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Donald Trump’s Election Leaves Angela Merkel as the Liberal West’s Last Defender

truthatallcost

truthatallcost

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BERLIN — And then there was one.

Germany’s chancellor, Angela Merkel, has emerged as the last powerful defender of Europe and the trans-Atlantic alliance after the election of Donald J. Trump. But after 11 years in power, she is tired, her associates say, and under siege seemingly from all directions.

She is under pressure from the same forces that elevated Mr. Trump in America, fueled Britain’s vote to exit the European Union and are now propelling the populist Marine Le Pen in France. At home, the hard-right Alternative for Germany party has scored a string of victories in state elections.

An increasingly divided Europe is looking to Germany, its richest power, to cope with its many problems, some of them longstanding: low growth, a continuing stream of refugees, and increasingly angry and nationalistic electorates.
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One of my first posts on DP contained my belief that left wing policies in Europe and the US will only lead to a hard shift to the right. That was pre- Trump, Brexit, and Merkel's migrant meltdown.

Will AfD eventually gain power in Germany?

Thoughts?
Comments?
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/11/1...Germany+migrant&prmd=ivns&source=lnms&tbm=nws
 
For what they have done in my old country I wish Germany the very worst. If it takes Muslim refugees to destroy that monster, so be it.
 
legalimmigrant said:
For what they have done in my old country I wish Germany the very worst. If it takes Muslim refugees to destroy that monster, so be it.
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I can't root against the German people just because Merkel is a lunatic. Let's be hopeful that Germany can right the wrongs committed by SPD and CDU.
 
legalimmigrant said:
For what they have done in my old country I wish Germany the very worst. If it takes Muslim refugees to destroy that monster, so be it.
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Islam is destroying Europe. Time to call them out and say your intolerance is not welcome. Your violence is not welcome. Your law is not welcome. Fix your own mess in your own country.
 
Merkel has to be shaking in her comfortable shoes these days.

The gig is about up in Europe just as it is in so many other places.




Well, in my book you either do it right or you get eliminated.
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Gordon Gekko
 
Thoughts?
Comments?
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poll Nov-03 (if elections were next Sunday)BRDTrend.jpgfavoured coalitions (left=very good to good, right= less good to bad)Koalitionen.jpgsupport of political figures (note: Merkel down 2 points from previous month but still at 52 pct, Petry/AfD up 1 point but still only at 12 pct)politikerzufriendheit.jpg

Effect of US elections will be seen next month.

Next please.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Merkel has to be shaking in her comfortable shoes these days.

The gig is about up in Europe just as it is in so many other places.
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I'd not hold the gig to be up in the NYT just because of this rather myopic broad brush failure. But it needs to learn to discern the trees that block its view of the forest.

Even where it does go on to make differentiations later in the article.

Germany is not Europe and Europe is not Germany. Just as little as France or any other country one cares to name is comparable to Germany specifically or Europe generally.

That works vice versa as well.

Constantly mantra-ing about the pressure that Merkel faces at home and how the AfD is on the brink of taking power is simply wishful thinking on the part of certain interested parties.

It's also ridiculously stupid.
 
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truthatallcost said:
Will AfD eventually gain power in Germany?
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Anyway identity and immigration will be core political themes of this century since migratory pressures will continue to increase, and immigration and globalization will further threaten social identities and cultures and therefore revive the fundamental need for identity.

The 20th century was about freedom, emancipation and individualization. Now that this project is mostly achieved the next one will be about fitting a social mesh and collective life within this modern framework. Ethnic homogeneity will inevitably become a part of the answer.

So Germany will eventually swing to those themes since it is an immigration country with a dying population. It will probably be slower in Germany because of the strong ostracism but it will happen. However it could happen through a mutation of existing parties, not necessarily through a new party.

Other *i*mmigration countries are more likely to swing before that: UK, France, Italy, Netherlands, Denmark, Austria, Greece, and probably some Eastern European countries. However in *e*migration countries such as Spain or Greece this swing may never happen.
 
Auvergnat said:
~................................. However in *e*migration countries such as Spain or Greece this swing may never happen.
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Spain is an immigration country with foreign born people making up over 13 pct of its population. Puts it well above Germany (even with the influx there since Sep-2015).

Greece's foreign born population constitutes around 8 pct of the total population.
 
Auvergnat said:

So Germany will eventually swing to those themes since it is an immigration country with a dying population.
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Germany is not dying. Germany, like most of the white "progressive" countries, is killing itself with abortions.

This is just another outcome of the insanity of individual rights overriding the collective need to survive as a nation.

Another modern killer: single women playing mommies and daddies because "women can do what men can", and better.

So, instead of 3 kids, they have one, plus a dog or a cat, and, presto, a family.
 
Chagos said:
Spain is an immigration country with foreign born people making up over 13 pct of its population. Puts it well above Germany (even with the influx there since Sep-2015).

Greece's foreign born population constitutes around 8 pct of the total population.
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The share of immigrants in Spain has actually decreased since 2010, down to 10% (Wikipedia). Between 2013 and 2014 they lost 500k immigrants for example. Of course they could return to the previous situation in the future, in which case we will certainly see an anti-immigrant backlash.

As for Greece, I mentioned it both as an immigration and emigration country. Many young people emigrate, but at the same time they still have many immigrants left from before and they now are at the forefront of the refugees wave.
 
legalimmigrant said:
Germany is not dying. Germany, like most of the white "progressive" countries, is killing itself with abortions.

This is just another outcome of the insanity of individual rights overriding the collective need to survive as a nation.
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Rather than trying to seize control of women's bellies, would not it be better to question why there are so few children?

Here are a few problems with Germany:
* Very few childcare options.
* Ostracism against mothers who have a job (nicknamed "raven mothers") and against female employees who have babies. Hence why women prefer to not make babies since they do not want to be unemployed, despised, lonely and bored at home.
* Many men want no children at all and do not want to educate them.

I note that you only blame women, not men. And when women nevertheless decide to make a baby despite all those hardships, you still blame them. You would make a great German guy.

Meet France: a country where abortion is easy, where women work a lot, where contraceptives are widespread, where the fertility rate for natives is a rock-steady 1.9, and improving. The trick? Free and good education from pre-school to college, sometimes free childcare (improving), parental welfare, robust legal framework to protect female employees, maternity is positively looked at and the mother's choices are respected, whatever they may be.
 
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stevecanuck said:
Let's not forget about the man-child in-chief in Canada.
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I nearly didn't vote in that election- that's what I do ('don't do') when I don't like the Liberal leader, but he's looked really good by comparison these past few months.
 
Auvergnat said:
The share of immigrants in Spain has actually decreased since 2010, down to 10% (Wikipedia). Between 2013 and 2014 they lost 500k immigrants for example. Of course they could return to the previous situation in the future, in which case we will certainly see an anti-immigrant backlash.
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http://www.ine.es/prensa/np980.pdf
in brief (as of Jan-0, 2016)

- overall population fallen
- number of Spaniards risen
- mainly due to some 114,000 foreigners having acquired citizenship in 2015
- compared to previous year immigration in 2015 rose by 12.5 pct with emigration falling by 12.1 pct.
- 2015 showed the first positive migration balance for foreign nationals (i.e. more coming in than leaving or both balancing out) since 2010.

Actual percentage (today) of foreigners may indeed be argued but Spain remains an immigration country.
As for Greece, I mentioned it both as an immigration and emigration country. Many young people emigrate, but at the same time they still have many immigrants left from before and they now are at the forefront of the refugees wave.
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I agree that today's figures are somewhat skewed for Greece by the influx of refugees (often bound for elsewhere in the EU but now not succeeding in onward journey), nevertheless the trend for Greece has been to be an immigration country.

Both Spain and Greece suffer negative natural population growth.
 
Auvergnat said:
Rather than trying to seize control of women's bellies, would not it be better to question why there are so few children?

Here are a few problems with Germany:
* Very few childcare options.
* Ostracism against mothers who have a job (nicknamed "raven mothers") and against female employees who have babies. Hence why women prefer to not make babies since they do not want to be unemployed, despised, lonely and bored at home.
* Many men want no children at all and do not want to educate them.

I note that you only blame women, not men. And when women nevertheless decide to make a baby despite all those hardships, you still blame them. You would make a great German guy.

Meet France: a country where abortion is easy, where women work a lot, where contraceptives are widespread, where the fertility rate for natives is a rock-steady 1.9, and improving. The trick? Free and good education from pre-school to college, sometimes free childcare (improving), parental welfare, robust legal framework to protect female employees, maternity is positively looked at and the mother's choices are respected, whatever they may be.
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With all that going for you, why the hell do you allow all that human garbage from all over the world in and to destroy your beautiful country?

For lack of people or because you are suicidal?
 
legalimmigrant said:
Germany is not dying. Germany, like most of the white "progressive" countries, is killing itself with abortions.

This is just another outcome of the insanity of individual rights overriding the collective need to survive as a nation.

Another modern killer: single women playing mommies and daddies because "women can do what men can", and better.

So, instead of 3 kids, they have one, plus a dog or a cat, and, presto, a family.
Click to expand...
Tremendous insight into a foreign country, considering what ignorance one obviously suffers.
 
stevecanuck said:
Let's not forget about the man-child in-chief in Canada.
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He was also a rich TV star who was elected to the highest political office in the country. The media didn't have a problem with his resume however.
 
Chagos said:
Tremendous insight into a foreign country, considering what ignorance one obviously suffers.
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The breakdown of the traditional family is responsible for many if not most of the social ills we have in the West. Abortion is one very important part of this.
 
Auvergnat said:
Anyway identity and immigration will be core political themes of this century since migratory pressures will continue to increase, and immigration and globalization will further threaten social identities and cultures and therefore revive the fundamental need for identity.

The 20th century was about freedom, emancipation and individualization. Now that this project is mostly achieved the next one will be about fitting a social mesh and collective life within this modern framework. Ethnic homogeneity will inevitably become a part of the answer.

So Germany will eventually swing to those themes since it is an immigration country with a dying population. It will probably be slower in Germany because of the strong ostracism but it will happen. However it could happen through a mutation of existing parties, not necessarily through a new party.

Other *i*mmigration countries are more likely to swing before that: UK, France, Italy, Netherlands, Denmark, Austria, Greece, and probably some Eastern European countries. However in *e*migration countries such as Spain or Greece this swing may never happen.
Click to expand...

You're referring to the still prevalent stigma attached to Germany's behavior in the 30's and 40's?
 
legalimmigrant said:
With all that going for you, why the hell do you allow all that human garbage from all over the world in and to destroy your beautiful country?

For lack of people or because you are suicidal?
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Because we are suicidal after the ww2 and occupation trauma, and victims of our naive ideologies.

But our mental health may have started slowly improving during the recent years, and a new drug called ISIS has accelerated the recovery. I prefer to be cautious but we will see in the future how it really turns out.
 
truthatallcost said:
You're referring to the still prevalent stigma attached to Germany's behavior in the 30's and 40's?
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Yes. Actually the post-ww2 collective shame, nationalophobia and social repression exist everywhere in Europe, and they explain a lot of our current behavior (just like the white guilt in the USA). But they are a lot stronger in Germany.
 
truthatallcost said:
The breakdown of the traditional family is responsible for many if not most of the social ills we have in the West.
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Sez you.

Next.
Abortion is one very important part of this.
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with number of abortions decreasing in Germany, you don't have much of a point in that context.

Next.
 
Chagos said:
Sez you.

Next. with number of abortions decreasing in Germany, you don't have much of a point in that context.

Next.
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Says me too. How can anyone say that family is not important? I won't answer that. I think the answer is obvious.
 
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