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Muslim peace conference condems terrorism

gunner

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"Thousands of Muslims are attending a peace conference in London which is condemning terrorism.
About 12,000 Muslims are understood to have gathered at Wembley Arena for Islamic group Minhaj-ul-Quran's Peace for Humanity Conference."

"Dr Tahir-ul-Qadri is the founder of Minhaj-ul-Quran and is the lead speaker at the event. The cleric told BBC Radio 5 live the conference would also commemorate the recent 10th anniversary of 9/11 and send a message that mankind should unite against extremism".

BBC News - Muslim peace conference condemns terrorism

This kind of event needs all the support and encouragement it can get. As we all know, the dominant narrative referencing Muslims always comes back to terrorism. It marks a step change to see that view countered by the Muslim Community, themselves.


Paul
 
Good for them.

I don't remember too many protests against Irish nationalist extremism during the Troubles in the Republic, but then again there wasn't an assumption that regular people tacitly supported terrorism if they didn't gather en masse to say they didn't. It's an interesting double standard.
 
Good for them.

I don't remember too many protests against Irish nationalist extremism during the Troubles in the Republic, but then again there wasn't an assumption that regular people tacitly supported terrorism if they didn't gather en masse to say they didn't. It's an interesting double standard.

I think the aim is to differentiate between Islamic teaching and looking too refute the misguided amongst the Muslim community. But in saying that Minhaj-ul-Quran, accept a portion is lost to the extreme elements. I'm not sure Irish republican priests had a duty to defend Catholicism, unless you're aware priests within the community preached in direct support of terrorism (by that i mean openly to their congregation)? I am aware of them turning a blind eye etc...

Paul
 
I think the aim is to differentiate between Islamic teaching and looking too refute the misguided amongst the Muslim community. But in saying that Minhaj-ul-Quran, accept a portion is lost to the extreme elements. I'm not sure Irish republican priests had a duty to defend Catholicism, unless you're aware priests within the community preached in direct support of terrorism (by that i mean openly to their congregation)? I am aware of them turning a blind eye etc...

Paul

Eh, we may be talking past eachother but I am hung-over (being Irish) and I may have explained myself poorly. I'm saying it's hypocritical for some to moan about the fact that ordinary members of a community don't protest against the actions of extremist members withing that community and not hold that standard for other communities. What's expected from the Muslims is far more than what was expected from the Irish.

And I don't want to derail the thread further (and since I was the one to draw the comparison initially this may seem like a climb-down of sorts), I don't believe the political aspirations of Islamic fundamentalism and Irish republicanism are comparable. The latter was not a religious conflict. Religion was a component amongst many other factors, but the desire was not to have a United Ireland ruled from the Vatican under Biblical Law, but from a secular government in Dublin. You won't have a Christian Jihadist, you could indeed have a Protestant nationalist. I think the West needs to learn from previous experiences with terrorism, but eschew notions that they all forms of terrorism are the same and can be dealt with in the same manner.
 
"Thousands of Muslims are attending a peace conference in London which is condemning terrorism.
About 12,000 Muslims are understood to have gathered at Wembley Arena for Islamic group Minhaj-ul-Quran's Peace for Humanity Conference."

"Dr Tahir-ul-Qadri is the founder of Minhaj-ul-Quran and is the lead speaker at the event. The cleric told BBC Radio 5 live the conference would also commemorate the recent 10th anniversary of 9/11 and send a message that mankind should unite against extremism".

BBC News - Muslim peace conference condemns terrorism

This kind of event needs all the support and encouragement it can get. As we all know, the dominant narrative referencing Muslims always comes back to terrorism. It marks a step change to see that view countered by the Muslim Community, themselves.



Paul

Hope this man has his life insurance premiums paid up. Peace advocates don't fare particularly well in the Muslim world. Still, if he's in London maybe he'll be OK.
 
Eh, we may be talking past eachother but I am hung-over (being Irish) and I may have explained myself poorly. I'm saying it's hypocritical for some to moan about the fact that ordinary members of a community don't protest against the actions of extremist members withing that community and not hold that standard for other communities. What's expected from the Muslims is far more than what was expected from the Irish.

I'm not disputing what you say. I simply feel their (a portion of the Muslim community) are showing support for 'mainstream' preachers, as opposed to the dominant narrative (Islamism) that gets the Lions share of media coverage. So in saying that, they are defining themselves in a moderate light. Hypothetically, perhaps if Ireland had had a particular portion of its priests spouting 'death to the British establishment' etc and those moderate Catholics felt aggrieved by this, they to would have protested their Religions misrepresentation, perhaps:)



And I don't want to derail the thread further (and since I was the one to draw the comparison initially this may seem like a climb-down of sorts), I don't believe the political aspirations of Islamic fundamentalism and Irish republicanism are comparable. The latter was not a religious conflict. Religion was a component amongst many other factors, but the desire was not to have a United Ireland ruled from the Vatican under Biblical Law, but from a secular government in Dublin. You won't have a Christian Jihadist, you could indeed have a Protestant nationalist. I think the West needs to learn from previous experiences with terrorism, but eschew notions that they all forms of terrorism are the same and can be dealt with in the same manner.

I agree a comparative analysis would be of very little benefit.

Paul
 
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I think its about time for the Muslim community to stop feeling guilty over the terrorist acts of an extremelly small percentage of Muslims.

No one ever holds Jews or Christians responsible for the acts of a few, so why Muslims?

The Tamil Tigers, a Hindu group...invented & perfected suicide bombings. Does anyone ever hold Hindus responsible for terrorism?

Nope.
 
That is only 0.0000076% of the entire number of Muslims on the planet so just like the Islamic terrorists it does not represent the majority of Muslims.
 
Hope this man has his life insurance premiums paid up. Peace advocates don't fare particularly well in the Muslim world. Still, if he's in London maybe he'll be OK.

He has reportedly received death threats. All the reason to wholeheartedly support their incentive. If you view the notifications of support for the event on the website it shows some prominent politicians.

Paul
 
Any Muslim who receives death-threats from Muslim extremists, is usually an intelligent, logical, and rational person. I give him a thumbs up. :)
 
Muslims and their religion suffer from a disastrous image for which the media is greatly responsible. A decade of media scrutiny of their more extreme elements has left a lot of people with the impression that violence and hate are the norm in Islam. Muslims have been speaking out against terrorism for years, but their words somehow never end up on the front page. No one ever expected all Basques, Irish or Sri Lankans to apologize for the terrorists among them and to repeatedly condemn their actions ad-nauseam, yet many people expect average Muslims to do just that. It's an odd state of affairs. Anyhoo, good on these guys for organizing this event.
 
I'm just waiting for the bigots:

"Why were there only 12,000 attendees?!"

"Why aren't there more of these happening around the world?!"

"Why did it take so long for something like this to happen?!"

"They're allowed to lie to the infadel, so this means nothing!"

"Too little too late!"
 
I'm just waiting for the bigots:

"Why were there only 12,000 attendees?!"

"Why aren't there more of these happening around the world?!"

"Why did it take so long for something like this to happen?!"

"They're allowed to lie to the infadel, so this means nothing!"

"Too little too late!"

you forgot "I learned everything I need to know about Islam, on 9-11".
 
I'm not disputing what you say. I simply feel their (a portion of the Muslim community) are showing support for 'mainstream' preachers, as opposed to the dominant narrative (Islamism) that gets the Lions share of media coverage. So in saying that, they are defining themselves in a moderate light. Hypothetically, perhaps if Ireland had had a particular portion of its priests spouting 'death to the British establishment' etc and those moderate Catholics felt aggrieved by this, they to would have protested their Religions misrepresentation, perhaps:)
...
Of course this is a Grotesque Misrepresentation and the Opposite of the Truth.
The string, an effort to do what he says neither he nor anyone else does here.
Is he supporting terrorism? No, but he's pretending/Foisting 'Mainstream' Islam is something it's Not.
This is Constant even perennial and either intentional or self-delusion.

re a similar effort last year by the same Cleric:
Muslim leader's edict decries terrorism - Washington Times
"...It was not clear how much influence the fatwa will have in the broad Muslim world or even outside the South Asian community whose members are Mr. Tahir-ul-Qadri’s most dedicated followers.

Timothy R. Furnish, a historian of Islam, said the fatwa may Not carry significant weight for many Muslims because Mr. Tahir-ul-Qadri is a Sufi Muslim, and not a Koranic literalist, as are such Sunni groups as the Wahhabis and the Salafis, who form the core of groups such as al Qaeda."..."
So what we have is a Pakistani Sufi Cleric and his most dedicated followers. NOT "Mainstream" Islam or Islam as represent by Fairer Polls or Random Mosque visits which expose far more representative views.

How representative ARE Sufis?
"Mainstream"?
We found out when alexa tried the same:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/54964-wanted-muslim-reformation-19.html

Yes, this PC and worse Tomfoolery is regularly attempted here. This deception, self and otherwise, IS "mainstream", at least among UK/EU posters.

CJ 2.0 posted a Pew poll of the Muslim world the other day showing perhaps 80% of Muslims don't belive Arabs carried out 9/11.
"Terrorism, what Terrorism?"
 
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I'm just waiting for the bigots:

"Why were there only 12,000 attendees?!"

"Why aren't there more of these happening around the world?!"

"Why did it take so long for something like this to happen?!"

"They're allowed to lie to the infadel, so this means nothing!"

"Too little too late!"

No need to wait TED, you are already here. Afterall you are bigoted towards anyone who dosn't agree with you.
 
Of course this is a Grotesque Misrepresentation and the Opposite of the Truth.
The string, an effort to do what he says neither he nor anyone else does here.
Is he supporting terrorism? No, but he's pretending/Foisting 'Mainstream' Islam is something it's Not.
This is Constant even perennial and either intentional or self-delusion
.

Nothing quite so complicated. 'HE' simply started a thread highlighting their was a conference, where around 12000 Muslims decided to stand up and challenge the dominant narrative surrounding their faith.

re a similar effort last year by the same Cleric:
Muslim leader's edict decries terrorism - Washington Times
So what we have is a Pakistani Sufi Cleric and his most dedicated followers. NOT "Mainstream" Islam or Islam as represent by Fairer Polls or Random Mosque visits which expose far more representative views.

Unbelievable. So he does not adhere to a particular strand of Islam, the dominant strand amongst extremist elements, and that's a problem? Do you not see the stupidity of that argument?

Paul
 
Nothing quite so complicated. 'HE' simply started a thread highlighting their was a conference, where around 12000 Muslims decided to stand up and challenge the dominant narrative surrounding their faith.



Unbelievable. So he does not adhere to a particular strand of Islam, the dominant strand amongst extremist elements, and that's a problem? Do you not see the stupidity of that argument?

Paul

a degree of simplicity is always required to keep stereotypes together. Regarding the UK, Islam is an evolving religion. Even Salafi is an evolving and changing.

This article gives a description of the journey that British Salafi's took up to 2008

"The popularity of Salafism in the UK is
attributable to the convergence of the
globalization of Salafi discourse, the search for
religious identity among second generation
British Muslims seeking “pure” religion, and
the competition for recruits between rival
Islamic currents. British Salafism has become
diversified to such an extent that it is no longer
recognizable as a single movement, with the
development taking unexpected turns that
belie popular monolithic representations."


-snip-

Another major factor in the evolution of Salafism in the UK has been the increasing appeal of “traditional Islam,” an activist and scholarly form of Sufism, which was initially popularized by charismatic American convert scholar Hamza Yusuf.6 He seemed to mesmerize audiences with the depth of his knowledge of Islam and apparent polymathic command of subjects as diverse as music, literature, and science. Prominent moderate Salafis at the time, though privately in awe of his learning, publicly dismissed him as Sufi. The traditional Islam trend in effect appropriated some of the authority from the Salafi scholars, resulting in a reduction of some of the aura of knowledgeability from British Salafis and offering a broader, richer understanding of Islam that emphasized the spiritual dimensions of religion. The impact of Hamza Yusuf’s message was reinforced and echoed by two other prominent convert scholars, the English Abdal Hakim Murad (b. 1960), a Cambridge professor of Islamic Studies, and the American Shaykh Nuh Keller (b.1954) who is based in Jordan. The three figures spearheaded a strategy of discrediting the politicized readings of Islam found in the literature of the reformist Islamists and deconstructing the claims to textual orthodoxy of the Salafi groupings. Especially Abdal Hakim Murad has been prolific in this regard; his writings consititute one of the most popular resources for “traditional Islam.”7

The influence of Salafi trends on British Muslim communities has been larger than its numerical presence among communities; their influence is disproportional as a result of the effectiveness of their literature distribution and web presence. Today, people that subscribe to Salafi perspectives can broadly be described as either those that gravitate to the outlook of the “Super Salafis,” or feel more comfortable with the JIMAS approach; those whose religious praxis is what could be described as a “methodological Salafism”—a literalist reading of scripture but which is not aligned with any particular group or institution; or those who might be described as “post-Salafi.” Leading British Salafis such as Abu Aliyah, Abu Muntasir, and Usama Hasan are not obsessed with defining themselves as Salafi. More complex hybridized identities are emerging where, for example, Usama Hasan goes as far as to refer to himself as a Wahhabbi–Sufi! In an interview with the author, he argued that some of the categories used by analysts miss the complex, evolving nature of contemporary British Salafi trends. Leading Salafi activists are now trying to bridge the sectarian divides once thought impossible. In the aftermath of the Iraq invasion and resulting intra-Muslim violence, there have been high profile attempts to reconcile opposing theological trends, through initiatives such as the Amman Message8 and the Sunni Pledge,9 a pledge of mutual respect and cooperation between Sunni Muslim scholars and organizations. These developments challenge the nuance-lacking representations of Salafism in recent times as well as indicate the dynamic and organic nature of religious identity formation.

IslamiCity Forum - Islamic Discussion Forum: The Development of British Salafism
 
Tariq Jahan is to attend the conference. For those who do not know he touched the Nation when his son along with 2 other young Muslim men were killed during the recent English riots and looting

He said “I am delighted to have been invited and can immediately confirm that I will attend this vital conference which promotes true image of Islam and promotes peace, tolerance and rejects extremism.” He also revealed that he is aware of the caliber of Shaykh Dr Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri from the early days when he used to defeat Omar Bakri on debates about Islam and concept of Khilafah to ensure that youngsters are not misguided.

Tariq Jahan to attend Peace for Humanity Conference
 
.

Nothing quite so complicated. 'HE' simply started a thread highlighting their was a conference, where around 12000 Muslims decided to stand up and challenge the dominant narrative surrounding their faith.
'He' is You who started a string without knowing or contextualizing.

you Further, Through Delighted/willfull lack of knowledge presented it as Representative of Mainstream, when in fact they're the Fringe.
But as I pointed out, Sufis are Hardly Mainstream, they're a Tiny Mystical sect.
To present this [stealth] as just some general Popular Muslim demo is Dishonest.


Gunner said:
Unbelievable. So he does not adhere to a particular strand of Islam, the dominant strand amongst extremist elements, and that's a problem? Do you not see the stupidity of that argument?

Paul
"Stupidity"? (oh the Irony!)
Stupidity is presenting this 1% Small Pakistani Sufi group as Mainstream, or generally representative.
Or in the case of many here, outright Dishonesty because as I pointed out, this has already been Debunked for the Disinfo it is.

The rest of my post which was DISHONESTLY Truncated in service of Lies.
the rest of my post linking to previous debunking of this deception attempt said:
[.......]

How representative ARE Sufis?
"Mainstream"?
We found out when alexa tried the same:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/54964-wanted-muslim-reformation-19.html

Yes, this PC and worse Tomfoolery is regularly attempted here. This deception, self and otherwise, IS "mainstream", at least among UK/EU posters.

CJ 2.0 posted a Pew poll of the Muslim world the other day showing perhaps 80% of Muslims don't belive Arabs carried out 9/11.
"Terrorism, what Terrorism?"
 
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'He' is You who started a string without knowing or contextualizing.

you Further, Through Delighted/willfull lack of knowledge presented it as Representative of "Mainstream".
But as I pointed out, Sufis are Hardly Mainstream, they're a Tiny Mystical sect.
To present this [stealth] as just some general Popular Muslim demo is Dishonest.


"Stupidity"? (oh the Irony!)
Stupidity is presenting 1% Sufis as "Mainstream".
Or in the case of many here, outright Dishonesty because as I pointed out, this has already been Debunked for the Dishonesty it is.

The rest of my post which was DISHONESTLY Truncated in service of Lies.

Can you please provide the link stating all those attending the conference are from the 'Sufi' sect???? believe me you wont be able. You know why because the conference was open to all 'MUSLIMS'....Have a look at who Alexa linked too. Tariq Jahan was instrumental in his ability control many Muslims (from different strains) during the riots. By his humbling actions he averted much racial tension....but of course that cant be possible, can it?

Paul
 
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