking the myth that medical bills affect only the uninsured.

Rare or serious diseases or injuries can easily result in hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills - bills that can quickly wipe out savings and retirement accounts, college education funds and home equity. Once these have been exhausted, bankruptcy may be the only shelter left, regardless of whether the patient or his or her family was able to apply health coverage to a portion of the bill or not. (Find out what you can do to avoid a financial meltdown when there's a medical emergency. Read Steering Clear Of Medical Debt.)
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Note the date of the article: 2010. This demonstrates that even with health insurance, a plan that lacks the ten essential health benefits, lifetimes caps protection, protection for pre-existing conditions and protections against gender discrimination is a terrible plan and is why the improvements made by the ACA were so crucial.

Today, medical bills are still the #1 reason for bankruptcy, though the percentage of those on insurance suffering financial crises has dropped to 40%. Not perfect, but a definite improvement.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...ason-americans-file-for-bankruptcy/101148136/
 
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Mac77 said:
All that effort and look what a failure obama and the democrats came up with
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And that is the Republicans goal in a nutshell isn't it? It is not about HC at all. They don't have a clue about giving real HC to the American people. Sad.
 
iguanaman said:
And that is the Republicans goal in a nutshell isn't it? It is not about HC at all. They don't have a clue about giving real HC to the American people. Sad.
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They're out to give tax cuts to their donors, give insurance lobbyists everything they want, and destroy Obama's legacy, so that America may never think of going crazy and electing a black guy ever again.
 
Cardinal said:
That's a meaningless statement, because in this country insurance is the system through which people are able to afford healthcare. People cannot afford healthcare without insurance, which is why medical expense is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in America.

Top 5 Reasons Why People Go Bankrupt



Note the date of the article: 2010. This demonstrates that even with health insurance, a plan that lacks the ten essential health benefits, lifetimes caps protection, protection for pre-existing conditions and protections against gender discrimination is a terrible plan and is why the improvements made by the ACA were so crucial.

Today, medical bills are still the #1 reason for bankruptcy, though the percentage of those on insurance suffering financial crises has dropped to 40%. Not perfect, but a definite improvement.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...ason-americans-file-for-bankruptcy/101148136/
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That's weird tax increases didn't make the list....
 
Henrin said:
That argument sucks. If I don't need something I have no reason to pay for it.
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Today....

I don't need car insurance while it's parked in my garage - well unless a tornado hits my garage or lighting strikes it.

How do you know that you won't need it tomorrow?
 
Removable Mind said:
Today....

I don't need car insurance while it's parked in my garage - well unless a tornado hits my garage or lighting strikes it.

How do you know that you won't need it tomorrow?
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You don't.
 
Henrin said:
I'll stick with the principles of property rights and the freedom to buy and sell products when you decide it is in your interest.
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And if the average Bob buys a crap policy that doesn't cover hospitalization because FREEDOM, and Bob gets himself into a bad accident, Bob will spend weeks or months in the hospital and the rest of us will pick up a big chunk of that bill. So Bob makes a bet - Heads (no serious illness or accident) he wins by paying lower premiums or no premiums, tails (runs off the road in ice storm, truck flips 9 times, weeks in ICU) we lose.
 
Henrin said:
You don't.
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Then may the force be with you.

I'm paying for the insurance anyway. Or until the Republicans decide that healthcare is strictly a political issue and play like human healthcare needs for individuals are politically predictable, which gives political parties the right to decide if a person is ill...not medical providers.
 
Originally Posted by JamesBY: One, prohibit pharma from advertising on media to consumers. Two, open consumer access to pharma supplies outside of the country.
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Mac77 said:
You mean just become a banana republic and throw out the first amendment?
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Advertising is not protected by the 1st Amendment is your second error. Your first error is thinking that government can't govern business regulation in a Republic of We the People.

My suggestion would drive down the price of pharma products drastically.
 
Not to be too heavy handed here (okay maybe to be a little heavy handed), but one major takeaway from the article is that the Senate healthcare bill is still very much in play, and that the ongoing negotiations is resulting in a bill that is a race to the bottom.
 
Athanasius68 said:
Then if the circumstances change (like have children) then the person changes their policy. Whats the issue?
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If you are not covered for pregnancy and you get pregnant, no, you don't get to change your policy. If you want to get pregnant, then change your policy first.
 
iguanaman said:
And that is the Republicans goal in a nutshell isn't it? It is not about HC at all. They don't have a clue about giving real HC to the American people. Sad.
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You are not making any sense

The republicans do not want their healthcare plan - if they ever come up with one - to fail

Why should they?

ObamaCare otoh was intended to fail so that democrat deadbeats could demand single payer
 
JamesBY said:
Advertising is not protected by the 1st Amendment is your second error. Your first error is thinking that government can't govern business regulation in a Republic of We the People.

My suggestion would drive down the price of pharma products drastically.
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Advertising is protected free speech but there are exceptons or limits to everything

The wacked out federal judges may or may not allow your suggestion depending on how they feel on the day they hear the arguments
 
JamesBY said:
If you are not covered for pregnancy and you get pregnant, no, you don't get to change your policy. If you want to get pregnant, then change your policy first.
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Sorry but that is a pre-existing condition so you cant change policy.
 
Mac77 said:
All that effort and look what a failure obama and the democrats came up with
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It wasn't a failure. The expansion of Medicaid covers 40% of Americans, including a lot of Trump voters. That's the problem the Republicans have now. How dare Obamacare cover their constituents, forcing them to meet secretly and hope said constituents don't notice when their health insurance is yanked out from under them!
 
Removable Mind said:
Today....

I don't need car insurance while it's parked in my garage - well unless a tornado hits my garage or lighting strikes it.

How do you know that you won't need it tomorrow?
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That's the nature of insurance-- both parties are making a bet.
 
Cigar said:
Look I got not use for Stop Lights and Stop Signs, but without them, someone is going to get hurt.
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Should men have to pay for a policy that covers gynecological exams and pre and post natal care?
 
PeteEU said:
Sorry but that is a pre-existing condition so you cant change policy.
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I've know several people with pre existing conditions that have changed policies many times, with full coverage for those conditions.
 
Cardinal said:
That's a meaningless statement, because in this country insurance is the system through which people are able to afford healthcare. People cannot afford healthcare without insurance, which is why medical expense is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in America.

Top 5 Reasons Why People Go Bankrupt



Note the date of the article: 2010. This demonstrates that even with health insurance, a plan that lacks the ten essential health benefits, lifetimes caps protection, protection for pre-existing conditions and protections against gender discrimination is a terrible plan and is why the improvements made by the ACA were so crucial.

Today, medical bills are still the #1 reason for bankruptcy, though the percentage of those on insurance suffering financial crises has dropped to 40%. Not perfect, but a definite improvement.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...ason-americans-file-for-bankruptcy/101148136/
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Yes. Insurance is a financial instrument. Its not a medical one.
 
Anthony60 said:
Should men have to pay for a policy that covers gynecological exams and pre and post natal care?
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Can you show the line-item in your policy where you do? :roll:

What a ... :2razz:
 
Cigar said:
Can you show the line-item in your policy where you do? :roll:

What a ... :2razz:
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Which line is it that identifies the policy as insurance?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Winston said:
Way to miss the point. You are part of society. Society's problems are your problems. This strengthens the idea that we are a country of United people. We as Americans should figure out a baseline of insurance policy guarantees and make that the bedrock of healthcare in America. Would you not like to set a standard for American healthcare?

Instead, you seem to be focused on a young, healthy person's ability to pay only for himself, and never anyone else. Our young strapping lad, won't understand my conversation, until the day destiny comes knocking at his door. What would you say, if he was compelled by U.S. law, to pay into coverage for cancer, so, that his neighbor could afford the premiums of a plan that includes cancer treatment? Choosing to compel people to buy plans that they have a probability of one day using is a prudent thing to do; with the tacit admission that one day in the not-so-distant future, it is probable that he may get a colonoscopy revealing some bad news. By this time he will have traded his youth and health in, for age and sickness. And there will be a new round of young people, either compelled by American healthcare standards to guarantee everyone can afford healthcare, or, we can base our healthcare standards around a worldview summed up by the phrase, "me first and the gimme-gimme's".
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You are not proposing to set up a baseline forhealthcare. You are suggesting setting a baseline for health insurance. These are two different things.
We have NOW a baseline for health insurance- and in facr there has been one for years. Yet people are losing coverage. Its against the law in the USA not to have health insurance. We place civil penalties on people who do not have health insurance. This all seems to fit the 'we are all in it together' schtick' and yet the system is crumbling. Would criminal penalties solve the problem?

Health insurance is like instant replay. It has been over 20 years practiced in the NFL, and they are still trying to figure it out. In the UK, is been about 70 years of national health insurance, and still people bicker about it.
 
Athanasius68 said:
You are not proposing to set up a baseline forhealthcare. You are suggesting setting a baseline for health insurance. These are two different things.
We have NOW a baseline for health insurance- and in facr there has been one for years. Yet people are losing coverage. Its against the law in the USA not to have health insurance. We place civil penalties on people who do not have health insurance. This all seems to fit the 'we are all in it together' schtick' and yet the system is crumbling. Would criminal penalties solve the problem?
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Nice dodge. But, yes, I support the mandate, it acts as a cost control on premiums. Sooner or later Republicans will own healthcare, so, they won't be able to cite their perceptions of PPACA as a crisis situation, much less an argument for anything they propose. Which will do nothing to help ordinary Americans.

Health insurance is like instant replay. It has been over 20 years practiced in the NFL, and they are still trying to figure it out. In the UK, is been about 70 years of national health insurance, and still people bicker about it.
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All countries who have single-payer healthcare, prefer single-payer healthcare to the U.S. system.
 
Anthony60 said:
Should men have to pay for a policy that covers gynecological exams and pre and post natal care?
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Should women have to pay for a policy that covers prostate cancer? They do!

But the answer to your hypothetical is IMO yes, of course, obviously, men should share in the costs of providing basic healthcare to pregnant women and their children. We men, like women, have a compelling interest in seeing that children are born into this world as healthy as possible, and if we agree that we have such an interest, we should agree that both men and women share in the burden of childbirth and pre and post natal care of the child.
 
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