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Thread: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer and stealth is totally irrelevant

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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    Quote Originally Posted by Checkerboard Strangler View Post
    I know what they had because my two bosses (one of whom played the Russian ring announcer in Rocky IV) dragged theirs all the way from the USSR when they came to Los Angeles.

    It was the mid-1980s and they were convinced that they would save money by adapting their PoS machines to run CMX video edit controller tasks instead of buying the CMX hardware. Yeah, no kidding, one of them actually had a degree in computer science. Didn't change the fact that their junk machines weren't up to the tasks.

    And the Amiga made headlines around the world because it could work with NTSC/PAL video broadcast standard RS-170 data, unlike ANY OTHER machine available at the time, which is why it was possible for a NewTek Video Toaster to turn an Amiga 2000/3000/4000 computer into a four camera broadcast switcher (mixer) and graphics compositing station, something that normally took equipment costing ten times that much.
    Russian tech sadly was not junk but rather their implementation was, they were using ternary computers before most of the world knew about them, and had in house designed 16 bit processors when many thought 8 bit was state of the art. They completely lacked structure, had no uniform programming meaning every university there had a different architecture and language, and unlike in the western world ideas were rarely shared. This led the soviet govt to promote copying western computers rather than designing their own, a project so bad nearly every soviet computer maker folded when the union fell, as they were just copies of western computers, and after the fall they could simply buy the originals rather than the clones.

    I will say though the amiga and the atari st were both way ahead of their time, not just being early users of gui, but also the amigas video processing capabilities, and the atari st's sound processing capabilities, both were used in studios into the 90's even after being obsolete.
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  2. #32
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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye10 View Post
    Any NATO country currently spending just 1.03% GDP on defense (Sweden) can most certainly step up and do better.
    They need to order crescent wrenches and toilet seats from the same suppliers that drive the US military budget through the roof, I guess.
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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    That's okay, Russia will just nuke Sweden into the stone age

  4. #34
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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    Russian tech sadly was not junk but rather their implementation was, they were using ternary computers before most of the world knew about them, and had in house designed 16 bit processors when many thought 8 bit was state of the art. They completely lacked structure, had no uniform programming meaning every.... - - - - - -
    I think you and I have different definitions of "junk".
    But here's the thing that set us apart. Microprocessors were originally getting a huge amount of R&D support here in the US because of military applications, then aerospace (NASA) but the government and the private sector realized that it made so much sense to just go ahead and do the heavy lifting needed to get them into the public marketplace.

    And just like you said, in the USSR, ideas aren't always shared, not to mention, Soviet authorities saw little financial incentive (for obvious reasons) to push them into the marketplace, such as it was over there. Had there been no public/private heavy lifting partnership over here, microprocessors would have remained the sole province of military and aerospace for a long time over here, too.

    And in a capitalist economy that would have been unthinkable, especially since the government here was only too happy to do for the microprocessor industry what they try to do for a LOT of exciting tech and industrial startups, leverage some help.
    That was known back then as "Yankee Ingenuity".

    We have to learn how to get that sort of mindset back today, because it's sorely needed.
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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    Quote Originally Posted by Checkerboard Strangler View Post
    I think you and I have different definitions of "junk".
    But here's the thing that set us apart. Microprocessors were originally getting a huge amount of R&D support here in the US because of military applications, then aerospace (NASA) but the government and the private sector realized that it made so much sense to just go ahead and do the heavy lifting needed to get them into the public marketplace.

    And just like you said, in the USSR, ideas aren't always shared, not to mention, Soviet authorities saw little financial incentive (for obvious reasons) to push them into the marketplace, such as it was over there. Had there been no public/private heavy lifting partnership over here, microprocessors would have remained the sole province of military and aerospace for a long time over here, too.

    And in a capitalist economy that would have been unthinkable, especially since the government here was only too happy to do for the microprocessor industry what they try to do for a LOT of exciting tech and industrial startups, leverage some help.
    That was known back then as "Yankee Ingenuity".

    We have to learn how to get that sort of mindset back today, because it's sorely needed.
    You are cirrect that sharing of tech is essential, as wel as ownership not being exclusive state property. The russians could design a super processor in university a, but the operating environment in university b and the overall architecture in university c, and if those three universities never come together, the product will be poorly made, hence why they pushed copying western products.

    Had it not been for communism, they may have been a major player in the pc market, but their govt controlled system which had no incentive to capitalize on products screwed them over big time.
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    Re: Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer — and stealth is totally irrelevant

    Quote Originally Posted by beerftw View Post
    You are cirrect that sharing of tech is essential, as wel as ownership not being exclusive state property. The russians could design a super processor in university a, but the operating environment in university b and the overall architecture in university c, and if those three universities never come together, the product will be poorly made, hence why they pushed copying western products.

    Had it not been for communism, they may have been a major player in the pc market, but their govt controlled system which had no incentive to capitalize on products screwed them over big time.
    I'm not supposed to agree with your assessment, particularly the last part, because as a liberal, don't you know, I'm supposed to be on the side of the Communists. [/sarcasm]
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongidig View Post
    I think Trump is much better than Hitler.

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