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Is there an advantage to becoming a minority?

I

International10

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Slightly Liberal
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities?
 
International10 said:
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities?
Click to expand...

You seem awfully confuzzled.
 
International10 said:
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities? Other countries have maintained freedom from diversification
Click to expand...

If I had to answer, I'd say it was due to the pressure put on society by individuals designed to behave in a socially acceptable manner. Ie: to conform. Western civilizations have always advanced individual freedoms. Other countries have maintained freedom from diversification. To explain, they have welcomed their own cultures as the very culture of the world/nation. They recognize the strength of being "the same". I don't necessarily agree as I believe one country can unite behind one culture and one common goal. However, with that said it may be more difficult than anything expressed in words.

China and Russia and other countries which do not allow for such diversity in suppprt of their nation may prove to be superior in terms of public strength. It's very simple/united we stand and divided we fall.
 
International10 said:
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities?
Click to expand...

The reason it isn't happening worldwide is countries outside of Europe and the good old USA controls their borders. Who comes into their country and how long they can stay. Other countries don't put up with illegals entering. Other countries has strict immigration polices who can become a permanent resident there. That is outside of Europe and the U.S.

Is it best for native whites to become a minority? That all depends on the quality of the immigrants coming in. Good people are good people regardless of race and bad people are bad people, again regardless of race. We should be attracting the worlds best and brightest regardless of race. All others are a drain.
 
International10 said:
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities?
Click to expand...

I'm guessing one of the biggest variables is that countries that are of western European heritage are the best countries in the world to live in, so they are subject to higher levels of immigration from around the world. Very few are clamoring to move to Saudi Arabia or Mexico.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
Sorry I've made you run and hide so often.

Still, it's good for a laugh every now and then.
Click to expand...

Since that has never happened, I fail to see what point you're trying to make. How about you cry some more.
 
International10 said:
As we all know many western countries only have a couple decades left until whites are a minority (USA 2044, Sweden 2042, with France, Britain, Canada, The Netherlands, and Italy not far behind).

One of the primary justifications you hear for this is "Globilization" Essentially a common answer seems to be "hey this is the world of the future its happening everywhere"

The only problem is that its not happening everywhere. Are China, South Korea, and Japan facing substantial demographic changes? Are people in Japan clamoring for more diversity? Are they upset that Japan is too Japanese? No; What about Mexico, Columbia, and Argentina? Are Mexicans tired of being too Mexican? No; What about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE? Is Saudi Arabia sick of all these Arab Sunni Muslims. Are they clamoring for secular white liberals to move to Saudia Arabia to "Diversify"? No.

So it really just seems that one part of the world is facing demographic suicide. Europe and North America.

Since it is obviously not some global phenomenon but rather specifically unique to Europe and North America, I have two questions:

  1. Why is this phenonema uniqe to the west?
  2. Why is it in the interest of native white populations to become minorities?
Click to expand...

Is it a problem that whites are becoming a minority. After all it's not as if america, the land of equality, discriminates against minorities is it?
 
Fishking said:
I'm guessing one of the biggest variables is that countries that are of western European heritage are the best countries in the world to live in, so they are subject to higher levels of immigration from around the world. Very few are clamoring to move to Saudi Arabia or Mexico.
Click to expand...

Per capita economic oppurtunity is certainly an important factor, however countries like Japan and South Korea are highly advanced and have very strong median incomes etc. The same could be said about certain Arab states or relatively wealthy South American countries like Argentina; However, none of these countries seems to be interested in losing their demographic status qous.

In other words there are two important questions involved in this issue:
First, (From an immigrants POV) is there some type of economic or increased safety/stability to be gained by going to the new country?
Second, (From the Native Population's POV) how accepting should we be of large scale immigration?

The countries listed above all provide economic oppurtunties and safety/stability as compared to most countries around the world; however, the native populations are simply not interested in becoming minorities and institute public policies to make sure that it stays that way.
 
soylentgreen said:
Is it a problem that whites are becoming a minority. After all it's not as if america, the land of equality, discriminates against minorities is it?
Click to expand...

Any minority in just about any country around the world faces discrimination. Minorities in many other countries to a greater extent than here at home. Would you really want to be a Persian Shia living in an Arab Sunni country?

This is one of the biggest catalysts for my question. Why should white people want to become a minority?
 
Fishking said:
Since that has never happened, I fail to see what point you're trying to make. How about you cry some more.
Click to expand...

Your imagination is simultaneously hilarious and, frankly, pathetic.

Good luck with your magical thinking!

Sorry I've made you run and hide so often.

Still, it's good for a laugh every now and then.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
Your imagination is simultaneously hilarious and, frankly, pathetic.

Good luck with your magical thinking!

Sorry I've made you run and hide so often.

Still, it's good for a laugh every now and then.
Click to expand...

6,249
 
International10 said:
Per capita economic oppurtunity is certainly an important factor, however countries like Japan and South Korea are highly advanced and have very strong median incomes etc. The same could be said about certain Arab states or relatively wealthy South American countries like Argentina; However, none of these countries seems to be interested in losing their demographic status qous.
Click to expand...

Some Arab countries are wealthy but they are also notoriously lacking in freedom, equality, and have high levels of corruption. For example, you cannot own a business in Kuwait without being sponsored by an actual Kuwaiti citizen. I don't know as much about some of the South American countries but I'm guessing that they still have significant corruption, less safety and equality, to include standard of living. I also don't know as much about Japan but it's also a small island. They probably don't really take a lot of immigration.

It's a combination of having the greatest level of freedom and equality, standard of living, and opportunity to make $$, more accepting, ect.

The countries listed above all provide economic oppurtunties and safety/stability as compared to most countries around the world; however, the native populations are simply not interested in becoming minorities and institute public policies to make sure that it stays that way.
Click to expand...

I don't care if we turn 100% Jamaican black in a couple generations so long as our culture and values remain what they are (caveat not those of the progressive left but traditional American values). That's the problem we are face, not the different skin colors but a lack of cultural integration.
 
Fishking said:
Some Arab countries are wealthy but they are also notoriously lacking in freedom, equality, and have high levels of corruption. For example, you cannot own a business in Kuwait without being sponsored by an actual Kuwaiti citizen. I don't know as much about some of the South American countries but I'm guessing that they still have significant corruption, less safety and equality, to include standard of living. I also don't know as much about Japan but it's also a small island. They probably don't really take a lot of immigration.

It's a combination of having the greatest level of freedom and equality, standard of living, and opportunity to make $$, more accepting, ect.



I don't care if we turn 100% Jamaican black in a couple generations so long as our culture and values remain what they are (caveat not those of the progressive left but traditional American values). That's the problem we are face, not the different skin colors but a lack of cultural integration.
Click to expand...

First: I would agree, all things considered, the west has achieved the most agreeable societies in the history of the world which naturally attracts people from far less "agreeable" societies; however, my point in brining up certain other countries is that, whatever problems they may have, they are far superior to many other nations. For example in oil rich Saudi Arabia they way higher standard of living than in Somalia or Ethiopia. An Ethiopian or Somalian has every reason to immigrate to Saudi Arabia especially considering how relatively close it is. Why don't they? Saudi Arabia simply feels it has no interest in welcoming millions of sub-saharan africans.

Second: You say you are simply interested in maintaining a "traditional" America. Traditions come from people not from land. Istanbul used to be Constantinople.....
 
International10 said:
First: I would agree, all things considered, the west has achieved the most agreeable societies in the history of the world which naturally attracts people from far less "agreeable" societies; however, my point in brining up certain other countries is that, whatever problems they may have, they are far superior to many other nations. For example in oil rich Saudi Arabia they way higher standard of living than in Somalia or Ethiopia. An Ethiopian or Somalian has every reason to immigrate to Saudi Arabia especially considering how relatively close it is. Why don't they? Saudi Arabia simply feels it has no interest in welcoming millions of sub-saharan africans.
Click to expand...

Well, that, and they will most likely be **** on by the society there. They know that, and so they don't bother to go. I mean, why would an woman ever got to Saudi Arabia?

Second: You say you are simply interested in maintaining a "traditional" America. Traditions come from people not from land. Istanbul used to be Constantinople.....
Click to expand...

Correct, that's why I said that integration is what is important. Constantinople didn't integrate a different people group, they were conquered. That's about as far away from integration as possible.
 
International10 said:
Why come onto a debate forum to just issue pedantic conclusory statements? If I am so obviously wrong take the time to state your point of view.
Click to expand...
Would be bit like if you'd made the claim of the sun rising in the West tomorrow and then asking to debate that.

Is this your way of repeating asinine claims by starting just another thread (rather than pulling an already failed one out of its justified sleep)?
 
Fishking said:
Well, that, and they will most likely be **** on by the society there. They know that, and so they don't bother to go. I mean, why would an woman ever got to Saudi Arabia?



Correct, that's why I said that integration is what is important. Constantinople didn't integrate a different people group, they were conquered. That's about as far away from integration as possible.
Click to expand...

I agree integration is important; however, we can't pretend that where immigrants come from and how many come doesn't matter. Creating a Europeon "New World" which received almost exclusively Europeons from about 1790 to 1965 provided the right atmosphere for a digestable "mixing bowl" of different groups. Its also important to note that different sets of Europeons came in particular waves which were then followed by relatively short "integration" periods before new waves began to arrive.

On the other hand, today we have seen an almost steady stream of Mexican/Central American immigrants from 1970 to today which is increasingly creating a country within a country. If we severly limited immigration for a couple of decades I think it would provide a sort of "integration" period.
 
Chagos said:
Would be bit like if you'd made the claim of the sun rising in the West tomorrow and then asking to debate that.

Is this your way of repeating asinine claims by starting just another thread (rather than pulling an already failed one out of its justified sleep)?
Click to expand...

Please issue substantive arguments rather than conclusory statements. If you think my arguments are asinine, you should articulate why.
 
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