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Thread: Myopic Scottish National Party

  1. #11
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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    I see no reason to think we already had them, and the laws and rules are certainly not just harmonisation by most people's definition - like when the EU randomly banned open sauce containers in restaurants (one of the few directives quickly overturned by public clamour). 60% is probably a conservative estimate.
    Open sauce containers? Never happened. The EU tried to put in place regulations on olive oil containers in public places sure, but open sauce containers? And the olive oil containers was a proposal, and it never passed.

    And the fact that you dont think that most of the regulations are some that you already had.. only shows how little you know of how government works and especially the UK government. Do you really think that the UK had no regulations on say agriculture or workers rights or how much crap that is allowed in the food before they entered the EEC? That the UK did not have regulations that prevented competition or regulations that prevented foreigen companies ? Are you that naive? Or are you saying that the UK would not have implemented clean energy legislation if it was not for the EU? Seriously?
    PeteEU

  2. #12
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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Yes, sorry, it was olive oil. It wasn't a proposal in the sense of a thought bubble. It wasn't fully implemented but it had worked its way through most of the black box of the comitology and would have been but for a rare backdown under public pressure.

    Pete, you seem to be saying that because the UK might has its own regulations in a broad area, that means any EU regulations in the same area are just harmonisation. Also you don't seem to recoginise that in many ways (not all, of course) the contents don't matter. We are British and don't want to be ruled by others. If, as a slave, my master mostly chooses for me the options I would have chosen anyway, that does not mean I am not a slave.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  3. #13
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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    If, as a slave, my master mostly chooses for me the options I would have chosen anyway, that does not mean I am not a slave.
    Excellent argument for the Scots to take back control of their own country.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    That's up to them, though it only makes sense if they aren't going to throw themselves straight into the EU. Personally, I think federalism would be best. I think we Brits are and aren't countrymen - I'm English first but then British. I think federalism captures this.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 03-21-17 at 06:12 AM.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    an excellent analogy Andalublue

    here is the reality facing Scotland currently

    Croatia has 4.4 million people and Scotland has 5.4 million Croatia has 13 MEPs Scotland has only 6 .. Croatia gets a vote on the EU council and has control/leads EU for 6 months in a 28 state rotation ... Scotland has none of that


  6. #16
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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    That graph gives no explanation for its claims. It is very hard to quantity these things - what does control mean? Besides, there is a lot of collusion and a lot of blurring of lines, as mentioned above - at all stages there has been a shameful surrender of sovereignty by our politicians and bureaucrats. In practical terms, though, we have reached the stage of a sharing of sovereignty and where the EU is probably the premier legislative and regulative arena for Britain. The graph, therefore, doesn't seem to represent reality.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  7. #17
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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post

    I'd be more sympathetic to the SNP if they didn't seem to want to break away from the UK only to throw themselves at the feet of the EU. At least have a little bit of self-respect and try to stand up for yourself as an independent nation.
    They're not really the same, and no amount of questionable stats and graphs change the reality.

    Scotland needs permission from Westminster to hold an independence referendum. The United Kingdom didn't need permission from Brussels to do theirs.

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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    Scotland needs permission from Westminster to hold an independence referendum. The United Kingdom didn't need permission from Brussels to do theirs.
    Excellent point.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Excellent point.
    Its a stolen point I must admit.

    Hope you're keeping well Andy.

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    Re: Myopic Scottish National Party

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    Its a stolen point I must admit.

    Hope you're keeping well Andy.
    I am extremely well and happy with life, Ben. Nice to see you again.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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