Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate[W:2704]

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

So desperate for a "Win" you resort to STRAWMAN arguments.

All dictionaries presented so far have a variation of Legal and or Lawful equals LEGITIMATE.

Reread the post you responded to and try this time to truthfully respond.

Click to expand...

You were wrong. I have presented two different sources with eleven different definitions for LEGITIMATE and a clear majority of seven do not contain the words lawful or legal.

Yes, there are different ones that do contain the words lawful or legal?

So what?

They also contain definitions that talk about the difference between types of theater or entertainment and that does not apply to the context and usage of the term LEGITIMATE in this discussion or in my position about Trumps legitimacy. It is irrelevant how many different definitions there may be to a word as the only relevant one is the one that is appropriate to usage and context.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago as well since it was previously explained to you over and over and over and over again in many posts.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

You were wrong. I have presented two different sources with eleven different definitions for LEGITIMATE and a clear majority of seven do not contain the words lawful or legal.

Yes, there are different ones that do contain the words lawful or legal?

So what?

They also contain definitions that talk about the difference between types of theater or entertainment and that does not apply to the context and usage of the term LEGITIMATE in this discussion or in my position about Trumps legitimacy. It is irrelevant how many different definitions there may be to a word as the only relevant one is the one that is appropriate to usage and context.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago as well since it was previously explained to you over and over and over and over again in many posts.

Click to expand...

Legal = Legitimate

Lawful = Legitimate

LEGITIMATE.

The election was LEGAL.

The election was LAWFUL.

The election was LEGITIMATE.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

You were wrong. I have presented two different sources with eleven different definitions for LEGITIMATE and a clear majority of seven do not contain the words lawful or legal.

Yes, there are different ones that do contain the words lawful or legal?

So what?

They also contain definitions that talk about the difference between types of theater or entertainment and that does not apply to the context and usage of the term LEGITIMATE in this discussion or in my position about Trumps legitimacy. It is irrelevant how many different definitions there may be to a word as the only relevant one is the one that is appropriate to usage and context.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago as well since it was previously explained to you over and over and over and over again in many posts.

Click to expand...

Another example of vebal diarrhea that does not address the post one is supposedly responding to.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

I provided for you the previously cited definition of LEGITIMATE from Merriam-Webster in which five were given. Only in two of them do the words LAWFUL or LEGAL appear. In three of the five , there is no mention of LAWFUL nor LEGAL.

So you are wrong that they are present in ALL of the definitions of LEGITIMATE.

Here is another source - YOUR DICTIONARY

Legitimate dictionary definition | legitimate defined

It provides six definitions - FOUR of them do NOT contain the words LEGAL nor LAWFUL.


Read more at Legitimate dictionary definition | legitimate defined

Merriam-Webster.... three out of five do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.
Your Dictionary .... four out of the six do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.

Added together that is seven out of eleven - a clear majority - of the definitions of LEGITIMATE which do not contain the words legal or lawful in them.

You are clearly wrong and it has been conclusively proven.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago.

Click to expand...

Hey look, another post edited post response.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

Legal = Legitimate

Lawful = Legitimate

LEGITIMATE.

The election was LEGAL.

The election was LAWFUL.

The election was LEGITIMATE.

Click to expand...

That has already been refuted.

Why are you repeating what has already been refuted?

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

Hey look, another post edited post response.

Click to expand...

Take it up with the authorities who run this site as it permits just what you criticized.

I am sure that you realize that people have a limited time to go back and refine a post after they see it in print and this is often done at the same time you or someone else may be typing a reply to it. That is simply the function of both the way the site operates and time itself.

There is nothing wrong or dishonest or nefarious or evil about it.

If you feel there is, take it up with the people who run the site and make the rules.

In the meantime we have definitive proof that you claim is FALSE on its face and many definitions of LEGITIMATE do NOT have the terms lawful or legal as part of it. In fact, a majority of those in two major sources do not contain that.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

That has already been refuted.

Why are you repeating what has already been refuted?

Click to expand...

What has been "refuted"?

Was the election LEGAL? Is that refuted?

Was the election LAWFUL? Is that refuted?

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Take it up with the authorities who run this site as it permits just what you criticized.

I am sure that you realize that people have a limited time to go back and refine a post after they see it in print and this is often done at the same time you or someone else may be typing a reply to it. That is simply the function of both the way the site operates and time itself.

There is nothing wrong or dishonest or nefarious or evil about it.

If you feel there is, take it up with the people who run the site and make the rules.

In the meantime we have definitive proof that you claim is FALSE on its face and many definitions of LEGITIMATE do NOT have the terms lawful or legal as part of it. In fact, a majority of those in two major sources do not contain that.

Click to expand...

Trends....,

When one trends towards dishonesty expect suspicion.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

What has been "refuted"?

Was the election LEGAL? Is that refuted?

Was the election LAWFUL? Is that refuted?

Click to expand...

You are again repeating what has already been refuted.

here is your claim of alleged fact

Legal = Legitimate

Lawful = Legitimate

Click to expand...

Legal can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

Lawful can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

When you present something that borrows from arithmetic and present it as words - it is presenting an intellectually false picture.

Two plus two will always equal four. 2 + 2 = 4.
But LEGAL is not always the meaning of LEGITIMATE as we have found it in various dictionaries cited here.
So it is dishonest to present the claim that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE.
It is dishonest to present the claim the LEGAL = LEGITIMATE.

This was shown to you many times in many posts and you still keep repeating what has already been refuted.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

You are again repeating what has already been refuted.

here is your claim of alleged fact



Legal can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

Lawful can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

When you present something that borrows from arithmetic and present it as words - it is presenting an intellectually false picture.

Two plus two will always equal four. 2 + 2 + 4.
But LEGAL is not always the meaning of LEGITIMATE as we have found it in various dictionaries cited here.
So it is dishonest to present the claim that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE.
It is dishonest to present the claim the LEGAL = LEGITIMATE.

This was shown to you many times in many posts and you still keep repeating what has already been refuted.

Click to expand...

WHAT has been "refuted"?

The election being LEGAL? Where was that refuted?

The election being LAWFUL? Where was that refuted?

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

WHAT has been "refuted"?

The election being LEGAL? Where was that refuted?

The election being LAWFUL? Where was that refuted?

Click to expand...

Why do you get yourself in this endless loop of repeating questions that have already been thoroughly answered?

Do you believe that the rest of the world cannot read what was already presented to you and crushed and flushed your earlier claims?

Legal can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

Lawful can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

When you present something that borrows from arithmetic and present it as words - it is presenting an intellectually false picture.

Two plus two will always equal four. 2 + 2 = 4.
But LEGAL is not always the meaning of LEGITIMATE as we have found it in various dictionaries cited here.
So it is dishonest to present the claim that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE.
It is dishonest to present the claim the LEGAL = LEGITIMATE.

This was shown to you many times in many posts and you still keep repeating what has already been refuted.

I provided for you the previously cited definition of LEGITIMATE from Merriam-Webster in which five were given. Only in two of them do the words LAWFUL or LEGAL appear. In three of the five , there is no mention of LAWFUL nor LEGAL.

So you are wrong that they are present in ALL of the definitions of LEGITIMATE.

another source - YOUR DICTIONARY provides six definitions - FOUR of them do NOT contain the words LEGAL nor LAWFUL.


Merriam-Webster.... three out of five do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.
Your Dictionary .... four out of the six do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.

Added together that is seven out of eleven - a clear majority - of the definitions of LEGITIMATE which do not contain the words legal or lawful in them.

You are clearly wrong and it has been conclusively proven.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Why do you get yourself in this endless loop of repeating questions that have already been thoroughly answered?

Do you believe that the rest of the world cannot read what was already presented to you and crushed and flushed your earlier claims?

Legal can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

Lawful can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

When you present something that borrows from arithmetic and present it as words - it is presenting an intellectually false picture.

Two plus two will always equal four. 2 + 2 = 4.
But LEGAL is not always the meaning of LEGITIMATE as we have found it in various dictionaries cited here.
So it is dishonest to present the claim that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE.
It is dishonest to present the claim the LEGAL = LEGITIMATE.

This was shown to you many times in many posts and you still keep repeating what has already been refuted.

I provided for you the previously cited definition of LEGITIMATE from Merriam-Webster in which five were given. Only in two of them do the words LAWFUL or LEGAL appear. In three of the five , there is no mention of LAWFUL nor LEGAL.

So you are wrong that they are present in ALL of the definitions of LEGITIMATE.

another source - YOUR DICTIONARY provides six definitions - FOUR of them do NOT contain the words LEGAL nor LAWFUL.


Merriam-Webster.... three out of five do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.
Your Dictionary .... four out of the six do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.

Added together that is seven out of eleven - a clear majority - of the definitions of LEGITIMATE which do not contain the words legal or lawful in them.

You are clearly wrong and it has been conclusively proven.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago.

Click to expand...

I haven't seen them answered, except for your twisted opinions, no proof. The only proof you have offered is either your own twisted opinions of the facts or someone else's twisted opinions of the facts. If that is all you've got then at least own up to it.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Moderate Right said:

I haven't seen them answered,

Click to expand...

Be specific... what is THEM that you claim I have not answered. Tell me exactly what it is and I will answer it directly and forcefully.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Why do you get yourself in this endless loop of repeating questions that have already been thoroughly answered?

Do you believe that the rest of the world cannot read what was already presented to you and crushed and flushed your earlier claims?

Legal can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

Lawful can indeed mean the same as legitimate depending on its usage and context as to how it is used.
However, it is not always the case and can mean something different depending on its usage and context.

When you present something that borrows from arithmetic and present it as words - it is presenting an intellectually false picture.

Two plus two will always equal four. 2 + 2 = 4.
But LEGAL is not always the meaning of LEGITIMATE as we have found it in various dictionaries cited here.
So it is dishonest to present the claim that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE.
It is dishonest to present the claim the LEGAL = LEGITIMATE.

This was shown to you many times in many posts and you still keep repeating what has already been refuted.

I provided for you the previously cited definition of LEGITIMATE from Merriam-Webster in which five were given. Only in two of them do the words LAWFUL or LEGAL appear. In three of the five , there is no mention of LAWFUL nor LEGAL.

So you are wrong that they are present in ALL of the definitions of LEGITIMATE.

another source - YOUR DICTIONARY provides six definitions - FOUR of them do NOT contain the words LEGAL nor LAWFUL.


Merriam-Webster.... three out of five do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.
Your Dictionary .... four out of the six do NOT contain the words legal or lawful.

Added together that is seven out of eleven - a clear majority - of the definitions of LEGITIMATE which do not contain the words legal or lawful in them.

You are clearly wrong and it has been conclusively proven.

Of course, you knew this weeks ago.

Click to expand...

All that typing....

The election being LEGAL. HAS THAT BEEN REFUTED? Yes or No.

The election being LAWFUL. HAS THAT BEEN REFUTED? Yes or No.

Very simple YES/NO questions.

YES it has been refuted. NO it has not bewn refuted.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Be specific... what is THEM that you claim I have not answered. Tell me exactly what it is and I will answer it directly and forcefully.

Click to expand...

Start with Post #2585

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Be specific... what is THEM that you claim I have not answered. Tell me exactly what it is and I will answer it directly and forcefully.

Click to expand...

Of course you will. And, you're still claiming that Trump invited the Russians into the elections when the Russians had already been wanting to do something to make Americans lose faith in the election system long before and then along comes haymarket claiming that the election was not legitimate. I'm starting to think it is actually YOU who is the Commie spy, Comrad Haymarket.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

All that typing....

The election being LEGAL. HAS THAT BEEN REFUTED? Yes or No.

The election being LAWFUL. HAS THAT BEEN REFUTED? Yes or No.

Very simple YES/NO questions.

YES it has been refuted. NO it has not bewn refuted.

Click to expand...

What has been refuted is that something can be LEGAL but not be LEGITIMATE by definition and that definition has been provided.

What has been refuted is that something can be LAWFUL but not be LEGITIMATE by definition and that definition has been provided.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LEGAL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Some thing can be both LAWFUL and LEGAL and still be ILLEGITIMATE and definitions have been provided to support that.

But then You know that. You have know that for many weeks now. All that has been presented to you time and time and time again but you still pretend it has not and you still repeat the same material that has already been thoroughly and completely refuted.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

What has been refuted is that something can be LEGAL but not be LEGITIMATE by definition and that definition has been provided.

What has been refuted is that something can be LAWFUL but not be LEGITIMATE by definition and that definition has been provided.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LEGAL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Some thing can be both LAWFUL and LEGAL and still be ILLEGITIMATE and definitions have been provided to support that.

But then You know that. You have know that for many weeks now. All that has been presented to you time and time and time again but you still pretend it has not and you still repeat the same material that has already been thoroughly and completely refuted.

Click to expand...

The election was LEGAL.

The election was LAWFUL.

Therefore the election was LEGITIMATE in accordance with every dictionary presented so far,

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Moderate Right said:

Of course you will. And, you're still claiming that Trump invited the Russians into the elections when the Russians had already been wanting to do something to make Americans lose faith in the election system long before and then along comes haymarket claiming that the election was not legitimate. I'm starting to think it is actually YOU who is the Commie spy, Comrad Haymarket.

Click to expand...

So you cannot come up with anything that I have not already refuted. Got it.

Regarding American losing faith in the election system:

1 - the Electoral College contains a serious flaw which permits the loser of the popular vote to win the office and that is the mechanism that causes American to lose faith in our system. That is not my fault - I merely report upon it.

2- Comey issued his letter two weeks before the election and did much damage to Clinton with the appearance of wrongdoing which was subsequently cleared just two days before the election date. Unfortunately for Clinton, some 15 million or more people voted during that ten day period when Trump was making the Comey letter a front and center piece of his campaign. Sadly, we have both the Hatch Act and Department of Justice protocols which bar such involvement by Comey.

3 - The Russians did inject themselves in our election and Trump used the Wikileaks on the last month of the campaign trail over 160 times to try and damage Clinton. To pretend that this did not impact voters is the ultimate game of ostrich and denial and puts campaign activities into the land of madness to think anything otherwise.

I did not create any of those things which damaged Americans faith in the election process.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

The election was LEGAL.

The election was LAWFUL.

Therefore the election was LEGITIMATE in accordance with every dictionary presented so far,

Click to expand...

Your THEREFORE is where your train jumped the rails and left the tracks.

our fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LEGAL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Some thing can be both LAWFUL and LEGAL and still be ILLEGITIMATE and definitions have been provided to support that.

But then you know this and you know it well and you have been reduced to simply repeating the same thoroughly refuted mantra over and over again.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Your THEREFORE is where your train jumped the rails and left the tracks.

our fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LEGAL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Some thing can be both LAWFUL and LEGAL and still be ILLEGITIMATE and definitions have been provided to support that.

But then you know this and you know it well and you have been reduced to simply repeating the same thoroughly refuted mantra over and over again.

Click to expand...

Wrong.

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

Your THEREFORE is where your train jumped the rails and left the tracks.

our fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LAWFUL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Your fallacy is the presentation of a false statement that LEGAL = LEGITIMATE. It does not always have that property. Unlike 2 + 2 = 4 whose values do not change and are constant , what is considered as LEGITIMATE does not have constant values and those values and and do change.

Some thing can be both LAWFUL and LEGAL and still be ILLEGITIMATE and definitions have been provided to support that.

But then you know this and you know it well and you have been reduced to simply repeating the same thoroughly refuted mantra over and over again.

Click to expand...

What definition of LEGITIMATE is shared by all of the dictionaries presented so far?

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

haymarket said:

So you cannot come up with anything that I have not already refuted. Got it.

Regarding American losing faith in the election system:

1 - the Electoral College contains a serious flaw which permits the loser of the popular vote to win the office and that is the mechanism that causes American to lose faith in our system. That is not my fault - I merely report upon it.

2- Comey issued his letter two weeks before the election and did much damage to Clinton with the appearance of wrongdoing which was subsequently cleared just two days before the election date. Unfortunately for Clinton, some 15 million or more people voted during that ten day period when Trump was making the Comey letter a front and center piece of his campaign. Sadly, we have both the Hatch Act and Department of Justice protocols which bar such involvement by Comey.

3 - The Russians did inject themselves in our election and Trump used the Wikileaks on the last month of the campaign trail over 160 times to try and damage Clinton. To pretend that this did not impact voters is the ultimate game of ostrich and denial and puts campaign activities into the land of madness to think anything otherwise.

I did not create any of those things which damaged Americans faith in the election process.

Click to expand...

1. Opinion

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

Start with Post #2585

Click to expand...

I answered that in 2586

Re: Majority of Young Americans View Trump as Illegitimate

Fledermaus said:

1. Opinion

Click to expand...

Within that opinion - just as in most in debate - are facts and truth. To pretend that you c an dismiss a refutation of your claims by saying it is just opinion is beyond ridiculous. I would have loved it if when I debated in college somebody got up for their five or ten minutes and said WELL THATS JUST YOUR OPINION and sat down.

But that is what you just did.