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Is the EU America's number one enemy?

Rogue Valley said:
Oh please. Stop acting so saintly. Off the top of my head we have Latin America, Diego Garcia, Pacifica atolls, the Philippines, and on and on.

Neither the US nor Europe is squeaky clean. To intimate otherwise is disingenuous and selective.
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I couldn't be further from sainthood, thank the gods. Show me were I claimed the US is innocent or what that concept has anything to do with allies are truly our enemies?

You know the old phrase, "With friends like that, who needs enemies?"
 
Ya know, for all the talk about Trump being a liar, its pretty tragic people cant help themselves but to start threads and create arguments based on lies.

|For ****s sake...he was asked by the interviewer...who is your biggest competitor...your biggest 'foe'...right now.

Its not a ****ing war. It was a simple question answered with clear intent...the EU is an 'economic' foe based on tade, just as Russia is, just as China is. And from that response someone decided that meant the EU was our NUMBER ONE ENEMY and talking about going to war?

Geeeee







zus.
 
OldFatGuy said:
Yes, and as a raison d'etre for its inception.
Click to expand...

What? What? Are you seriously saying the reason for the inception of the EU is to be the enemy of the US?
My gawd, man, do you even hear yourself?
 
OldFatGuy said:
It is not hardly paranoia nor restricted to me. It is the reality of Europe's global behavior, not merely toward the Americas, but the entire world within and outside Europe throughout European history. Know your own. Should we discuss Belgium in the Congo, France in SE Asia and its prisons in Guiana, Britain in India, The Swedish Empire in Poland and Lithuania, the never ending ethnic wars of the Balkans, Italy in Ethiopia, Spain and Portugal in South and Centra America, their missionaries colonialists in Asia? Where do you want to start defending Europe's depredations. You are going to find a deep set of rows to hoe.

Or would you rather be specific and attempt to defend the EU as an agency designed to combat US trade superior positioning?

It is not paranoia, the evidence is profound yet Europe claims denial. :doh:lamo:spin:
Click to expand...

European colonialism, with all it's nasty history, is the reason the US is the most powerful nation in the world.
What do they teach you guys in school, that the USA kind of sprang up out of the ground to be a righteous antidote to European culture?
 
Grand Mal said:
European colonialism, with all it's nasty history, is the reason the US is the most powerful nation in the world.
What do they teach you guys in school, that the USA kind of sprang up out of the ground to be a righteous antidote to European culture?
Click to expand...

They taught us rejection of divine rule and overseas subjugators created the opportunities to build a nation, currently the most powerful nation in the world. No empire lasts indefinitely, and progressives are doing their best to bring about the collapse of this one from within. That's how all empires end, collapse from within.

There is no antidote for European culture. Europeans will be killing Europeans again in the future. Sooner or later.

Now who exactly is "you guys?"
 
OldFatGuy said:
They taught us rejection of divine rule and overseas subjugators created the opportunities to build a nation, currently the most powerful nation in the world. No empire lasts indefinitely, and progressives are doing their best to bring about the collapse of this one from within. That's how all empires end, collapse from within.

There is no antidote for European culture. Europeans will be killing Europeans again in the future. Sooner or later.

Now who exactly is "you guys?"
Click to expand...

"You guys" is you guys who think the US is somehow separate from European history, and specifically from European colonialism. It's Americans participating in European colonial history that made America the powerhouse nation it is today, beginning with Benjamin Franklin at Napoleon's court, looking to buy some acres in New Orleans for wharehouses and coming away with the Louisiana Purchase.
 
Grand Mal said:
"You guys" is you guys who think the US is somehow separate from European history, and specifically from European colonialism. It's Americans participating in European colonial history that made America the powerhouse nation it is today, beginning with Benjamin Franklin at Napoleon's court, looking to buy some acres in New Orleans for wharehouses and coming away with the Louisiana Purchase.
Click to expand...

Franklin was interested in French Bordellos not warehouses. You're giving Ben way too much credit, he wasn't sure what was being bought and only presented doubts to the transaction. Napoleon needed money, that's all the deal was about from his perspective, that and eliminating what appeared to be a fiscal liability at the time. Jefferson, like Adams before him had an early vision of Manifest Destiny. The British claimed the northwest, the Spanish were in the southwest, and both the French and British were inciting the Great Lakes tribes for a Shamenese war so as not to have interfere with their fur trading. And then Europe still raped this nation, with their investments in logging, mining and cattle. All those massive enterprises that would have taken longer to build, but the Europeans goth their pounds of flesh in return, and they still do.

You're wrong again, I am not one of those guys, I do know that without colonialism the US wouldn't exist in its current form. But I am also aware the only reason the French helped us was to divert British forces from doing battle with them, and the British did everything possible to prevent independence of the colonies, and well after the revolution.

We owe Europe nothing. We took in their criminals, their unwanted bastard and third sons, their impoverished, those whose religious beliefs they didn't tolerate and so on. And they haven't stopped hating us for making a success from those they looked down upon.

The European arrogance toward America is still evidenced by L'Accademe Francaise, still beholding to keep "Americanisms," slang from polluting French. What did they give us? More than 5 million interrupted lives and more than a half million dead Americans from 2 wars. That a bill for rebuilding. Then they mock, tax our goods that we export, and send us refined drugs. The British started that business opportunity in China, remember?

Europe still owes us for the Marshall Plan, resolving their petty wars that prevailed because of their hesitation to put an end to them before they started by fascists and visions of world domination, and genocide cures, their mockery of our people and so on and on and on. They owe us for Louis DeMay's plagiaristic western novels, our jazz and Rock and Roll, our blues music and blue jeans. We owe Europe diddly squat.

Those people no the score but won't kiss Europe's collective derrieres any longer.
 
Andalublue said:
Donald Trump put the EU at the top of his list of America's enemies yesterday, even if he qualified his comment in specifying he was talking about trade. Nevertheless, a foe is an enemy, not a rival and not a competitor. It's certainly not a friend or an ally. Trump has insulted NATO, antagonised all the USA's closest allies, humiliated Theresa May, insulted Justin Trudeau and Angela Merkel. He's gone to war on trade with China, his NAFTA colleagues and the EU.

This all gives a brand new context to the trade talks currently underway between China and the EU. What might be Trump's reaction to a Chinese-European trade deal that might undermine severely the effects of Trump's punitive tariffs. Might the great negotiator be pushing his two main competitors into one another's arms?

Here's the debate question: Is Trump's labeling of the EU and China as his enemies accurate? If not, might this rhetoric have the effect of a self-fulfilling prophesy? If he thinks they are America's enemies then they might just start behaving like enemies. Is he actually setting out to go to war, whether that's trade war, cold war or hot war?
Click to expand...

Andalublue:

The European Union is only a moderate economic rival to the USA and generally cooperates with American interests and policy when push comes to shove. Calling the EU a "foe" is hyperbole and is just plain daft.

China is a much stronger economic rival to the USA and presents a long-term political and even a military threat to America by challenging American global hegemony in Asia and the Western Pacific Ocean. China is rapidly moving to economic parity with America on a gross national product basis. Per capita it is still far behind America due to it's huge population. China is a serious economic and political rival to America but for the foreseeable future presents only a modest military threat to America. That could change if America pushes too hard. So China is a potential "foe" but is not presently one at the moment.

Russia, under the leadership of Vladimir Putin, is a thorn in the side of America but is neither an effective economic nor military rival to America, it cannot afford to be. It is an effective political rival to American global hegemony and its capacity for destabilisation of foreign regimes and political movements is a real threat at least in the Russian near-abroad. Its capacity to wage low-cost but highly effective informational warfare, propaganda and hybrid-warfare makes it the most pressing foe which America faces right now. Russia is a foe and arguably an enemy of America right now but America has long been a foe of Russia/the USSR so there is a long pedigree to this enmity between Moscow and Washington.

The real threats to America are two.

The first is America itself and comes from the yawning divide between the interests and policies of the monied and powerful few and the political impotence and resulting frustrations of the increasingly marginalised many. This divide threatens the republic's foundational principles, threatens its democractic institutions and is transmogrifying America into an increasingly militarised and intrusive surveillance and security state, which uses propaganda and social conditioning to control the people and which is run by a corporatist oligarchy rather than a representative democracy.

The second great potential threat is a prosperous and united Eurasia as an economic, political and military bloc. Avoiding this development has been the prime focus of American foreign policy and military strategy since the end of WWII. The economic, political and military encirclement of the Eurasian landmass has been at the centre of US policy for more than 70 years now. However in reaction to this policy and to US global hegemony, and driven by Russian diplomacy and Chinese business interests that potential harmonisation of outlooks and policy in Eurasia is beginning to emerge, as both China and Russia grow tired of labouring under US global domination through an international system designed to impose Western interests and American interests over the whole world.

If President Trump continues to lord it over the world and to use bully diplomacy, trade wars and both covert and overt military force to compel compliance with the Western-skewed international system, then a United Eurasion bloc may emerge and could dislodge the US from its position as the monopolar global super-power. America must learn to share the globe with other nations and states and must be willing to surrender political and economic primacy gradually to emerging giants like China, India and Europe or the brittle international system will break and all humanity will suffer.

Cheers?
Evilroddy.
 
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Andalublue said:
Nevertheless, a foe is an enemy, not a rival and not a competitor.
Click to expand...

All adversaries, whether in sports, business, or the latest incarnation of "X got Talent", are foes. While it sometimes turns out that way, it does not automatically make them enemies.
Example: Someone who is a political foe can simultaneously be a personal friend.
 
OrphanSlug said:
I'm still on the fence with Trump trying to place EU as an foe ("enemy") or if this is just the typical Trump going with language he probably should have thought out a little more.

If foe just means to Trump is competitor then all he did was equate the EU with Russia and China (which I agree was still not very wise.)
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Might ask the EU how they think Trump sees 'em.

Ask Nato too cause Nato includes Canada.

We know already what Mexico thinks because they elected in a landslide a president who is a foe of the USA as led by Trump.
 
Tangmo said:
Might ask the EU how they think Trump sees 'em.

Ask Nato too cause Nato includes Canada.

We know already what Mexico thinks because they elected in a landslide a president who is a foe of the USA as led by Trump.
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All elections are local. That explains why during the Obama administration the majority of the middle of the country elected republicans to state offices.

Mexico is a S hole county controlled by drug cartels with a sky high murder rate and abject poverty for the masses.

The elected a socialist because he promised law and order and a lot of free stuff.
All the candidates in Mexico ran against Trump so the anti American vote factored itself out.
 
OldFatGuy said:
~ I'm very aware of American involvement in Africa ~
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Yeah? Keep researching please.

OldFatGuy said:
~South and Central America, we never made colonies, but we did interfere at times. We're not innocent, but we don't urinate on the backs of others and tell them it's a hot water shower, with a smile on our faces.
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Really? Keep researching please.

OldFatGuy said:
~ Tell me about our guilt while ignoring Europe's
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Haven't ignored European guilt in any way shape or form. Just watching you avoid recognising your own.

OldFatGuy said:
~With allies from Europe we don't need enemies. Next time you all start killing each other, we won't be coming to the rescue. We had enough trying to clean up the French mess in SE Asia.
Click to expand...

Yada yada yada. You "cleaned up the French mess" in SE Asia out of your own altruistic impulses? Really?

Seems foreign history is a lightly taught subject in the US. To correct and inform you would take more time than I care to waste but please - google can be your friend. If not, visit a university library and start reading.
 
OrphanSlug said:
I'm still on the fence with Trump trying to place EU as an foe ("enemy") or if this is just the typical Trump going with language he probably should have thought out a little more.

If foe just means to Trump is competitor then all he did was equate the EU with Russia and China (which I agree was still not very wise.)
Click to expand...

Tangmo said:
Might ask the EU how they think Trump sees 'em.

Ask Nato too cause Nato includes Canada.

We know already what Mexico thinks because they elected in a landslide a president who is a foe of the USA as led by Trump.
Click to expand...

JONRID said:
All elections are local. That explains why during the Obama administration the majority of the middle of the country elected republicans to state offices.

Mexico is a S hole county controlled by drug cartels with a sky high murder rate and abject poverty for the masses.


The elected a socialist because he promised law and order and a lot of free stuff.
All the candidates in Mexico ran against Trump so the anti American vote factored itself out.
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I hope you waited till the first guy was off the fence before you blew it up.

All we need to know in this time and circumstance is that the American Right has become what we once fought against. Trump took control, direction and leadership of that. So we respond accordingly thx. Putin-Trump and Their Fanboyz.
 
gunner said:
I would not believe anything the most duplicitous President in history, has to say. His UK announcements were embarrassing, and contradictory. His stage show with Putin smack's in the face of the US Intelligence community, and embarrassed your nation. You've become a laughing stock I'm afraid.
Click to expand...

Clapper and Strzok are your boys. :lol:
 
HK.227 said:
All adversaries, whether in sports, business, or the latest incarnation of "X got Talent", are foes. While it sometimes turns out that way, it does not automatically make them enemies.
Example: Someone who is a political foe can simultaneously be a personal friend.
Click to expand...

No. This is why it is so dangerous having a moron like Trump running the most powerful nation in the world. Words have both meaning and consequences, most glaringly in the diplomatic ambit. 'Foe' does not mean rival or competitor. You cannot have a friendly foe. You cannot be a friend of a foe, it's one or the other.

Mr Webster makes this perfectly clear:

FOE:
1 : one who has personal enmity for another
Embrace, embrace, my Sons! be foes no more! —Alexander Pope
2 a : an enemy in war
b : adversary, opponent a political foe
3 : one who opposes on principle a foe of needless expenditures a foe of censorship
4 : something prejudicial or injurious

Trump has identified the EU as the USA's enemy in trade and economics. Perhaps not in military or diplomatic terms, but those are strong, aggressive and potentially dangerous words to use to an important trading bloc and, hitherto, your country's closest diplomatic and military ally. Naming the EU as your enemy may well prove to have long-term negative consequences for your country and for the countries of Europe i.e. almost the entirety of the so-called Western alliance.

In sports and talent shows exaggeration and hyperbole serve just to ramp up the drama of the entertainment. In the diplomatic, economic and political spheres exaggeration, aggression and hyped-up rhetoric are dangerous and could be disastrous.
 
Evilroddy said:
Andalublue:

The European Union is only a moderate economic rival to the USA and generally cooperates with American interests and policy when push comes to shove. Calling the EU a "foe" is hyperbole and is just plain daft.

China is a much stronger economic rival to the USA and presents a long-term political and even a military threat to America by challenging American global hegemony in Asia and the Western Pacific Ocean. China is rapidly moving to economic parity with America on a gross national product basis. Per capita it is still far behind America due to it's huge population. China is a serious economic and political rival to America but for the foreseeable future presents only a modest military threat to America. That could change if America pushes too hard. So China is a potential "foe" but is not presently one at the moment.

Russia, under the leadership of Vladimir Putin, is a thorn in the side of America but is neither an effective economic nor military rival to America, it cannot afford to be. It is an effective political rival to American global hegemony and its capacity for destabilisation of foreign regimes and political movements is a real threat at least in the Russian near-abroad. Its capacity to wage low-cost but highly effective informational warfare, propaganda and hybrid-warfare makes it the most pressing foe which America faces right now. Russia is a foe and arguably an enemy of America right now but America has long been a foe of Russia/the USSR so there is a long pedigree to this enmity between Moscow and Washington.

The real threats to America are two.

The first is America itself and comes from the yawning divide between the interests and policies of the monied and powerful few and the political impotence and resulting frustrations of the increasingly marginalised many. This divide threatens the republic's foundational principles, threatens its democractic institutions and is transmogrifying America into an increasingly militarised and intrusive surveillance and security state, which uses propaganda and social conditioning to control the people and which is run by a corporatist oligarchy rather than a representative democracy.

The second great potential threat is a prosperous and united Eurasia as an economic, political and military bloc. Avoiding this development has been the prime focus of American foreign policy and military strategy since the end of WWII. The economic, political and military encirclement of the Eurasian landmass has been at the centre of US policy for more than 70 years now. However in reaction to this policy and to US global hegemony, and driven by Russian diplomacy and Chinese business interests that potential harmonisation of outlooks and policy in Eurasia is beginning to emerge, as both China and Russia grow tired of labouring under US global domination through an international system designed to impose Western interests and American interests over the whole world.

If President Trump continues to lord it over the world and to use bully diplomacy, trade wars and both covert and overt military force to compel compliance with the Western-skewed international system, then a United Eurasion bloc may emerge and could dislodge the US from its position as the monopolar global super-power. America must learn to share the globe with other nations and states and must be willing to surrender political and economic primacy gradually to emerging giants like China, India and Europe or the brittle international system will break and all humanity will suffer.

Cheers?
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...

Excellent contribution Evilroddy! Trump is leading the US into dangerous economic, diplomatic and political waters by deciding to make an enemy of the EU and in going to war with China, the EU and his NAFTA 'partners' on trade. The impetus he has given to the Sino-European cooperation by Trump's flirtations with Putin should be worrying American business. China and the EU are moving forward with cooperation on climate change, investment, ocean protection, anti-fraud measures, security and diplomatic issues. Trump's administration doesn't appear to want any such cooperation with either the Chinese or the Europeans.

The once essential American presence in discussions on matters of global cooperation seems to be a thing of the past. Trump's far-right cheer-leaders appear not to believe such a thing is necessary. Time will tell.

Trump also seems to believe that his new bessie, Putin is the most important person to keep sweet. He's certainly very important when it comes to military interventions around the globe, but this is a man who is leading the world's 12th largest economy. Trump is waging trade war with the EU and China, two economic powers that are respectively 12 and 8 times the size of the Russian economy. Heck, Canada and South Korea on their own are stronger economic powers than Russia. Does that make economic sense?
 
Andalublue said:
No. This is why it is so dangerous having a moron like Trump running the most powerful nation in the world. Words have both meaning and consequences, most glaringly in the diplomatic ambit. 'Foe' does not mean rival or competitor. You cannot have a friendly foe. You cannot be a friend of a foe, it's one or the other.

Mr Webster makes this perfectly clear:

FOE:
1 : one who has personal enmity for another
Embrace, embrace, my Sons! be foes no more! —Alexander Pope
2 a : an enemy in war
b : adversary, opponent a political foe
3 : one who opposes on principle a foe of needless expenditures a foe of censorship
4 : something prejudicial or injurious

Trump has identified the EU as the USA's enemy in trade and economics. Perhaps not in military or diplomatic terms, but those are strong, aggressive and potentially dangerous words to use to an important trading bloc and, hitherto, your country's closest diplomatic and military ally. Naming the EU as your enemy may well prove to have long-term negative consequences for your country and for the countries of Europe i.e. almost the entirety of the so-called Western alliance.

In sports and talent shows exaggeration and hyperbole serve just to ramp up the drama of the entertainment. In the diplomatic, economic and political spheres exaggeration, aggression and hyped-up rhetoric are dangerous and could be disastrous.
Click to expand...

If by now, anyone thinks Trump uses diplomat lingo, or treats what he says as such, I feel that the staff who have to take care of them are underpaid.
 
HK.227 said:
If by now, anyone thinks Trump uses diplomat lingo, or treats what he says as such, I feel that the staff who have to take care of them are underpaid.
Click to expand...

So, you're saying he never means what he says, or that what he says is in a language that only he understands. Piece of advice: when talking to foreign leaders, whose first language is rarely English, least of all Trumpish, what you say matters. The words you use matter. Insults and fighting talk cannot always be walked back. Loose talk has consequences. I'm wondering whether the almost universal condemnation he has received for yesterday's fiasco might, for once, filter into his consciousness.
 
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Infinite Chaos said:
Yada yada yada. You "cleaned up the French mess" in SE Asia out of your own altruistic impulses? Really?
Click to expand...

It is never altruism. No self entitled altruist can ever be trusted.

Were you is SE Asia during the 60's? It was a French mess, and far worse than Algeria. And it all fed into well cultivated American anticommunist paranoia.

https://listverse.com/2018/07/11/10-moments-in-american-history-as-seen-from-the-other-side/

Whatever motivates or has motivated American behavior, still does not make Europe an ally any less responsible for its own self created horrors, depredations against humanity or a loyal friend of the US.

You (generically) are no one to criticize the US.

When Merkel and cohorts tried to stare down Trump at the G7 because of his then threats to impose tariffs, the media story concentrated on Trump throwing Starbursts candy out of his pocket on to the table in front of Merkel. The media almost completely omitted his following words to Merkel, "I'm all for fair trade. Let's eliminate all tariffs." All US goods imported into Europe suffer tariffs. Almost none for European goods imported into the US. Trump sinned and is sinning. He's leveling the playing field. Point your finger back at the US accomplishes nothing. Merkel was left speechless. How rare is that?

The US is a racist bigoted country which wants to shut it borders down against brown skinned illegal immigrants. How vile says Europe. Meanwhile the rising right of Europe is making the same demand for Europe. The people want no more Asian and African refuggees and politicians like Merkel are facing reelection defeat in their own nations. Macron calls Trump almost everyday for advice while excoriating him in public. Hungary is a permeant representative to the EU, but it has not accepted one refugee within its borders.

I could easily go on, but don't continue to give me crap about European moral superiority and lack of corruption. You have more of your own politicians who have served hard time for corruption than the US, and on both continents the big boys are are free to continue as they please. Brexit is your future. The US will remain one nation.

You better damn well pray we don't decide to close down our military bases in Europe. Local economies in Europe will be devastated.

Go munch on a Jaffa orange. The agrarian fields of Spain have suffered desertization. Venice is still an open cesspool and a decaying slum. Russia still fears German militarization. Norway's millennials are still the most wealthy in the world.
 
OldFatGuy said:
It is never altruism. No self entitled altruist can ever be trusted.

Were you is SE Asia during the 60's? It was a French mess, and far worse than Algeria. And it all fed into well cultivated American anticommunist paranoia.

https://listverse.com/2018/07/11/10-moments-in-american-history-as-seen-from-the-other-side/

Whatever motivates or has motivated American behavior, still does not make Europe an ally any less responsible for its own self created horrors, depredations against humanity or a loyal friend of the US.

You (generically) are no one to criticize the US.

When Merkel and cohorts tried to stare down Trump at the G7 because of his then threats to impose tariffs, the media story concentrated on Trump throwing Starbursts candy out of his pocket on to the table in front of Merkel. The media almost completely omitted his following words to Merkel, "I'm all for fair trade. Let's eliminate all tariffs." All US goods imported into Europe suffer tariffs. Almost none for European goods imported into the US. Trump sinned and is sinning. He's leveling the playing field. Point your finger back at the US accomplishes nothing. Merkel was left speechless. How rare is that?

The US is a racist bigoted country which wants to shut it borders down against brown skinned illegal immigrants. How vile says Europe. Meanwhile the rising right of Europe is making the same demand for Europe. The people want no more Asian and African refuggees and politicians like Merkel are facing reelection defeat in their own nations. Macron calls Trump almost everyday for advice while excoriating him in public. Hungary is a permeant representative to the EU, but it has not accepted one refugee within its borders.

I could easily go on, but don't continue to give me crap about European moral superiority and lack of corruption. You have more of your own politicians who have served hard time for corruption than the US, and on both continents the big boys are are free to continue as they please. Brexit is your future. The US will remain one nation.

You better damn well pray we don't decide to close down our military bases in Europe. Local economies in Europe will be devastated.

Go munch on a Jaffa orange. The agrarian fields of Spain have suffered desertization. Venice is still an open cesspool and a decaying slum. Russia still fears German militarization. Norway's millennials are still the most wealthy in the world.
Click to expand...


You won’t close those bases because you need them to continue your global hegemony.
 
Higgins86 said:
You won’t close those bases because you need them to continue your global hegemony.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the chuckles. We're not interested in remaining everyone's target as king of the hill, and we are sick from playing the world's police and EMT service. We have enough of our own problems to tend.

Do let us know how you fill the vacuum when we are gone. We could use more laughs.

We want all American troops home where they are safer. We don't care if you sink or swim. Nor do we care if you all start killing each other again. Have a blast.
 
OldFatGuy said:
Thanks for the chuckles. We're not interested in remaining everyone's target as king of the hill, and we are sick from playing the world's police and EMT service. We have enough of our own problems to tend.

Do let us know how you fill the vacuum when we are gone. We could use more laughs.

We want all American troops home where they are safer. We don't care if you sink or swim. Nor do we care if you all start killing each other again. Have a blast.
Click to expand...



You think they are there for Europe’s safety? Lol now I’m the one chuckling . Tell me how was Germany protected during the Iraq war when Ramstein was used as a forward operating base?
 
OldFatGuy said:
It is never altruism. No self entitled altruist can ever be trusted.


Were you is SE Asia during the 60's? It was a French mess, and far worse than Algeria. And it all fed into well cultivated American anticommunist paranoia.


https://listverse.com/2018/07/11/10-moments-in-american-history-as-seen-from-the-other-side/


Whatever motivates or has motivated American behavior, still does not make Europe an ally any less responsible for its own self created horrors, depredations against humanity or a loyal friend of the US.


You (generically) are no one to criticize the US.


When Merkel and cohorts tried to stare down Trump at the G7 because of his then threats to impose tariffs, the media story concentrated on Trump throwing Starbursts candy out of his pocket on to the table in front of Merkel. The media almost completely omitted his following words to Merkel, "I'm all for fair trade. Let's eliminate all tariffs." All US goods imported into Europe suffer tariffs. Almost none for European goods imported into the US. Trump sinned and is sinning. He's leveling the playing field. Point your finger back at the US accomplishes nothing. Merkel was left speechless. How rare is that?


The US is a racist bigoted country which wants to shut it borders down against brown skinned illegal immigrants. How vile says Europe. Meanwhile the rising right of Europe is making the same demand for Europe. The people want no more Asian and African refuggees and politicians like Merkel are facing reelection defeat in their own nations. Macron calls Trump almost everyday for advice while excoriating him in public. Hungary is a permeant representative to the EU, but it has not accepted one refugee within its borders.


I could easily go on, but don't continue to give me crap about European moral superiority and lack of corruption. You have more of your own politicians who have served hard time for corruption than the US, and on both continents the big boys are are free to continue as they please. Brexit is your future. The US will remain one nation.


You better damn well pray we don't decide to close down our military bases in Europe. Local economies in Europe will be devastated.


Go munch on a Jaffa orange. The agrarian fields of Spain have suffered desertization. Venice is still an open cesspool and a decaying slum. Russia still fears German militarization. Norway's millennials are still the most wealthy in the world.
Click to expand...

What Higgins said. (two posts above)
 
Higgins86 said:
You think they are there for Europe’s safety? Lol now I’m the one chuckling . Tell me how was Germany protected during the Iraq war when Ramstein was used as a forward operating base?
Click to expand...

Safety of Europe's economy.

 
No.

But they have been free-loading for quite some time.
 
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