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First Carrier, Then Ford, Now Fiat

azgreg said:
I'm sorry sir but that kind of talk will violate the partisan clause of this forum.
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I can't tell if you are kidding or not. If not, I"m glad to violate the partisan clause. I think we probably need more of the same.
 
eohrnberger said:
I can't tell if you are kidding or not. If not, I"m glad to violate the partisan clause. I think we probably need more of the same.
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There is plenty of disagreement along partisan lines that will never resolve themselves. So, I always figure. Why invent reasons to be partisan?
 
calamity said:
There is plenty of disagreement along partisan lines that will never resolve themselves. So, I always figure. Why invent reasons to be partisan?
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You don't think that with a little bit of being magnanimous that you could diffuse at least some of the partisanship?
 
eohrnberger said:
You don't think that with a little bit of being magnanimous that you could diffuse at least some of the partisanship?
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I'm usually not in that kind of mood :)

I think I come here to offend liberals and piss off conservatives, when I really think about it. But, once in a blue moon, I actually find something I agree with that does neither or only one of the two.
 
calamity said:
I'm usually not in that kind of mood :)

I think I come here to offend liberals and piss off conservatives, when I really think about it. But, once in a blue moon, I actually find something I agree with that does neither or only one of the two.
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I'm sorry that you usually don't find yourself in that kind of a mood. I hope you find your blue moon more often. Don't you think you deserve that?
 
eohrnberger said:
I'm sorry that you usually don't find yourself in that kind of a mood. I hope you find your blue moon more often. Don't you think you deserve that?
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To be blunt, too often the jokes write themselves. And that Liberals get offended and conservatives pissed when I point out the stupidity in this or that is really not my problem. It just is how it is.
 
calamity said:
To be blunt, too often the jokes write themselves. And that Liberals get offended and conservatives pissed when I point out the stupidity in this or that is really not my problem. It just is how it is.
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About as fair as it's gonna I get, I guess.
 
Chomsky said:
Trump's attempt to save 2000 Carrier jobs, resulted in over half of them still leaving the country. So he reduced the flow, but didn't get them to stay, much less get them to bring other jobs back. And it cost taxpayer monies. So this isn't quite so easy.

However, any move in the right direction is a good one IMO, so I herald them.
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He at least gave it a shot, and that is what counts the most. It would've been better if they all stayed here, but at least making the attempt is better then doing nothing.
 
eohrnberger said:
About as fair as it's gonna I get, I guess.
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I was pleasantly surprised to find the article in the OP because it was actually something positive, and it also pertains to me personally. I was sort of hoping Trump in office would play out this way. I'm glad it actually is.

So, for an anti-Trumper like me, that is simply an awesome development. Like I said, there will be plenty that he does which I will despise, I am sure. But, this is definitely something positive that I can rally behind.
 
calamity said:
I was pleasantly surprised to find the article in the OP because it was actually something positive, and it also pertains to me personally. I was sort of hoping Trump in office would play out this way. I'm glad it actually is.

So, for an anti-Trumper like me, that is simply an awesome development. Like I said, there will be plenty that he does which I will despise, I am sure. But, this is definitely something positive that I can rally behind.
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Hey Calamity, I'm glad for you and your improved prospects. Just want to wish you well in them, and am confident your efforts will be justly rewarded.
 
eohrnberger said:
Hey Calamity, I'm glad for you and your improved prospects. Just want to wish you well in them, and am confident your efforts will be justly rewarded.
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IMO, even a liberal would have to see the information in the op as a positive. As a non-partisan, "show me the results" kind of guy, I certainly do. Trump has had an immediate impact in my business. And, that is nothing short of amazing.
 
calamity said:
IMO, even a liberal would have to see the information in the op as a positive. As a non-partisan, "show me the results" kind of guy, I certainly do. Trump has had an immediate impact in my business. And, that is nothing short of amazing.
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I agree. Nothing short of amazing, and he's not even in office yet.

I hope that he can deliver an also 'nothing short of amazing' performance when it comes to working with congress, and generating bipartisan support for his agenda. This, I think, would go a long way in healing and unifying the country, which it's sorely in need of.
 
eohrnberger said:
I agree. Nothing short of amazing, and he's not even in office yet.

I hope that he can deliver an also 'nothing short of amazing' performance when it comes to working with congress, and generating bipartisan support for his agenda. This, I think, would go a long way in healing and unifying the country, which it's sorely in need of.
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The people used to having their way will put up a big fight and make lots of noise. With Trump becoming president, and not Hillary, political power in this country will shift away from special interests like Women, LGBT, ethnic and racial minorities, Hollywood, Lawyers, Washington DC, Consumers, and Importers. Instead, it will inch over to the non college educated, the craftsman, the miner, the builder, the oil driller, the manufacturing associate and others who work with their hands. I think we need some of that balance to stop us from being a country where everyone either has their hand out or in someone else's pocket. IMHO, that change is a good thing.


What I found interesting was that the USA gradually becoming a country which no longer makes things received so little attention, until now. It's like the power structure, R and D, completely ignored the American working person in their zeal to get cheap goods from other countries. We, as a nation, did a disservice to those who make things. And, now, those people are fighting back---Trump is a reflection of that.
 
calamity said:
The people used to having their way will put up a big fight and make lots of noise. With Trump becoming president, and not Hillary, political power in this country will shift away from special interests like Women, LGBT, ethnic and racial minorities, Hollywood, Lawyers, Washington DC, Consumers, and Importers. Instead, it will inch over to the non college educated, the craftsman, the miner, the builder, the oil driller, the manufacturing associate and others who work with their hands. I think we need some of that balance to stop us from being a country where everyone either has their hand out or in someone else's pocket. IMHO, that change is a good thing.
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Agreed. And look at how the elite are reacting! Their heads are exploding that the rest of the nation would have the temerity to go to the polls and basically vote them out. Delicious.

calamity said:
What I found interesting was that the USA gradually becoming a country which no longer makes things received so little attention, until now. It's like the power structure, R and D, completely ignored the American working person in their zeal to get cheap goods from other countries. We, as a nation, did a disservice to those who make things. And, now, those people are fighting back---Trump is a reflection of that.
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While, yes US manufacturing is changing, there is still quite a bit that is manufactured here and not else where. But once you reach the tipping point, when N + 1 manufacturing has left the country, its on a downward spiral. Apparently the present emphasis is to reverse this trend, and put it back on the upward spiral. I think that's a good thing, and good public policy to have.
 
calamity said:
IMO, even a liberal would have to see the information in the op as a positive. As a non-partisan, "show me the results" kind of guy, I certainly do. Trump has had an immediate impact in my business. And, that is nothing short of amazing.
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He hasn't done ****ing anything. These plans were already in place, you can't make plans like that in less than two months.
 
calamity said:
Trump is more to their liking---kind of like a football coach with good lockerroom personae versus one who just creates good plays. Obama sucked at rallying the troops. Trump seems to be a genius at this.
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....reminds me of....



Captain Murphy: "As the history hitherto of class struggles and modern bourgeois society! Class antagonisms! Feudal something of oppression! Serfdom! Bourgeoisie! Tottering feudal society! And victory for the proletariat!"

Sealab personnel: <silence>

Captain Murphy: "that's YOU!"

Sealab personnel: <wild cheering>
 
Carjosse said:
He hasn't done ****ing anything. These plans were already in place, you can't make plans like that in less than two months.
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calamity said:
Well, say what you want, but be sure to add Apple to the list

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/09/apple-seeks-to-expand-manufacturing-in-arizona.html
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From your link....

Mesa first announced the Apple manufacturing facility in 2013, when there were expected to be 2,000 jobs created there. In 2015, Apple said it would invest $2 billion to expand "a command center for the company's global networks." The company currently has job postings for "data center site services technicians" in Mesa.


The only thing prospective mentioned there is:

Apple has reportedly been looking to expand its cloud services to compete with rivals like Amazon and Google, The Information reported last year. Meanwhile, president-elect Donald Trump has said as president he would "create the incentives" to get Apple to "build a big plant in the United States."


Of course, creating special incentives (aka, tax deals, subsidies, and so forth) to prop up specific companies was a major ongoing basis of attack that the right used against Obama. Quite strange to see it become a basis of praise when Trump's team is doing it.


[EDIT: But Carjosse was still right Trump hasn't actually done anything yet, unless one wants to give him credit for sending Pence to give special rewards to Carrier if they only moved half the jobs they initially intended.... ]
 
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Mr Person said:
From your link....

Mesa first announced the Apple manufacturing facility in 2013, when there were expected to be 2,000 jobs created there. In 2015, Apple said it would invest $2 billion to expand "a command center for the company's global networks." The company currently has job postings for "data center site services technicians" in Mesa.


The only thing prospective mentioned there is:

Apple has reportedly been looking to expand its cloud services to compete with rivals like Amazon and Google, The Information reported last year. Meanwhile, president-elect Donald Trump has said as president he would "create the incentives" to get Apple to "build a big plant in the United States."


Of course, creating special incentives (aka, tax deals, subsidies, and so forth) to prop up specific companies was a major ongoing basis of attack that the right used against Obama. Quite strange to see it become a basis of praise when Trump's team is doing it.


[EDIT: But Carjosse was still right Trump hasn't actually done anything yet, unless one wants to give him credit for sending Pence to give special rewards to Carrier if they only moved half the jobs they initially intended.... ]
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Well, let's put it this way then: Obama and Clinton are the worst politicians on earth for not loudly promoting these accomplishments if they were indeed already in the works.

I suspect--as does everyone else not looking for excuses---that these things were not finalized until the Trump writing was on the wall. If they were, if the O and HRC knew about this stuff coming and deals being in place, then they deserved to lose simply for being too stupid to mention it on the trail.
 
Mr Person said:
....reminds me of....



Captain Murphy: "As the history hitherto of class struggles and modern bourgeois society! Class antagonisms! Feudal something of oppression! Serfdom! Bourgeoisie! Tottering feudal society! And victory for the proletariat!"

Sealab personnel: <silence>

Captain Murphy: "that's YOU!"

Sealab personnel: <wild cheering>
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Perhaps. But, what I see is this.

Trump: Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio...that's you.

HRC: Flyover country.

Trump: Jobs, rule of law, border security.

HRC: The joys of open borders.

Trump: Crooked Hillary; nasty woman.

HRC: At this point what difference does it make? Irredeemable deplorables.
 
calamity said:
Well, let's put it this way then: Obama and Clinton are the worst politicians on earth for not loudly promoting these accomplishments if they were indeed already in the works..
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Obama did. For example, all the "green energy" subsidies, loans, etc., that Fox News et. al. made such a big show of outrage over.




calamity said:
I suspect--as does everyone else not looking for excuses---that these things were not finalized until the Trump writing was on the wall. If they were, if the O and HRC knew about this stuff coming and deals being in place, then they deserved to lose simply for being too stupid to mention it on the trail.
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Everyone "not looking for excuses" thinks what you think?

Troll harder.
 
Mr Person said:
Obama did. For example, all the "green energy" subsidies, loans, etc., that Fox News et. al. made such a big show of outrage over.






Everyone "not looking for excuses" thinks what you think?

Troll harder.
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Perception is everything. And, that the D failed to swing perception in their favor while the R did is the real story which no one on the Left wants to face. It was probably Obama and Hillary's greatest failure: not successfully selling their accomplishments.

The energy in this country is shifting, spirits are lifting. And, not feeling it is a loss for those who wish to wallow in their misery.
 
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