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Austria's tilt toward Russia worries intelligence experts

Rogue Valley

Rogue Valley

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Austria's tilt toward Russia worries intelligence experts

180509-far-right-vienna-mc-14552_d5091d0c8366e7cba75c035e966d7f10.focal-760x380.JPG

Russian embassy in Vienna, Austria

5/22/18

VIENNA — In a 19th-century kaffeehaus here, a handful of political activists nod their heads while sharing opinions many would consider racist, homophobic and awash with conspiracy theories. One topic is never far from their lips: These men believe that historically neutral Austria should turn its back on the West and embrace Russian President Vladimir Putin. "It's our aim to somehow counter this negative image of Russia propagated in Western media," Alexander Markovics, 26, says between sips of fizzy apple juice. "We have to take the side of Russia," the stocky and bearded Markovics adds. "Russia is a country that gets oppressed and is actually the victim of Western imperialism." Here in Austria, pro-Kremlin views aren't just confined to fringe political meetings. The country's government appears to be drifting closer to Putin. With Vienna widely regarded as the spying capital of the world, that has serious implications for Washington and its allies. One factor is at the heart of these concerns: the far-right Freedom Party of Austria (FPÖ) — which is openly supportive of Russia.

"Austria is economically and politically integrated in the West, but the FPÖ is trying to play the card of being part of the East," says Gustav Gressel, a former desk officer at the Austrian Ministry of Defense. "If you have an East-West confrontation, you basically have parts of your enemy behind your own lines." Founded by former Nazis in the 1950s, the FPÖ has been a junior member of the country's coalition government since December. As part of that deal, it was given responsibility for Austria's defense and interior ministries, and with them the domestic and military intelligence services. The FPÖ won 26 percent of the vote in last year's legislative elections by deploying anti-establishment, anti-immigrant populist rhetoric that was condemned by opponents as racist, Islamophobic and anti-Semitic. "Austria is part of the European Union defense policy, and whatever is agreed and discussed there will be leaked to Moscow," predicts Gressel, who is now a senior policy fellow at the European Council on Foreign Relations in Berlin. "The issue is trust and mistrust," says Siegfried Beer, a leading espionage expert at the Austrian Center for Intelligence, Propaganda and Security Studies, who added that in terms of security and dealing with partners, giving the FPÖ control of the intelligence services "was not the best solution."
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Troubling. With the US adrift under Donald Trump and an eviscerated US State Department, Fascist/Far-Right nationalist parties are gaining more control within Europe in Austria, Italy, Hungary, and Serbia. To make matters even worse, they support and are supported by the Vladimir Putin regime of Russia.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Austria's tilt toward Russia worries intelligence experts

180509-far-right-vienna-mc-14552_d5091d0c8366e7cba75c035e966d7f10.focal-760x380.JPG

Russian embassy in Vienna, Austria



Troubling. With the US adrift under Donald Trump and an eviscerated US State Department, Fascist/Far-Right nationalist parties are gaining more control within Europe in Austria, Italy, Hungary, and Serbia. To make matters even worse, they support and are supported by the Vladimir Putin regime of Russia.
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I would like to see a link to that alleged 'fascist' support by Putin. Ukraine is fascist, far right and supported by the USA so there seems to be a contradiction in your analogy.
/
 
Well right wing parties have gained control of America too so its happening everywhere.
 
DaveFagan said:
I would like to see a link to that alleged 'fascist' support by Putin. Ukraine is fascist, far right and supported by the USA so there seems to be a contradiction in your analogy.
/
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The two far right political parties in Ukraine are the “Right Sector”, and “Svoboda”. The rest are left, green, left of centre, centre, and conservative parties.

In the 2014 parliamentary elections Svoboda attained 4.71%, and Right Sector about 1.7% of the popular vote.

Putin called Ukraine 'fascist'.... Channeling Moscow once again, eh?
 
Fledermaus said:
The two far right political parties in Ukraine are the “Right Sector”, and “Svoboda”. The rest are left, green, left of centre, centre, and conservative parties.

In the 2014 parliamentary elections Svoboda attained 4.71%, and Right Sector about 1.7% of the popular vote.

Putin called Ukraine 'fascist'.... Channeling Moscow once again, eh?
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Per usual, you are completely misinformed.
/
 
DaveFagan said:
Per usual, you are completely misinformed.
/
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Per usual... Claim without support.

Other than Putin and RT claiming Ukraine is fascist have you anything to support your claim?

Ukraine has a Nazi problem and a Western media problem — RT Op-ed
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/406991-western-media-ukraine-nazi/

Oct 17, 2017 - Last weekend saw Ukraine's biggest Nazi march of modern times. Yet, the Western media and its numerous correspondents in Kiev completely ...
Ukraine's far-right honors SS unit, but guess what the ... - RT.com
https://www.rt.com/news/424818-lvov-nazi-galicia-celebration/

Apr 22, 2018 - A notorious Waffen SS division is celebrated with an exhibition of swastikas, Nazi attire and pictures in Lvov, Ukraine, but for some Western ...
Brits recruited by Ukrainian Neo-Nazi paramilitary organizations — RT ...
https://www.rt.com/uk/420266-right-wing-ukraine-britain/

Mar 2, 2018 - Ukrainian Neo-Nazi groups involved in fighting in eastern Ukraine are actively seeking to recruit British far-right activists. The anti-fascist ...
Thousands march in Ukraine to mark Nazi collaborator ... - RT.com
https://www.rt.com/news/414827-bandera-torch-marches-ukraine/

Jan 2, 2018 - Some 6500 people across Ukraine took part in marches on the first day of the year to mark the birthday of Stepan Bandera, a Ukrainian ...
Growing number of German & intl fighters join Ukrainian neo-Nazi ...
https://www.rt.com/news/409605-germans-join-ukrainian-azov/

Nov 12, 2017 - Over 2500 foreign mercenaries fight on the side of Ukraine's neo-Nazi Azov Battalion in E. Ukraine – 3 times more than in 2014, Spiegel ...
Far-right in US & Ukraine – same problem, different approach - RT.com
https://www.rt.com/news/399605-far-right-us-ukraine-approach/

Aug 14, 2017 - The neo-Nazi torchlight processions which are frequently held in post-Maidan Ukraine, however, have received vastly different coverage in the ...
'Result of Maidan – revival of Nazism in Ukraine' — RT Op-ed - RT.com
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/248497-ukraine-law-fascists-nazi-ww2/

Apr 10, 2015 - So-called 'European values' in action can be witnessed as Kiev forges its new 'artificial' identity, and leans on Nazi collaboration 70 years after ...
World must not stand by idly as Ukraine glorifies Nazism at ... - RT.com
https://www.rt.com/news/425321-ukraine-government-glorification-nazism/

Apr 27, 2018 - ... a Nazi SS division, Israeli political analyst Avigdor Eskin told RT. ... 'World must not stand by idly as Ukraine glorifies Nazism at govt level'.
 
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Can we talk about Austria?
 
American said:
Can we talk about Austria?
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Sure. Just have to clear up Fagan's lie first.....

See that yellow dot (Oleh Tyahnybok) on the far left hand side (near Poland)? That is the only voting district captured by the far-right in the last Ukraine election.

Kandydaty-prez-lidery-2014.jpg


Tip: Never ever trust Fagan and his pro-Russia lies/conspiracies.
 
Fledermaus said:
The two far right political parties in Ukraine are the “Right Sector”, and “Svoboda”. The rest are left, green, left of centre, centre, and conservative parties.

In the 2014 parliamentary elections Svoboda attained 4.71%, and Right Sector about 1.7% of the popular vote.

Putin called Ukraine 'fascist'.... Channeling Moscow once again, eh?
Click to expand...

if that is the case then why did they make WW2 war criminals national heroes ??? who killed over 100,000 poles and over 60,000 jews and rounded up 1.4 million jews in Ukraine and why no investigation or conviction into the 2014 massacres in Odessa and Mariupol 1 week apart, or th e AZOV battalion/Division which is the largest organised force in Ukraine which is also recognised as being a fascist organisation
 
Rogue Valley said:
Sure. Just have to clear up Fagan's lie first.....

See that yellow dot (Oleh Tyahnybok) on the far left hand side (near Poland)? That is the only voting district captured by the far-right in the last Ukraine election.

Kandydaty-prez-lidery-2014.jpg


Tip: Never ever trust Fagan and his pro-Russia lies/conspiracies.
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keep in mind the 2 largest parties in South Eastern Ukraine are banned which represents the people living in that region the party of the regions and the communist party .... all elections in Ukraine since 2014 are null and void, going by Ukrainian law Viktor Yanukovych is still the lawful president of Ukraine, they did not have enough votes in parliament to remove him
 
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I have lived in Austria. Vienna is one of the best cities in the world to live in.

Most of Austria simply doesn't take itself as seriously in the way a lot of developed countries do. They haven't had a sizeable military since the end of WW2. During the Cold War, Russia could have conquered the country in 2 or 3 days. They also have a government that spreads the power around. One European PM liked to quip that a raft was slower than a battleship, but if you got a hole, you wouldn't sink.

Lastly, the Right was heavily suppressed in most of Europe for a couple generations.

So, from my POV, you have a Right wing that is feeling it's oats, you have a country that wants to play as small a role as possible in the struggles of the Great Powers, and that's largely because they have better things to do than throw their money away. It's not a rich country.

Russia would have a LOT less success in Europe if we weren't driving them into Putin's arms.

Most presidents suck at foreign affairs, it's really, really hard. It's mostly a question of how bad they are. Just bad, or terrible.

How can anyone be worse than President Cheney??? (Cheney built a glass cage around Bush, and ran the government from the shadows. Even after Bush found out, he was in a constant struggle with Cheney). Cheney was a disaster, Trump is even worse.
 
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Godric1970 said:
if that is the case then why did they make WW2 war criminals national heroes ??? who killed over 100,000 poles and over 60,000 jews and rounded up 1.4 million jews in Ukraine and why no investigation or conviction into the 2014 massacres in Odessa and Mariupol 1 week apart, or th e AZOV battalion/Division which is the largest organised force in Ukraine which is also recognised as being a fascist organisation
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“They’re being honored not for anti-Semitic crimes, but for their fighting for Ukrainian independence against Russia."
- Josef Zissels, head of the Vaad organization of Ukrainian Jews

As to Odessa and Mariupol... Have you someone other than RT or Pravda stating it was "fascists" involved?

And one battalion does not an army make.
 
Godric1970 said:
keep in mind the 2 largest parties in South Eastern Ukraine are banned which represents the people living in that region the party of the regions and the communist party .... all elections in Ukraine since 2014 are null and void, going by Ukrainian law Viktor Yanukovych is still the lawful president of Ukraine, they did not have enough votes in parliament to remove him
Click to expand...

The people have spoken... And he is OUTTA HERE!
 
late said:
I have lived in Austria. Vienna is one of the best cities in the world to live in.

Most of Austria simply doesn't take itself as seriously in the way a lot of developed countries do. They haven't had a sizeable military since the end of WW2. During the Cold War, Russia could have conquered the country in 2 or 3 days. They also have a government that spreads the power around. One European PM liked to quip that a raft was slower than a battleship, but if you got a hole, you wouldn't sink.

Lastly, the Right was heavily suppressed in most of Europe for a couple generations.

So, from my POV, you have a Right wing that is feeling it's oats, you have a country that wants to play as small a role as possible in the struggles of the Great Powers, and that's largely because they have better things to do than throw their money away. It's not a rich country.

Russia would have a LOT less success in Europe if we weren't driving them into Putin's arms.

Most presidents suck at foreign affairs, it's really, really hard. It's mostly a question of how bad they are. Just bad, or terrible.

How can anyone be worse than President Cheney??? (Cheney built a glass cage around Bush, and ran the government from the shadows. Even after Bush found out, he was in a constant struggle with Cheney). Cheney was a disaster, Trump is even worse.
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President Pence?
 
PoS said:
President Pence?
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He's another incompetent boob, the way most Republican presidents are these days.

He's also in the Koch brothers pocket.

So the answer is I don't know.

The presidency is a test of character. Some, like Truman, rise to the challenge. Many others do not.

But.. because he'd be a lame duck leading a disgraced party... I doubt he would be able to do as much damage. But it's pure guess, Republicans have been acting batsh*t crazy lately.
 
Godric1970 said:
keep in mind the 2 largest parties in South Eastern Ukraine are banned....
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No political party advancing the foreign-invader agenda is going to be allowed in any country.
 
We should address why they exist and why they gain ground. Thoughts?
 
While Putin is engaged with peaceful trade proposals with many other countries in St. Petersburg, DJT is engaged in tweeting and talking trash and hostility with those same countries. What a stark contrast between the 2 leaders, but anybody with an open mind that is paying attention already knows that.

With its bellicosity over decades, the US has driven many former allies away. DJT comes on the scene and "seals the deal". The US government is an embarrassment. Austria wants no part of such crazy stuff. The antics of Nikki Haley and her several bosses are enough for them. I can't blame them.
 

. . . Despite all the happy talk about connecting people, the Internet has not spread liberty around the world. On the contrary, the world is less free, in part because of the Web. In 2005, when about a quarter of the world’s population was online, common sense held that more connectivity would mean more freedom. But while Mark Zuckerberg was calling connectivity a basic human right, the more traditional rights were in decline as the Internet advanced. According to Freedom House, every year since 2005 has seen a retreat in democracy and an advance of authoritarianism. The year 2017, when the Internet reached more than half the world’s population, was marked by Freedom House as particularly disastrous. Young people who came of age with the Internet care less about democracy and are more sympathetic to authoritarianism than any other generation.
It’s also telling that the Internet has become a weapon of choice for those who wish to spread authoritarianism. Russia’s president and its leading propagandist both cite a fascist philosopher who believed that factuality was meaningless. In 2016, Russian Twitter bots spread divisive messages designed to discourage some Americans from voting and encourage others to vote for Russia’s preferred presidential candidate, Donald Trump. Britain’s vote to leave the European Union that same year was substantially influenced by bots from beyond its borders. Germany’s democratic parties, by contrast, have agreed not to use bots during political campaigns. The only party to resist the idea was the extreme right Alternative für Deutschland — which was helped by Russia’s bots in last year’s elections. . . .
 
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