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So, Erdogan is Issuing USA Ultimatums Now.

The chances of pushing Turkey into Russian arms to the point of those two forming some lasting alliance are zilch. This may not apply to trade aspects which have currently induced both to seek closer proximity (as before), as military powers, however, they are completely juxtaposed.

Both their economies are in a bind and largely due to Western withdrawal and sanctions (in Russia's case) and together they wouldn't be able to fill the gap that's left either.

On the power alliance side their interests and ambitions couldn't be more disparate. Take alone the issue of Assad. That's not even addressing Erdogan's open ambitions towards a Greater Turkey which would of necessity include vast former Soviet territories.

The two leaders are about as "natural" in alliance as Stalin and Hitler were.

As to Turkey going into Arab arms, forget it already. The Turks are hated by the Arabs and it doesn't matter whether the respective Arab regime is secular, dictatorial (or both) or theocratic. That hate is a centuries old tradition and not at all without reason.

When Arabs (in general) are not blaming their cultural decline on Western powers, they blame it (far more in fact) on the Turks, more so than even on the Mongols.
 
I bet he is just blowing smoke.

He is stomping his little feet to look good for the voters.

He probably had his people on the phone to the US government hours before he said that to tell them he did not mean it but he just has to make it look genuine.

Unless he is totally brain dead he must know that America could care less about his threats.
 
reinoe said:
He's messing with Obama and John Kerry. They're a couple of weak-willed chumps.
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Yeah, that's what all those droned assholes said before they were obliterated. I'm guessing that was bin Laden's position, too. The guy that George Bush couldn't get, Obama could.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Yes I know that means they join team China/Russia.
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I doubt it and were the only that simple, what a great advance it would be.

Erdogan is playing hard-ball. He has understood that though the Turks are Muslim, they do not want either that their country turns into another Iran or another Syria.

Neither do they see their future economically on the bad-side of the EU. It is, after all, a market of almost 510M individuals, larger than that of the US. Together, both make for a similar market-economy of 850M shoppers with considerable spending power. I doubt seriously that Turks would want to hamper trade with both such importantly large markets.

Neither do I think their kind of Muslim Religion is as virulent as elsewhere - after all, modern Turkey cut that particular umbilical chord when it put an end to the Ottoman Empire, which was itself not that radical about the Muslim religion. It tolerated largely other religions as long as those religions did not foment revolution against the Caliphate.

In other words, let's not confuse Turkey with the rest of what's going on in the Middle-east. Besides, what has been saved is, in fact, a functional democracy. Erdogan is not King or Sultan, and his party could be voted into secondary status at any election.

In fact, the failed coup simply cemented his power for another 3/4/5 years. Not all of Turkey is behind him, and I suggest that most Turks are first and foremost in love with the Democratic Principle that allows them to select their leaders ... after more than seven centuries of Turkey being a Sultanate.

It is not all said-and-done in Turkey. What has happened merely underscores Turkish preference for a democracy ...
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Red_Dave said:
Wouldnt this be up to the courts anyway?
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Eventually yes.

But it takes a great load of agreement on governmental level first. Only once that go-ahead is given can court proceedings commence. If the government says "nope", the courts don't get to see the issue at all.
 
reinoe said:
He's messing with Obama and John Kerry. They're a couple of weak-willed chumps.
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It takes one to know one ...

You're name calling.
______________________
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Turkey's Erdogan to US: Hand over exiled cleric Gulen - CNNPolitics.com

I have been saying for awhile that Turkey needs to get pushed out of NATO and told that they are not welcome in Europe. Yes I know that means they join team China/Russia. THese people simply cant be trusted, they have low value as a team member.

And lets get our nukes the hell out now, regardless.

Thoughts?
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My thoughts? Turkey and its president have completely gone bonkers:

Once a key ally of the U.S., Turkey has become a hotbed of anti-American rhetoric, with government-controlled media openly accusing the CIA and other Americans of taking part in a plan to assassinate President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. The accusations have dominated headlines in newspapers in the wake of the plot, and have included such improbable claims as the involvement of California death row prisoner Scott Peterson.

“I am stating this very clearly: The United States of America planned to directly murder Turkey’s president and implemented this plan,” said Ibrahim Karagul, editor-in-chief of a largely circulated pro-Erdogan newspaper, Yeni Safak.

Turkish media all in on anti-Americanism, says killer Scott Peterson involved in coup | Fox News
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LadyMoonlight said:
Um...that depends on who is President of the United States. He can walk all over Obama and Clinton and he knows it. I don't know if he can walk all over Trump.
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Excuse me!

That kind of truth telling earns a penalty round these parts.....
 
Lafayette said:
It takes one to know one ...

You're name calling.
______________________
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So what? I'll go him one better. President Limpwrist and Mr. Teresa Heinz are both lying commie bastards who resent the very nation whose interests they are supposed to be advancing. I will continue call any public official, provided he is not a poster on these forums, whatever names I think suit him.

As to Erdogan, he and every other Islamist cur can go straight to hell. The time has come for the U.S. to force Turkey out of NATO and withdraw all nuclear weapons from Turkish territory.
 
Grand Mal said:
Is there an extradition treaty between the US and Turkey? 'Cuz if the guy is tried and convicted in absentia the US might be obligated to send him home.
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The United States does not have to do anything to please any other nation, if it sees fit not to. America's interests always come first. We generally respect all treaties the Senate has ratified, because it is in our national interest to do that. But any treaty can be abrogated, if need be. And no President of the U.S. can ever let himself be dictated to by any foreign official--especially a treacherous Islamist mutt like Erdogan.
 
matchlight said:
President Limpwrist and Mr. Teresa Heinz are both lying commie bastards who resent the very nation whose interests they are supposed to be advancing..
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By such invective sarcasm you become the Prince of Scatology.

Which is sum-total of the benefits of your comments.

Go crap elsewhere ...
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Lafayette said:
By such invective sarcasm you become the Prince of Scatology.

Which is sum-total of the benefits of your comments.

Go crap elsewhere ...
__________________________
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It peeves you to see me call B. Hussein Obama out for the spineless Marxist liar he is. So, like many people who share your political views, you try to silence me. Won't work. Within the rules of these forums, I will continue to make whatever comments I please.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Turkey's Erdogan to US: Hand over exiled cleric Gulen - CNNPolitics.com

I have been saying for awhile that Turkey needs to get pushed out of NATO and told that they are not welcome in Europe. Yes I know that means they join team China/Russia. THese people simply cant be trusted, they have low value as a team member.

And lets get our nukes the hell out now, regardless.

Thoughts?
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F turkey but what the hell are 50 nukes doing on an air force base there? This is proof that we should pretty much never listen to the Generals. At the very least move them to Diego Garcia.
 
matchlight said:
~............... Within the rules of these forums, I will continue to make whatever comments I please.
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...............as will others upon your comments.

Seeing how you have established your postings to represent mainly personal opinion, it thus won't be surprising to you if those comments consist of dismissing said postings as being without substance worthy of consideration.
 
Chagos said:
...............as will others upon your comments.

Seeing how you have established your postings to represent mainly personal opinion, it thus won't be surprising to you if those comments consist of dismissing said postings as being without substance worthy of consideration.
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That is your uninformed opinion, and I will give it all the weight it deserves.
 
this is the weakness obama's foreign policy has created. this is the future of american diplomacy; submission to islamists.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Merkel seems willing to do as this guy demands (the comedian), so I see where Erdogan gets the idea that it might work again. For sure he does not respect either Europe nor USA. Putin has sure earned his respect though, which I think means Turkey is lost now no matter what we do. Not to mention, how can we support a country that runs as opposed to our values as this one?
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Not much in the way of choices. Think of another 1/2 million Syrians landing in Greece?? And Turkey is a strategic partner. Look at a map. Clear as the nose on your face.
 
Chagos said:
The chances of pushing Turkey into Russian arms to the point of those two forming some lasting alliance are zilch. This may not apply to trade aspects which have currently induced both to seek closer proximity (as before), as military powers, however, they are completely juxtaposed.

Both their economies are in a bind and largely due to Western withdrawal and sanctions (in Russia's case) and together they wouldn't be able to fill the gap that's left either.

On the power alliance side their interests and ambitions couldn't be more disparate. Take alone the issue of Assad. That's not even addressing Erdogan's open ambitions towards a Greater Turkey which would of necessity include vast former Soviet territories.

The two leaders are about as "natural" in alliance as Stalin and Hitler were.

As to Turkey going into Arab arms, forget it already. The Turks are hated by the Arabs and it doesn't matter whether the respective Arab regime is secular, dictatorial (or both) or theocratic. That hate is a centuries old tradition and not at all without reason.

When Arabs (in general) are not blaming their cultural decline on Western powers, they blame it (far more in fact) on the Turks, more so than even on the Mongols.
Click to expand...

But they can be uncooperative.
 
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