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Free Speech and Nazi Doctrine

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It's not quite that simple.

The civil rights movement was full of people advocating violating the law. Be very careful about taking this right away
 
Nazi doctrine calls for the extermination of Jews and other people deemed "lesser" by White Supremacists. IMO, such speech should not be legal in the US. Period.

The Nazis and the KKK have always had the right to preach their hate in this country and their numbers have only dwindled over time, not grown. Your irrational fear of the ramblings of a handful of loons is not reason enough to scrap the First Amendment.
 
We must squash their actions....not their words

Probably true. I guess, as long as they do not explicitly instruct people to violate the law, they can say whatever they want. The guys arrested in Charlottesville seem to have crossed that line, both in speech and action. So, it should be interesting to see how this all plays out over time.

I suspect the FBI has dozens of agents and informants working inside these organizations listening for illegal speech.
 
The civil rights movement was full of people advocating violating the law. Be very careful about taking this right away

Peaceful violations of law, not violent violations.

"Sit on the courthouse steps until they arrest you." Good speech.

"Blow up the courthouse and run." Bad speech.
 
Probably true. I guess, as long as they do not explicitly instruct people to violate the law, they can say whatever they want. The guys arrested in Charlottesville seem to have crossed that line, both in speech and action. So, it should be interesting to see how this all plays out over time.

I suspect the FBI has dozens of agents and informants working inside these organizations listening for illegal speech.

I am glad people like MLK jr and Gandhi encouraged people to break the law.....aren't you?
 
Peaceful violations of law, not violent violations.

"Sit on the courthouse steps until they arrest you." Good speech.

"Blow up the courthouse and run." Bad speech.
Both are speech. It is very dangerous to label it as good and bad. No one ever killed anyone with words
 
I am glad people like MLK jr and Gandhi encouraged people to break the law.....aren't you?

Again, you are conflating non-violent resistance with outright murder and destruction of property. The former is fine. The latter not so much.
 
The law seems pretty clear. Instruct someone to blow up a building, who then blows up the building, you're going to go down as a co-conspirator.

Ever hear of Nichols?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Nichols
A conspiracy to commit violence is different than just talking about it. Acts must be taken in furtherance of the conspiracy. I want these people who say this stuff to say it in public. Then we can find them. Otherwise they will just say it in private....where they are a bigger danger
 
A conspiracy to commit violence is different than just talking about it. Acts must be taken in furtherance of the conspiracy. I want these people who say this stuff to say it in public. Then we can find them. Otherwise they will just say it in private....where they are a bigger danger

The third guy did not actually do anything, but he got 12 years nonetheless for failure to notify authorities of the plot, IIRC. In fact, he turned state's witness and is currently invisible.

Michael and Lori Fortier were considered accomplices for their foreknowledge of the planning of the bombing. In addition to Michael assisting McVeigh in scouting the federal building, Lori had helped McVeigh laminate a fake driver's license which was later used to rent the Ryder truck.[41] Fortier agreed to testify against McVeigh and Nichols in exchange for a reduced sentence and immunity for his wife.[183] He was sentenced on May 27, 1998 to twelve years in prison and fined $75,000 for failing to warn authorities about the attack.[184] On January 20, 2006, after serving ten and a half years of his sentence, including time already served, Fortier was released for good behavior into the Witness Protection Program and given a new identity.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing#Michael_Fortier
 
Nazi doctrine calls for the extermination of Jews and other people deemed "lesser" by White Supremacists. IMO, such speech should not be legal in the US. Period.

It's easy to support positive, happy, feel good speech. It's the vile crap that really tests our commitment to free speech.
 
The third guy did not actually do anything, but he got 12 years nonetheless for failure to notify authorities of the plot, IIRC. In fact, he turned state's witness and is currently invisible.

In your post he took actions in furtherance of a conspiracy
 
Here is what I want. I want these people who support violence on either side to speak freely. I want them to believe they can say anything they want (because they can). I want them to get cocky. And then I want them to slip up. I want them to tell an informant about a plan to do something. Let them take some action on their plans. And then I want to crush them
 
An open forum to talk about anything is the requirement that should never be traded for anything.

Nobody controls my mouth but me.

This is a Human Rights Issue.

Mine will not be taken.

So nambla speaking at the middle school?
 
It should be though if you are talking about violently overthrowing our government or murdering people you believe are sub-human. In fact, it's imperative that we squash that sort of thing like the cockroaches they are.

Only if you are scared enough to think that those ideas will sell that you are willing to trade freedom for shoddy promises of security, which I am not willing to do.

If were we to see roving bands of killers I still would not be in favor of speech suppression almost certainly as our problem is not free speech, it is that too many people are too stupid. I intend to teach them up with my words, that is to say that the solution is more speech not less.
 
Youth are not fully formed, they have different rules.

They would be listening.

The nambla guy would be expressing himself through speech.

So would a streaker or flasher.

Against the law to say **** on TV.

The point is we limit speech now for a variety of reasons.

Many of them pretty arbitrary.

The constitution doesn't forbid me to abridge with your right to bear arms. Doesn't forbid me to search your house without a warrant.

And the first doesn't apply to me either.
 
Again, you are conflating non-violent resistance with outright murder and destruction of property. The former is fine. The latter not so much.

No one was ever murdered and no property has ever been destroyed by words
 
Nazi doctrine calls for the extermination of Jews and other people deemed "lesser" by White Supremacists. IMO, such speech should not be legal in the US. Period.

It sounds good doesn't it? The problem is when you silence that first group, where do we stop? It also goes directly against the first amendment.
 
Simply because Nazis also have the right of free speech doesn't mean that We The People cannot oppose them with our words and our ideals.
 
Nazi doctrine calls for the extermination of Jews and other people deemed "lesser" by White Supremacists. IMO, such speech should not be legal in the US. Period.

You are welcome to have your stupid, tyrannical opinion and express it, letting us know you are someone with stupid, tyrannical opinions.

Thanks First Amendment.
 
You are welcome to have your stupid, tyrannical opinion and express it, letting us know you are someone with stupid, tyrannical opinions.

Thanks First Amendment.

Well, some of us believe that people who want to throw a million people into an oven should be shut out of public discourse. Imagine that.
 
Nazis, just like the Quakers or the Pentecostals or the Muslims or the commies or the Alt Right, have the right to free speech.

It is not absolute in protection though.

If they call for violence against others or to incite violence against others, just like anyone else, they should be shut down.
 
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