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Thread: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

  1. #21
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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by gunner View Post
    Nothing more than a Brit bash fest, as per, by resident hater. Change the record for a change.
    So you like being the errand bitch of the US? An US government hell bent on war with Iran?

    And I like facts.

    Fact is that Gibraltar is a colony and any decision to go after any ship is made in London, not by what's his name in Gibraltar. Claiming that the idiot in Gibraltar requested help to size a ship is just stupid and the fact that the media at the moment are not questioning this part is nuts.

    Fact the claim by the British that it was IN Gibraltar waters is suspect when you know the area. Only reason you enter Gibraltar waters is if you are going to Gibraltar. You think they were doing that?

    And finally being critical of the UK government actions does not mean you hate the people of said country.



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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    It is unknown [by me] if the Grace 1 was sailing in international waters. It seems the ship was seized in UK/Spanish waters.

    Syria is under oil import/export sanctions by the US, UK, and the EU. Iran is under US oil import/export sanctions.
    Rogue Valley:

    As the Sraits of Gibraltar are about 14.5 km wide at their narrowest part, near Gibraltar, there is no truly international waters for international shipping to pass through. Thus the Sraits are an international waterway and protected for freedom of movement by the laws of the seas.

    Just because the US, the U.K. and the EU have Syria under oil import/export sanctions does not mean that Iran is bound by such sanctions. Iran can trade with which ever regimes it wishes to and the U.K. has no right to stop it. Syria is a monstrous regime but US, UK, and EU law don't govern how other nations can trade outside of those three political jurisdictions.

    Cheers.
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  3. #23
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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Reuters - Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Iranian ship was boarded by marines in contested waters off coast of Gibraltar


    British warship seizes Iranian oil tanker Grace 1 near Gibraltar.



    Well done. Oil intended for the Assad regime and his proxy forces (Russia/Iran) in Syria. Spain has complained that the tanker was seized in Spanish waters.

    Related: BBC - Iranian official threatens to seize British oil tanker

    Guardian - Spain to lodge complaint over British seizure of oil tanker
    I wonder how much the oil is worth. I suspect a game of tit for tat by the US. They shoot down a drone we have the British steal a tanker full of oil. Thats a fair exchange I would imagine.
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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Reuters - Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Iranian ship was boarded by marines in contested waters off coast of Gibraltar


    British warship seizes Iranian oil tanker Grace 1 near Gibraltar.



    Well done. Oil intended for the Assad regime and his proxy forces (Russia/Iran) in Syria. Spain has complained that the tanker was seized in Spanish waters.

    Related: BBC - Iranian official threatens to seize British oil tanker

    Guardian - Spain to lodge complaint over British seizure of oil tanker
    Theft and people are cheering about it.

    Support for Assad? I mean, he's not a nice guy, but the US would have supported him had it been in their interests. The US does support the Saudis.
    Only interested in serious debate.

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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Reuters - Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Iranian ship was boarded by marines in contested waters off coast of Gibraltar


    British warship seizes Iranian oil tanker Grace 1 near Gibraltar.



    Well done. Oil intended for the Assad regime and his proxy forces (Russia/Iran) in Syria. Spain has complained that the tanker was seized in Spanish waters.

    Related: BBC - Iranian official threatens to seize British oil tanker

    Guardian - Spain to lodge complaint over British seizure of oil tanker
    Welp, I put figures to calculator and I got some interesting numbers.

    That tanker carries about 300,000 short tons of cargo, in this case oil. There are 172.9 barrels of oil to one short ton. The current price for a barrel of crude is about $60.00 a barrel. Figure because of sanctions the Iranians discounted the oil to about $50.00 a barrel. That works out to about 2.5 billion dollars of cargo. How much money did we fly into Iran? How much was that drone again? Theft pays well apparently.
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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Closer to the destination... And not in disputed waters.. ~
    I haven't made my mind up on this but (if the ship was heading to Syria) what would make the ship sail through British waters around Cyprus if it had gotten further and possibly closer to Syria?
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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    I haven't made my mind up on this but (if the ship was heading to Syria) what would make the ship sail through British waters around Cyprus if it had gotten further and possibly closer to Syria?
    I am guessing the US is scared of actually committing piracy themselves near Syria, since it would be in range of Russian planes and ships out of Syria. Also if the US did it, it would mean that they would have to use NATO bases in the Med, in countries that would not normally accept such actions. So if they did it, then they would put thier base acces in jeapordy.

    That is why they pressured the UK to do out from Gibraltar since there is no other European nation that submits to US bullying anymore.

    All this means is that future Iranian shipments will be accompanied by military assets for protection, which increases the risk of war, which is exactly what Bolton and company want.

    Putin also wants the US to weaken itself so he is of course silently encouraging the issue because he knows the US can't win against Iran and any action will only weaken the US.

    But lets look at this from a far. They tracked the ship from Iraq, and are using the strange route as justification. But why not let the ship break sanctions and use it in a propoganda war and justification against Iran? Would be far more effective than what had happened... Unless of course it is part of a chaos plan of some sort that splits allies...

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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Rogue Valley:

    As the Sraits of Gibraltar are about 14.5 km wide at their narrowest part, near Gibraltar, there is no truly international waters for international shipping to pass through. Thus the Sraits are an international waterway and protected for freedom of movement by the laws of the seas.

    Just because the US, the U.K. and the EU have Syria under oil import/export sanctions does not mean that Iran is bound by such sanctions. Iran can trade with which ever regimes it wishes to and the U.K. has no right to stop it. Syria is a monstrous regime but US, UK, and EU law don't govern how other nations can trade outside of those three political jurisdictions.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    First of all, I never commented on legality. If I did so, please cite the appropriate post of mine.

    Secondly, if the UN and international courts actually delivered tangible results, extralegal/unilateral actions would not be necessary.

    Russia still refuses to release 24 Ukraine sailors and 3 Ukraine boats as ordered by International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea (ITLOS) on 25 May 2019.


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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I am guessing the US is scared of actually committing piracy themselves near Syria, since it would be in range of Russian planes and ships out of Syria.


    US forces killed ~100 Russian mercenaries at Deir Ezzor, Syria in February 2019.


    "All I know is what's on the Internet." Donald Trump on "Meet the Press", Sunday, 13 March 2016

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    Re: Tehran fumes as Britain seizes Iranian oil tanker over Syria sanctions

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    First of all, I never commented on legality. If I did so, please cite the appropriate post of mine.

    Secondly, if the UN and international courts actually delivered tangible results, extralegal/unilateral actions would not be necessary.

    Russia still refuses to release 24 Ukraine sailors and 3 Ukraine boats as ordered by International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea (ITLOS) on 25 May 2019.
    Rogue Valley:

    The first two words of your OP were, "Well done..." which certainly implies approval of the seizure. Do you approve of states extra legally and unilaterally seizing shipping? Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, all vessels passing through the Strait of Gibraltar do so under the legal regime of transit passage, rather than the far more limited legal doctrine of innocent passage allowed in most territorial waters. Brithish territorial water claims extend about 7.5 km (3.0 NM) from Gibraltar but are disputed by Spain.

    What legal basis does the UK have to seize an Iranian ship on the high seas? As far as I know Britain has no sanctions in operation against Iran. What business is it of the U.K. where Iranian ships go and whom they deliver cargos to? Can Canada intercept UK ships delivering weapons to UK friendly regimes with bad behaviour records? No, of course we can't and nor can the UK. Britannia no longer rules the waves.

    Russia like the UK seized ships unilaterally, extrajudicially and illegally, so the actions of Russia are in fact similar to the actions of the UK with respect to the Iranian tanker. If you approve of the one, you will have a harder time arguing against the other, IMHO.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    "At the heart of quantum mechanics is a rule that sometimes governs politicians or CEOs - as long as no one is watching, anything goes.
    ― Lawrence M. Krauss

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