• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Fearing U.S. Withdrawal, Europe Considers Its Own Nuclear Deterrent

JANFU

Land by the Gulf Stream
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Monthly Donator
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
59,042
Reaction score
38,585
Location
Best Coast Canada
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/06/...column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Under such a plan, France’s arsenal would be repurposed to protect the rest of Europe and would be put under a common European command, funding plan, defense doctrine, or some combination of the three. It would be enacted only if the Continent could no longer count on American protection.

Though no new countries would join the nuclear club under this scheme, it would amount to an unprecedented escalation in Europe’s collective military power and a drastic break with American leadership.

Analysts say that the talk, even if it never translates into action, demonstrates the growing sense in Europe that drastic steps may be necessary to protect the postwar order in the era of a Trump presidency, a resurgent Russia and the possibility of an alignment between the two.
The first problem they should address is the 2% spending.
Having France as the ultimate keys to the weapons may not fly well with others.
Would GB also consider being included??? Considering the past 2 major wars, i would say it is possible.
Thoughts are?
 
And for 8 years the Con media machine and the Republicans got their gullible GOP base to believe Obama was ****ting all over out allies. That he was abandoning our allies. lol

We ain't seen nothing yet.
 
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/06/...nd-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news


The first problem they should address is the 2% spending.
Having France as the ultimate keys to the weapons may not fly well with others.
Would GB also consider being included??? Considering the past 2 major wars, i would say it is possible.
Thoughts are?

The U.K. Heftily advised against the European command much as they had against Schengen and the Euro. They were quite right as usual. This Brits understand that this is a break with the USA and will require security spending to go way above 2%.
This wrong turn makes war more probable. But as with Schengen and the Euro it will take some time.
 
And for 8 years the Con media machine and the Republicans got their gullible GOP base to believe Obama was ****ting all over out allies. That he was abandoning our allies. lol

We ain't seen nothing yet.

I'm not quite sure, what you mean.
 
If by that you mean reaching it, yes.

But reaching it is still no address for the lack of efficiency where it exists. IOW greater spending on military hardware or increase of personnel isn't going to tackle inefficient deployment of means, insufficient co-ordination or nebulous (conflicting) command structure.

Beyond which one wonders what a country like Luxembourg is going to spend 2 pct of its GDP on, nukes in the bank vaults?
Having France as the ultimate keys to the weapons may not fly well with others.
Would GB also consider being included??? Considering the past 2 major wars, i would say it is possible.
Thoughts are?
With the summer holidays of both European MPs and the press still far away, it's a bit early in the year for this constantly resurfacing mind game to fill up the media blanks and the empty parliaments. As it has been doing wrt to a "European Army" every year or so since long before Trump and Co. even went on the campaign trail.

Ain't gonna happen.

NATO is there to stay, Washington will never dissolve it, campaign hype or hype that followed be danged.
 
I'm not quite sure, what you mean.

I think I'm being clear. For 8 years the GOP and the Right criticized Obama for being weak and ineffective against Putin, they said Obama was being so weak that some of our allies didn't trust us. Even though at no time did any of our Allies believe we wouldn't back them, or come to their defense.

Yet in a mere 45 days Trump has been so much more weak and ineffective towards Putin that our allies are already taking drastic steps to possibly go it alone.

Yet now not only is there silence from the Right, they are actually defending and applauding how Trump is dealing with Putin.

Hypocrisy in the name of politics at it's finest.
 
I think I'm being clear. For 8 years the GOP and the Right criticized Obama for being weak and ineffective against Putin, they said Obama was being so weak that some of our allies didn't trust us. Even though at no time did any of our Allies believe we wouldn't back them, or come to their defense.

Yet in a mere 45 days Trump has been so much more weak and ineffective towards Putin that our allies are already taking drastic steps to possibly go it alone.

Yet now not only is there silence from the Right, they are actually defending and applauding how Trump is dealing with Putin.

Hypocrisy in the name of politics at it's finest.

Drawing a line in the sand and not acting on the other's crossing it must be criticized not so much for its indecisive weakness as for talking loudly without thinking about the consequences. That was the problem with Obama in that respect.
 
I can't see France handing over control of it's nukes.

Most countries like to keep that chain of command independent. So NATO for example has no nukes.
Some NATO members have them, but they are not in NATO's chain of command. They are independent.

Germany, the country nukes were invented for.. if they build them, we'll nuke them as will the Russians. And that will be jolly funny for everyone.

Really, if the EU wishes to be a nuclear power, then military intervention is called for to prevent this.
 
Back
Top Bottom