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Protests of ICE after dozens arrested from overnight raids in Michigan....

ocean515 said:
I have no idea what you are talking about. Who gave a green card, and for no reason took it away?
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Didn't you read the article you posted? The man who was arrested is a green card holder.
 
ocean515 said:
LOL

Touched a nerve? I'm sorry you struggle to overcome facts, but that is your challenge to deal with.

I posted the facts, and you've posted, I don't know what, some kind of claim you think is relevant, that you can't even defend when asked.

That is the definition of poor strategy.
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Do you dispute that undocumented people are guaranteed due process under the 14th Am.?

And that conservatives who oppose this, oppose the Constitution. Because that's all I've said in this thread.
 
To Winston: The 14th amendment does not grant equal rights, but does grant some rights to those not citizens. However criminals have less rights than that. I do not feel that the constitution has been interpreted by the supreme court as I would have.

To MrPerson: The idea of wrongly deporting someone seems unlikely. Do you have citizen ship, greencard, visa, etc? If not, bye. There are no extenuating circumstances in these cases.

To Chillfolks: They are saying they should have been given time to lawyer up before the raids even happened.
 
ModerateRN said:
Do you have citizen ship, greencard, visa, etc? If not, bye. There are no extenuating circumstances in these cases.
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Well, this isn't one of those cases because the two people we know about are green card holders.
 
ModerateRN said:
To Winston: The 14th amendment does not grant equal rights, but does grant some rights to those not citizens. However criminals have less rights than that. I do not feel that the constitution has been interpreted by the supreme court as I would have.

To MrPerson: The idea of wrongly deporting someone seems unlikely. Do you have citizen ship, greencard, visa, etc? If not, bye. There are no extenuating circumstances in these cases.

To Chillfolks: They are saying they should have been given time to lawyer up before the raids even happened.
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Just so you know.....

Recent data suggests that in 2010 well over 4,000 US citizens were detained or deported as aliens, raising the total since 2003 to more than 20,000.

http://jacquelinestevens.org/StevensVSP18.32011.pdf


Diving Mullah
 
Winston said:
It's painfully clear to me that conservatives love to bloviate about smaller government, the enumerated powers, and sticking to the word in the Constitution, except when it gives undocumented immigrants rights they don't want them to have.
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It's painfully clear to me that Liberals and Progressives only care about illegal immigrants because they hope one day they will be given the right to vote and will vote in similar patterns that African Americans vote in.
 
ajn678 said:
It's painfully clear to me that Liberals and Progressives only care about illegal immigrants because they hope one day they will be given the right to vote and will vote in similar patterns that African Americans vote in.
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Whatever helps you sleep at night. I personally reject nationalism and accept economic benefits of population growth.
 
Diving Mullah said:
Just so you know.....

Recent data suggests that in 2010 well over 4,000 US citizens were detained or deported as aliens, raising the total since 2003 to more than 20,000.

http://jacquelinestevens.org/StevensVSP18.32011.pdf

Diving Mullah
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I stand corrected. I am actually floored that American Citizens can be deported. Wondering how that could possibly happen when it is such a simple process to show citizenship. Or have a record of citizenship made available.
 
Napoleon said:
Didn't you read the article you posted? The man who was arrested is a green card holder.
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A green card can easily be revoked under our laws, until they obtain citizenship they can be booted out at the whims of our federal govt.
 
Winston said:
Whatever helps you sleep at night. I personally reject nationalism and accept economic benefits of population growth.
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I understand your notion, but if an illegal is unwilling to abide by the laws to get into the country, how can I be sure they are paying their dues. They take advantage of the system, and put little to nothing back.
 
ModerateRN said:
I understand your notion, but if an illegal is unwilling to abide by the laws to get into the country, how can I be sure they are paying their dues. They take advantage of the system, and put little to nothing back.
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Illegal immigrants actually pay FICA and never collect benefits.
 
Winston said:
Whatever helps you sleep at night. I personally reject nationalism and accept economic benefits of population growth.
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Requesting that people that want to live in our nation do so through the legal means that we have provided is not nationalism. Its the foundation of a nation even existing.
 
ajn678 said:
Requesting that people that want to live in our nation do so through the legal means that we have provided is not nationalism. Its the foundation of a nation even existing.
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Right and many, many people agree with you. IMO, Trump should focus on illegal immigration because that's a battle he can win. I'm more for amnesty and citizenship. Because I think the benefits outweigh the costs and I don't believe the fear campaign.

One other thing that overlaps this issue of illegal immigration is the War on Drugs. I fully support ending it. But, that will never happen. Until conservatives can have a conversation about ending the war on drugs, the rhetoric against illegal criminals comes off as thinly veiled racism.
 
Winston said:
Illegal immigrants actually pay FICA and never collect benefits.
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As long as they are not paid under the table. Illegals can get emergency Medicare and have free schooling for their kids k-12.
 
ModerateRN said:
As long as they are not paid under the table. Illegals can get emergency Medicare and have free schooling for their kids k-12.
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Not necessarily. Property taxes generally pay for schools and illegal immigrants can and do own property. They can also rent property where the property tax is part of the cost of the rent.

Emergency Medicare? Care to elaborate?
 
Medicare coverage for emergency room visits. They are not eligible for Medicare, but the government gets stuck with the bill( or the hospital itself) if they have to go to the ER (and subsequent hospital admission).

At my particular hospital we have a regular who comes in for dialysis treatments, and admissions for noncompliance because he can't afford medications. I was talking with our social worker, and it was discussed the hospital has to keep picking up this bill.
 
ModerateRN said:
Hello,

So I live in Michigan and over the last 24-48 hours I have been getting updates about a local
story about ICE raids on Chaldean illegal immigrants. I bring this up because there are protests going on about these raids and individuals are interviewed complaining the illegals should have been given rights to get lawyers.

This particular issue really grinds my gears. I don't believe illegal immigrants deserve citizen rights. It was almost laughable to me that the families hiding the illegals should assume the process should go to the courts. The families should be lucky they were not arrested along with the illegals as some form of accessory. One family member mentioned that her brother was a good law-abiding person, and I'm screaming in my head "He was an ILLEGAL immigrant". The protestors took to the streets and impeded traffic for the busses that were carrying the illegals. I have strong feelings on this issue.


My $.02
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Chaldean? Is it too hard to say "Arab" nowadays?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaldea
 
ModerateRN said:
The story specifically mentioned Chaldeans, so I mentioned Chaldeans. Nothing nefarious here.
You may have to take your war against political correctness someplace else. Sorry :(
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Ah, yet another user of the victim card.

"Chaldean" is a rather obscure descriptor of a group which was never very powerful or influential. I would bet money that nine out of every ten people would have to look up what "Chaldea" is.
 
beerftw said:
A green card can easily be revoked under our laws, until they obtain citizenship they can be booted out at the whims of our federal govt.
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It's not quite that simple. It can be revoked for certain reasons by an immigration judge in a hearing. I doubt a judge is going to revoke this man's green card over a non-violent crime committed over a decade ago and for which he already served his time.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Ah, yet another user of the victim card.

"Chaldean" is a rather obscure descriptor of a group which was never very powerful or influential. I would bet money that nine out of every ten people would have to look up what "Chaldea" is.
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Victim Card? Care to share what a 'victim card' is? I was just pointing out your bravado to swoop in and insist we just call everyone Arab was in the wrong thread. I know I personally would be annoyed if someone called me Caucasian instead of American. I have patriotic pride that way. The story on the news specifically said the country of origin. There is nothing sinister in me calling them Chaldeans, I'm not enforcing some strict rules towards political correctness. Hence you should save your arguments for the alt-leftist who would enjoy fighting you on the issue.

And as for the 9 out of 10 individuals needing to look up what Chaldea is; I guess I would hope that people on this board have a little more intelligence than that :3oops:
 
Napoleon said:
It's not quite that simple. It can be revoked for certain reasons by an immigration judge in a hearing. I doubt a judge is going to revoke this man's green card over a non-violent crime committed over a decade ago and for which he already served his time.
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A green card can be revoked for any criminal activity by law. I could not find a single law requiring it be only by an immigration court, but rather what they can revoke it for, meaning ice could legally revoke a green card for any criminal activity, even the most minor offenses.
 
ModerateRN said:
Victim Card? Care to share what a 'victim card' is? I was just pointing out your bravado to swoop in and insist we just call everyone Arab was in the wrong thread. I know I personally would be annoyed if someone called me Caucasian instead of American. I have patriotic pride that way. The story on the news specifically said the country of origin. There is nothing sinister in me calling them Chaldeans, I'm not enforcing some strict rules towards political correctness. Hence you should save your arguments for the alt-leftist who would enjoy fighting you on the issue.

And as for the 9 out of 10 individuals needing to look up what Chaldea is; I guess I would hope that people on this board have a little more intelligence than that :3oops:
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Gee buddy, if "American" referred to a group which hadn't been a country or, well, much of anything for the past several hundred years I would bet somebody would definitely mention the group by a better designation.

"Patriotic pride"? "Chaldea" hasn't been a state for hundreds of years. It's like claiming somebody is a patriot of the "Free City of Kraków".

Ah, a perfect example. You crying about "political correctness" unprompted. And using the term "alt leftist" which is a pretty clear cut sign.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Gee buddy, if "American" referred to a group which hadn't been a country or, well, much of anything for the past several hundred years I would bet somebody would definitely mention the group by a better designation.

"Patriotic pride"? "Chaldea" hasn't been a state for hundreds of years. It's like claiming somebody is a patriot of the "Free City of Kraków".

Ah, a perfect example. You crying about "political correctness" unprompted. And using the term "alt leftist" which is a pretty clear cut sign.
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You seem pretty hardcore set that I'm defending being politically correct. I'm not 'crying' about political correctness; you were the one offended enough to actually post a reply not wanting them identified as Arab. I don't care what you want to call Arabs. It has nothing to do with this thread.
The 'Alt-Left' is the crowd you are looking to rile up, and I was advising you to go seek them out.
 
ModerateRN said:
You seem pretty hardcore set that I'm defending being politically correct. I'm not 'crying' about political correctness; you were the one offended enough to actually post a reply not wanting them identified as Arab. I don't care what you want to call Arabs. It has nothing to do with this thread.
The 'Alt-Left' is the crowd you are looking to rile up, and I was advising you to go seek them out.
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No, I'm pretty "hardcore set" that "political correctness" has nothing to do with this. There hasn't been a "Chaldea" for hundreds of years. It's obscure.

You seem to have failed miserably at basic reading because that's literally the exact opposite of what I said. I wonder why you dredged up an ancient geopolitical group when "Arab" is not only simpler but also likely more accurate.

You shrieking about the "alt left" is nonsensical, by the way.
 
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