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Thread: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

  1. #51
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim the plumber View Post
    Given that you can get a very very accurate map of the top of the ice and the land beneath it with a fly over by a radar equiped plane which would be accurate to the mm why would you use a satelite that cannot differentiate between vertical land moves, storms or anyother mass balance altering effect?
    There are details in the link.
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Antarctic Avery Ice Shelf “Prograding Considerably In Last 2 Decades”, Team Of Scientists Find

    By P Gosselin on 6. May 2020
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    A newly released paper by Kumar et al looks at the changes and prediction of the Amery Ice Shelf (AIS) of East Antarctica using remote sensing data.
    The scientists found that the ice shelf is prograding (expanding), and not breaking apart like some alarmist scientists feared earlier.

    Image: cropped from Wikipedia.
    Hat-tip: Mary Brown
    Wikipedia tells that in December 2006, “enormous cracks” had been forming for over a decade at a rate of three to five metres a day – possibly due to global warming – but researchers later said it was too early to attribute the phenomenon to global warming because of the “possibility of a natural 50-60 year cycle being responsible”.
    Now the recent paper by Kumar et al reports findings that the Amery Ice Shelf (AIS) is not disintegrating, let alone shrinking, but rather is advancing! . . .
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  3. #53
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    There are details in the link.
    Does it explain why they wanted a multi billion dollar satellite budget rather than fly a few times over the ice?

  4. #54
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim the plumber View Post
    Does it explain why they wanted a multi billion dollar satellite budget rather than fly a few times over the ice?
    Yes. It does.
    "Above all, not too much zeal." --Prince Talleyrand

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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Yes. It does.

    If it does I can't see where.

    Try to explain why they chose this method of measurement.

  6. #56
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim the plumber View Post

    If it does I can't see where.

    Try to explain why they chose this method of measurement.
    This explained it to my satisfaction.

    ". . . “If you watch a glacier or ice sheet for a month, or a year, you’re not going to learn much about what the climate is doing to it,” said lead author Benjamin Smith, a glaciologist at the University of Washington. “We now have a 16-year span between ICESat and ICESat-2 and can be much more confident that the changes we’re seeing in the ice have to do with the long-term changes in the climate. And ICESat-2 is a really remarkable tool for making these measurements. We’re seeing high-quality measurements that carpet both ice sheets, which let us make a detailed and precise comparison with the ICESat data.”

    Previous studies of ice loss or gain often analyze data from multiple satellites and airborne missions. The new study takes a single type of measurement – height as measured by an instrument that bounces laser pulses off the ice surface – providing the most detailed and accurate picture of ice sheet change to date.

    The researchers took tracks of ICESat measurements and overlaid the denser tracks of ICESat-2 measurements from 2019. Where the two data sets intersected – tens of millions of sites – they ran the data through computer programs that accounted for the snow density and other factors, and then calculated the mass of ice lost or gained. . . . "
    "Above all, not too much zeal." --Prince Talleyrand

  7. #57
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    Re: NASA says Antarctica and Greenland lost enough ice to fill Lake Michigan over last 16 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    This explained it to my satisfaction.

    ". . . “If you watch a glacier or ice sheet for a month, or a year, you’re not going to learn much about what the climate is doing to it,” said lead author Benjamin Smith, a glaciologist at the University of Washington. “We now have a 16-year span between ICESat and ICESat-2 and can be much more confident that the changes we’re seeing in the ice have to do with the long-term changes in the climate. And ICESat-2 is a really remarkable tool for making these measurements. We’re seeing high-quality measurements that carpet both ice sheets, which let us make a detailed and precise comparison with the ICESat data.”

    Previous studies of ice loss or gain often analyze data from multiple satellites and airborne missions. The new study takes a single type of measurement – height as measured by an instrument that bounces laser pulses off the ice surface – providing the most detailed and accurate picture of ice sheet change to date.

    The researchers took tracks of ICESat measurements and overlaid the denser tracks of ICESat-2 measurements from 2019. Where the two data sets intersected – tens of millions of sites – they ran the data through computer programs that accounted for the snow density and other factors, and then calculated the mass of ice lost or gained. . . . "
    Ummmm, given that very very detailed maps of ice thickness from teh 1960s I don't see why you would ever want to change the process. It was far more precise than anybody would require then. Billions of dollars later we get this somewhat surprising result.

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