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Trumpers: What Would it take for you to Approve of Impeachment?

jimithyashford said:
So, the purpose of this question is not to argue the details of any particular point, but merely to calibrate expectations and get of sense of where the Trumpers on this board are on the issue of Impeachment. Now back when Obama was President it seemed like someone on the right would shout "impeach" at the drop of a hat, in fact I feel like many of you were among them, but I'm not going to go back on search the records to prove it, so we'll set that aside for now.

So here is my question, and it's really very simple, and it should not be complicated to answer if you are just willing to be honest and forthright with your statements:

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump fired Comey with the intent of interfering with investigations into himself, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump did leak classified information to Russian agents, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump sought to change the Party platform on Crimea in exchange for Russian assistance in the election, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump ignored the normal vetting process and appointed Mike Flynn (or any other person) at the behest of Russia in exchange for personal or financial gain, would you support impeachment?


Again, I am not arguing where or not any of these things is true, but simply asking that if it is shown that any of these things are true to the normal standards of guilt in court, would you support impeachment?

If the answer is yes, then good, because most reasonable people would agree that any one of the above is grounds for impeachment let alone all of them.

If the answer no, then please paint me a picture of what it WOULD take for you to support impeachment.
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The Real question is: Since every allegation you list has either 0 evidence or has been dis-proven, when do we start impeaching and filing criminal charges against the Democrat politicians who made them?
 
jimithyashford said:
So.....it is flawed to say "If a person does X, then the response should be Y" or "If A is true then we should do B"

That's like....the most basic fundamental of law and order or planning or hell, basic human cognition?

If you're telling me it's fundamentally flawed to even ask the question "If Trump gave Russian say over appointments in exchange for political favors then would that be an impeachable offense?" then I dunno what to tell you man. I don't think we can have a productive conversation if you think the very concept of a "what if" question is inherently flawed.
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Nothing but speculation and lies promoted by the WaPo, NYTimes and Lefties everywhere. Soros puppets.
 
jimithyashford said:
Very impressive. You spent just shy of 100 words not actually answering the question at all.

I will try again.

Would any of the items I listed be impeachment worthy in your opinion if shown to be true?

If not, then what kind of offense WOULD you find impeachment worthy? Many of those items, if true, would meet the impeachment bar by most historical standards, but I would be interested in knowing what it takes to pique your impeachment interest.
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"How about actions actually worthy of impeachment."

Start there.
 
celticwar17 said:
First two aren't illegal. I don't think the investigations are legitimate and Comey has said many times he was not under investigation. I think it's a political game. The way you phrase it, is not the way I think the situation is in reality.

3rd one is probably impeachable, but I think democrats are equally guilty of it... and nothing happens to them, so I am less motivated to really care.

I am anti-leftist more than pro-Trump. There are a lot of things I don't like Trump about... but I'm not going to play the political games as if I have ANY allegiance to leftists. I'm picking lessor evils.
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I am no lawyer, and probably neither are you, so we are both making amateur assertions here, but I am pretty sure that firing Comey with the intent of disrupting an ongoing investigation (whether it is an investigation of yourself, or of your close associate and allies) then that's obstruction of justice. And if you assumption is that a President has carte blance authority to unilaterally share any classified information with any party he wants, I also do not believe that is true. Again, I'm not expert on the subject, but I am fairly certain that both of the first two are, in fact, illegal, not exactly minor infractions either.

Again, I am not arguing in this thread whether or not those things happened, just what the ramifications are/ought to be if they did.
 
Redress said:
Man, you are seriously ****ing pissed that a handful of people have stolen your gimmick! While it is ****ing hilarious watching you throw a hissy over people acting just the exact same way you did when Obama was in office, that does not make it any less "BORING".
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Please cite any time where I called for Obama's impeachment. Bonus if you can cite even a REFERENCE to impeachment prior to his election. Then your comments can be considered valid.

Thanks.
 
Casca XV said:
The Real question is: Since every allegation you list has either 0 evidence or has been dis-proven, when do we start impeaching and filing criminal charges against the Democrat politicians who made them?
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I was very careful to say in my OP that I am not here in this thread arguing about whether or not any of those claims are true. I am merely trying to ask conservatives what they WOULD think was the appropriate course of action if those things WERE true.

So, if any of those items in my list WERE true, and had evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, WOULD you then feel impeachment was appropriate.

In my mind that should be a fairly easy question. If any of those things were true about a candidate I voted for them yes, I would be extra mad that my candidate betrayed me and would certainly call for impeachment.

What about you?
 
jimithyashford said:
So, the purpose of this question is not to argue the details of any particular point, but merely to calibrate expectations and get of sense of where the Trumpers on this board are on the issue of Impeachment. Now back when Obama was President it seemed like someone on the right would shout "impeach" at the drop of a hat, in fact I feel like many of you were among them, but I'm not going to go back on search the records to prove it, so we'll set that aside for now.

So here is my question, and it's really very simple, and it should not be complicated to answer if you are just willing to be honest and forthright with your statements:

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump fired Comey with the intent of interfering with investigations into himself, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump did leak classified information to Russian agents, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump sought to change the Party platform on Crimea in exchange for Russian assistance in the election, would you support impeachment?

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump ignored the normal vetting process and appointed Mike Flynn (or any other person) at the behest of Russia in exchange for personal or financial gain, would you support impeachment?


Again, I am not arguing where or not any of these things is true, but simply asking that if it is shown that any of these things are true to the normal standards of guilt in court, would you support impeachment?

If the answer is yes, then good, because most reasonable people would agree that any one of the above is grounds for impeachment let alone all of them.

If the answer no, then please paint me a picture of what it WOULD take for you to support impeachment.
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actual evidence of wrongdoing?
that would be a start.

yet since they can't even get that off the ground I am not worried about it to much.
 
Mario said:
Nothing but speculation and lies promoted by the WaPo, NYTimes and Lefties everywhere. Soros puppets.
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If any of those items I listed in the OP were true, and had evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, would you support impeachment.

If you are prepared to answer that question, please do. If you are absolutely unable or unwilling to answer what seems to me to be a fairly strait forward hypothetical, then you may excuse yourself from the conversation. You do not have to participate if you don't want to.
 
jimithyashford said:
I am no lawyer, and probably neither are you, so we are both making amateur assertions here, but I am pretty sure that firing Comey with the intent of disrupting an ongoing investigation (whether it is an investigation of yourself, or of your close associate and allies) then that's obstruction of justice. And if you assumption is that a President has carte blance authority to unilaterally share any classified information with any party he wants, I also do not believe that is true. Again, I'm not expert on the subject, but I am fairly certain that both of the first two are, in fact, illegal, not exactly minor infractions either.

Again, I am not arguing in this thread whether or not those things happened, just what the ramifications are/ought to be if they did.
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He certainly is allowed to disclose classified information to other nations if he deems fit. If him doing so is later to be found traitorous by malicious intent against the country... that's where it becomes illegal.

President can fire the FBI director. I don't understand the notion that this actually does anything about any investigation... just because Comey is gone, doesn't mean the FBI stops doing it's job or that all previous investigations stop. If the only reason a investigation was going was because of Comey.... well than that would mean it was more political than legitimate anyway.
 
VanceMack said:
"How about actions actually worthy of impeachment."

Start there.
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Dude, I am asking YOU to provide ME with an example of such actions that you would feel compelled to impeach over. You do understand how a question works. I am asking YOU to give ME an example because I do not know what you think is impeachment worthy. If I did know your mind I wouldn't need to ask.

If you actually just flat out cannot think of a single example, then you are free to go, you don't have to participate in the conversation.

Most normal educated people would not have a hard time answering this question or elaborating on what they would deem impeachable behavior in a given scenario. Why you don't seem to be able to, I dunno.

Isn't this your schtick? I feel like I've done this dance with you before, where you are asked a fairly strait forward question and you spend thousands of words and numerous back and forths categorically refusing to answer rather than just providing a strait answer.

I'm not playing that game with you.
 
I agree that Trump can be reckless, but what are the chances that he truly and honestly just threw classified information in Russia's face and said "Here you go." without any remorse, or rational thought. You're discussing it as if he accidentally gave out the information, or just closed his eyes and took a shot in the dark with all of this. Please do tell, how could anyone just give away classified information, classified NATIONAL information to a country that we may be in war with in the future, on "accident"
 
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ludin said:
actual evidence of wrongdoing?
that would be a start.

yet since they can't even get that off the ground I am not worried about it to much.
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Can you actually answer the question? If any of those items turned out to be true and have evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, would you support impeachment?

I am not asking if you think it's likely, or if you believe these things did happen, I am asking what you would do IF they were true, and if you would not impeach, then what is your standard for an impeachable offense.

Are you prepared to answer those questions or not?
 
jimithyashford said:
Can you actually answer the question? If any of those items turned out to be true and have evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, would you support impeachment?

I am not asking if you think it's likely, or if you believe these things did happen, I am asking what you would do IF they were true, and if you would not impeach, then what is your standard for an impeachable offense.

Are you prepared to answer those questions or not?
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you obviously didn't read my post.
show me some actual evidence first.

it wasn't that hard to understand.

impeachment of a president is a serious thing. you had better have a lot of supporting evidence.
so far there is nothing.
 
celticwar17 said:
He certainly is allowed to disclose classified information to other nations if he deems fit. If him doing so is later to be found traitorous by malicious intent against the country... that's where it becomes illegal.

President can fire the FBI director. I don't understand the notion that this actually does anything about any investigation... just because Comey is gone, doesn't mean the FBI stops doing it's job or that all previous investigations stop. If the only reason a investigation was going was because of Comey.... well than that would mean it was more political than legitimate anyway.
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Again, I'm no lawyer, and clearly neither are you, but I think your grasp of legality of the situation is lacking. No, the president cannot just unilaterally reveal anything he wants to anyone. And yes a firing of a chief investigator to stymie and investigation is obstruction of justice, that is not up for debate, the up for debate part is whether or not that was part of the intent of this firing. Also if you do not understand how firing of a director could impede the progress of that which he directs, then I think you need to reexamine the notion of what a director is.

But since neither of us is knowledgeable enough to cite constitutional law or legal precedent, I cannot argue past this point.
 
ludin said:
you obviously didn't read my post.
show me some actual evidence first.

it wasn't that hard to understand.

impeachment of a president is a serious thing. you had better have a lot of supporting evidence.
so far there is nothing.
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I read your post, you must not have read mine. I clearly stated in the OP that my interest in this thread is NOT, repeat NOT to hash out whether or not any of these things DID happen, but to get a sense of what Trump supporters think is the appropriate action to take IF they DID happen, as in a hypothetical.

If you are utterly unwilling to entertain a hypothetical and answer the question, that if fine, you don't have to participate.


For the record, I can say without even a moment's hesitation that if a candidate I voted for did any of those things, I would support impeachment, and be doubly angry about it because they betrayed me as a person who voted for them.

You hesitance to even entertain the notion on your side is alarming, but it wouldn't be the first time conversations on the forum left me deeply disappointed in my people.
 
jimithyashford said:
I read your post, you must not have read mine. I clearly stated in the OP that my interest in this thread is NOT, repeat NOT to hash out whether or not any of these things DID happen, but to get a sense of what Trump supporters think is the appropriate action to take IF they DID happen, as in a hypothetical.

If you are utterly unwilling to entertain a hypothetical and answer the question, that if fine, you don't have to participate.


For the record, I can say without even a moment's hesitation that if a candidate I voted for did any of those things, I would support impeachment, and be doubly angry about it because they betrayed me as a person who voted for them.

You hesitance to even entertain the notion on your side is alarming, but it wouldn't be the first time conversations on the forum left me deeply disappointed in my people.
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if there is evidence that he committed high crimes of office then like any other president he should be put up for impeachment.
as I said in my post.

your inability to understand this is what is alarming.

I don't convict people on hypotheticals. neither does anyone else but you do evidently.
 
RepublicanProud said:
I agree that Trump can be reckless, but what are the chances that he truly and honestly just threw classified information in Russia's face and said "Here you go." without any remorse, or rational thought. You're discussing it as if he accidentally gave out the information, or just closed his eyes and took a shot in the dark with all of this. Please do tell, how could anyone just give away classified information, classified NATIONAL information to a country that we may be in war with in the future, on "accident"
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Normally I would say the chances of that are very slim, but then again a year ago I would have said the chances that a man could get within throwing distance of the White House having said half the **** Trump's said were very slim. All historical precedence and standards and expectations for what a president will or wont say or get away with saying has gone completely out the window with this man. You have to admit that.
 
jimithyashford said:
If any of those items I listed in the OP were true, and had evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, would you support impeachment.

If you are prepared to answer that question, please do. If you are absolutely unable or unwilling to answer what seems to me to be a fairly strait forward hypothetical, then you may excuse yourself from the conversation. You do not have to participate if you don't want to.
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What is the problem, you can't handle dissent?
 
ludin said:
if there is evidence that he committed high crimes of office then like any other president he should be put up for impeachment.
as I said in my post.

your inability to understand this is what is alarming.

I don't convict people on hypotheticals. neither does anyone else but you do evidently.
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I am not asking about a nebulous concept of high crimes of office, I am asking about those particular items. So perhaps to word it differently, do those items I listed in the OP constitute high crimes of office to you? If not, then please provide some examples of what would.

And yes, I understood your very generalized and non-committal answer. That is not the purpose of this thread. The purpose of this thread is to address those specific infractions I listed at the start. I would appreciate your pointed and direct assessment of the impeachablility of those discreet scenarios. Again, you don't have to if you don't want to, but those are the questions I am asking that I am looking for an answer to.
 
Mario said:
What is the problem, you can't handle dissent?
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I'm fine with dissent. Dissent all you want, as long as you also answer the question. If you just answer the question then by all means dissent to your heart's content. But if you don't want to answer the question I find it very weird you would even comment on a thread asking for an answer to those questions in the first place.....seems like a waste of everyone's time.
 
I would like to point out that we are now 46 replies into this thread and not a single Conservative has been willing to just say that Yes, if Trump actually did any of those things, they would feel impeachment is appropriate.

Who here thinks that is Obama or Hillary had done any of those things that it would take 46 replies deep to get even a single conservative to say that impeachment was warranted?
 
jimithyashford said:
I was very careful to say in my OP that I am not here in this thread arguing about whether or not any of those claims are true. I am merely trying to ask conservatives what they WOULD think was the appropriate course of action if those things WERE true.

So, if any of those items in my list WERE true, and had evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, WOULD you then feel impeachment was appropriate.

In my mind that should be a fairly easy question. If any of those things were true about a candidate I voted for them yes, I would be extra mad that my candidate betrayed me and would certainly call for impeachment.

What about you?
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Your question is invalid. It's the equivalent of taking some average law abiding citizen and asking: "what would it take to put this guy in prison"?

My question on the other hand has some validity: while after a year of the most intense FBI investigation in US History reveals 0 evidence of Trump Russia collusion, it has shown that every law broken and every real lie told were by Democrats against Trump.

The entire allegation itself is the biggest most transparent political lie in US history. How it was born:

1. last summer intelligence agencies announced there was a 99% chance 5 countries including Russia hacked every piece of information on Hillary's computer server (which would be the biggest intelligence loss in US history).

2. In July Trump gives a speech where he jokes "Hay Russia if you have the Emails Hillary illegally destroyed make them public". (If he had anything secretly going on with Russia he would have never said anything like that).

3. Hillary and the Democrats having nothing else used that joke to create the lie that the Russians hacked the election and colluded with Trump.
 
Mario said:
The problem with your entire line of thought is that it is based on "if". Flawed from the get go.
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>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump fired Comey with the intent of interfering with investigations into himself, would you support impeachment?

Nope - any president can fire the director of the FBI. Obama should have fired him last summer.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump did leak classified information to Russian agents, would you support impeachment?

Nope with caveat - details matter, don't think the implied current details qualify for impeachment.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump sought to change the Party platform on Crimea in exchange for Russian assistance in the election, would you support impeachment?

Nope - The martians would like to borrow your tin foil hat, however.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump ignored the normal vetting process and appointed Mike Flynn (or any other person) at the behest of Russia in exchange for personal or financial gain, would you support impeachment?

Nope - political favors happen all the time without impeachment. All federal employees are inherently vetted via the application process, you don't even get a senate hearing for your confirmation without it. Your question is inherently flawed.

1 example of what it would take to impeach - Trump uses voting records to round up all of the registered democrats in the US and send them to Russia in exchange for a tub of caviar. Clearly an impeachable offense. All of the democrats are worth more than 1 tub of caviar.
 
Nuber said:
>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump fired Comey with the intent of interfering with investigations into himself, would you support impeachment?

Nope - any president can fire the director of the FBI. Obama should have fired him last summer.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump did leak classified information to Russian agents, would you support impeachment?

Nope with caveat - details matter, don't think the implied current details qualify for impeachment.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump sought to change the Party platform on Crimea in exchange for Russian assistance in the election, would you support impeachment?

Nope - The martians would like to borrow your tin foil hat, however.

>If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump ignored the normal vetting process and appointed Mike Flynn (or any other person) at the behest of Russia in exchange for personal or financial gain, would you support impeachment?

Nope - political favors happen all the time without impeachment. All federal employees are inherently vetted via the application process, you don't even get a senate hearing for your confirmation without it. Your question is inherently flawed.

1 example of what it would take to impeach - Trump uses voting records to round up all of the registered democrats in the US and send them to Russia in exchange for a tub of caviar. Clearly an impeachable offense. All of the democrats are worth more than 1 tub of caviar.
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Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! Well played.
 
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