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Students Get US Flag Removed - 1000 Veterans Show Up[W:39]

d0gbreath said:
Well bless your pointed little head.

When I need assistance pertaining to southern phrases from a yankee in Chi-town, you'll be the first to know.
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My head is not pointed. And apparently, you did need some help.
 
Winchester said:
I never quite understood why people get so caught up in symbols, either revering to the extent it upsets them when desicrated or bothering to desecrate them in the first place. I guess I'm just too apathetic.
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Probably because you don't believe in anything.
 
Paperview said:
Hoping no one else would click the link?

WHAT'S FALSE: The college did not instate a campus-wide ban on American flags; The campus did not announce that the flag was a symbol of oppression; The flag was not removed in protest of Donald Trump.
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^---Lol, Snopes and their bogus stawman fallacies to bolster their liberal bias. Almost, everyone knows it was the school's flag that was taken down, not a complete flag ban.

it might behoove you to look at what I was addressing in the post to which I replied.

"While controversy over the flag began when students (not staff) lowered it to half-staff after Donald Trump's presidential victory, the college stated that its decision to remove the flag completely (and temporarily) was not intended to be a commentary on the presidential election, nor was the flag banned from campus."
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The staff catering to the students, yes. The flag being removed completely, yes. The half-staff was a commentary on the election, yes. I haven't seen anyone say it was a campus-wide ban, nor has that been reported. That does nothing to change the fact that, in an attempt to pander to their students, the staff lowered the flag to half-staff for Trump's election and then took it down completely when it turned into an issue.

Seriously, why does anyone link to Snopes anymore, as if they are credible?
 
truthatallcost said:
The OP states that students had the flag removed, which Snopes doesn't dispute.
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Yes, it actually does dispute that. Did you actually read the article?

Fishking said:
That does nothing to change the fact that, in an attempt to pander to their students, the staff lowered the flag to half-staff for Trump's election and then took it down completely when it turned into an issue.
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No, that one quote you pulled out does nothing to change that "allegation" (it's not a fact). But the rest of the article does. You should have kept reading.

The article explains that students did not have the flag removed, they put it at half staff. The college did not put it at half-staff, the students did. The college decided to just leave it that way until Memorial Day at which time they would raise it again. But then they discovered that someone had burned the flag overnight, so there wasn't a flag for them to raise anymore. Then they decided not to put a flag back up until they can get together and figure out what they are going to do about it.

It's a reasonable response. Continuing to put a flag out there without addressing the underlying problems will just get that flag burned too. You need to address the problem whether by: reaching out to the students who are doing this, disciplining the students, guarding the flag, or ...something. You can't just put another flag out there; the same thing will happen again. It makes sense to leave the flag off until you can get together and figure out how to proceed.

In my opinion, they should just leave the flag off until after the winter break. Students are about to go home for Holidays anyway. While they are gone, they can make some changes to the area around the flag to make it more visible, better lit, more frequently patrolled, etc. and put in place whatever policies they need to ensure that any students who tamper with it are disciplined. But yeah...in the meantime the flag would be down.
 
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A private college has every right to decline to display the U.S. flag on its campus. And parents who are thinking of paying to send their children to a private college have every right to refuse to pay to send them to that one.
 
Disrespectful hedonistic undeserving brainwashed liberal waste products.

They don't deserve the freedom others fought and sacrificed for so they could show their ignorance and contempt having contributed NOTHING.
 
CrabCake said:
The article explains that students did not have the flag removed, they put it at half staff. The college did not put it at half-staff, the students did. The college decided to just leave it that way until Memorial Day at which time they would raise it again. But then they discovered that someone had burned the flag overnight, so there wasn't a flag for them to raise anymore. Then they decided not to put a flag back up until they can get together and figure out what they are going to do about it.
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When the staff decided to leave it that way it became staff action. When they decided to not raise another flag it became their action not to have a flag as well.

It's a reasonable response. Continuing to put a flag out there without addressing the underlying problems will just get that flag burned too. You need to address the problem whether by: reaching out to the students who are doing this, disciplining the students, guarding the flag, or ...something. You can't just put another flag out there; the same thing will happen again. It makes sense to leave the flag off until you can get together and figure out how to proceed.
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Sure you can. You put another flag out there and put hidden security in place. Then you arrest the students that you catch doing it, charge them for vandalism, and expel them from the college.

In my opinion, they should just leave the flag off until after the winter break. Students are about to go home for Holidays anyway. While they are gone, they can make some changes to the area around the flag to make it more visible, better lit, more frequently patrolled, etc. and put in place whatever policies they need to ensure that any students who tamper with it are disciplined. But yeah...in the meantime the flag would be down.
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No, you do what I just said above. Colleges need to stop being held hostage by students and have some standards and integrity.
 
Orly? said:
Liberal Students Get US Flag Removed from Campus. Then 1000 Military Veterans Show Up

Liberal Students Get US Flag Removed from Campus. Then 1000 Military Veterans Show Up…


Liberal Students Get US Flag Removed from Campus. Then 1000 Military Veterans Show Up…


BY JASON HOWERTON

After a group of students at Hampshire College successfully got the American flag removed from campus, roughly 1,000 military veterans gathered in Amherst, MA, on Sunday to teach them a lesson with a patriotic protest.

They brought plenty of flags to campus, too.

The veterans said they want the students to know the freedom they enjoy, the same freedom that allows them to disrespect the flag, isn’t free.



“They took down my flag, they have a right to that, I’m here to defend their right to do that but I want them to understand how bad that hurts me,” veteran Jerry Maguire told WWLP-TV.

David Soucy, a wounded Iraq War veteran, told the news station “there’s no way I’ll let anyone take down the flag, no way.”

“It means a lot to me and my brothers,” he added.

There was apparently some sort of an incident during the pro-America protest when a man sat in the middle of the veteran protesters and made obscene gestures as they tried to take a photo. It was unclear if the man was a student. Otherwise, the protest was entirely peaceful.

People reportedly came from all over New England to participate in the protest.

Springfield Mayor Domenic Sarno stood in solidarity with the veterans, telling WWLP-TV, “For the students here and the president and board of trustees have risen from what the veterans sacrificed, this flag [sic] and not to fly the flag on this campus if you were in some other countries around the world it would be handled very, very differently."

Only time will tell if Hampshire College will reconsider its decision to remove the American flag from campus.

hampshire-veterans-ally-1.jpg
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Hampshire College has been a boho enclave for as long as I can remember. tends to be filled with Trustafarians and Mercedes Marxists
 
Fishking said:
When the staff decided to leave it that way it became staff action. When they decided to not raise another flag it became their action not to have a flag as well.
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Your original claim was not that the staff became complicit in the process by not rectifying it immediately. Your claim was, and I quote:
Fishking said:
in an attempt to pander to their students, the staff lowered the flag to half-staff for Trump's election and then took it down completely when it turned into an issue.
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That claim is untrue. The staff did not lower the flag to half-staff nor did they take it down. You were completely deceived. Had you actually read the snopes article before criticizing it, you wouldn't have sounded that foolish. You also wouldn't find yourself in the position of having to dig yourself in deeper by trying to redefine what "the staff lowered the flag to half-staff" means in order to make your untrue statement sound true.

Fishking said:
Sure you can. You put another flag out there and put hidden security in place. Then you arrest the students that you catch doing it, charge them for vandalism, and expel them from the college.
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That's one avenue you might take. But there's a number of problems with this, here's two of them off the top of my head and there's likely to be more if you really sat down to evaluate it:
1. How will this be paid for? Does anyone even have the authority to spend money on this without putting it before the board?
2. Does the code of conduct, by-laws, etc. provide the necessary framework to discipline students for this? If not...what needs to be done to get that added?

Those are the kinds of questions you need to actually sit down and have a meeting to address. Thus why it makes sense to wait until they can get all of these things figured out.
 
CrabCake said:
Your original claim was not that the staff became complicit in the process by not rectifying it immediately. Your claim was, and I quote:

That claim is untrue. The staff did not lower the flag to half-staff nor did they take it down. You were completely deceived. Had you actually read the snopes article before criticizing it, you wouldn't have sounded that foolish. You also wouldn't find yourself in the position of having to dig yourself in deeper by trying to redefine what "the staff lowered the flag to half-staff" means in order to make your untrue statement sound true.
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While you're correct that my initial understanding was off, it's almost negligible in relevance. I was only able to read whatever was quoted because snopes wasn't loading for me. But, again, when the faculty didn't put the flag back up, or put a new one up, it didn't really change anything.

That's one avenue you might take. But there's a number of problems with this, here's two of them off the top of my head and there's likely to be more if you really sat down to evaluate it:
1. How will this be paid for? Does anyone even have the authority to spend money on this without putting it before the board?
2. Does the code of conduct, by-laws, etc. provide the necessary framework to discipline students for this? If not...what needs to be done to get that added?

Those are the kinds of questions you need to actually sit down and have a meeting to address. Thus why it makes sense to wait until they can get all of these things figured out.
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1. They probably already have paid security so it's simply a matter of stationing personnel.

2. I'm willing to put money down that vandalism of school property is already covered.
 
Moderator's Warning:
All personal sniping stops now. Discuss the topic, and the topic only.
 
Fishking said:
I was only able to read whatever was quoted because snopes wasn't loading for me.
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OK. So, we've established that you criticized a snopes article which you hadn't actually read.


Fishking said:
1. They probably already have paid security so it's simply a matter of stationing personnel.
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There typically aren't spare security guards lying around. If you station a guard at the flag, you are taking him away from guarding: dorms, parking lots, and other areas. I don't think it's necessarily a bad idea...but I think it's one you don't do as a knee-jerk reaction. You don't want to end up with a rape or a car theft that could have been prevented by not sending that guard to stand in front of a flag.
 
CrabCake said:
There typically aren't spare security guards lying around. If you station a guard at the flag, you are taking him away from guarding: dorms, parking lots, and other areas. I don't think it's necessarily a bad idea...but I think it's one you don't do as a knee-jerk reaction. You don't want to end up with a rape or a car theft that could have been prevented by not sending that guard to stand in front of a flag.
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I think stopping destruction of school property is pretty high on the important list as well. And they wouldn't stand in front of the flag, they would be concealed near it. That why the person actually goes to do it again and then gets arrested, charged, and expelled. Do that once and you shouldn't have the problem again.
 
truthatallcost said:
...
After which, the school decided to do away with the flag permanently.
...
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Ha!

Toldja.





Hampshire College raises U.S. flag to full staff
CBS News‎ -



"On Friday, Lash said in a statement that the flag has now been raised to full staff after a two-weeks of discussion about what the flag means to the Hampshire community.

“Hampshire staff and faculty have led facilitated discussions, I have held multiple focus group sessions, and all of our students, faculty, and staff have been invited to contribute their opinions, questions, and perspectives about the U.S. flag. This is what free speech looks like,” Lash said.


”We raise the flag now as a symbol of that freedom, and in hopes for justice and fairness for all,” he added.
 
Paperview said:
Ha!

Toldja.





Hampshire College raises U.S. flag to full staff
CBS News‎ -



"On Friday, Lash said in a statement that the flag has now been raised to full staff after a two-weeks of discussion about what the flag means to the Hampshire community.

“Hampshire staff and faculty have led facilitated discussions, I have held multiple focus group sessions, and all of our students, faculty, and staff have been invited to contribute their opinions, questions, and perspectives about the U.S. flag. This is what free speech looks like,” Lash said.


”We raise the flag now as a symbol of that freedom, and in hopes for justice and fairness for all,” he added.
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Yeah, school officials decided to fly the flag after 1,000 vets protested, the media covered it, and their offices were inundated with emails and phone calls.

Not exactly a 'I told ya so moment', but I guess you gotta take em where you can get em.
 
Quote Originally Posted by truthatallcost View Post
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After which, the school decided to do away with the flag permanently."

I told you it was temporary. You were wrong.
 
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