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Thread: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

  1. #81
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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    We have long known that Earth without an atmosphere would be much colder.
    This was stated by Fourier as early as the 1820's.
    1896, Arrhenius's mentions that Earths temperature was +15°C, the upper end
    -18 °C, +15°C, range of the 33°C warmer than earth would be without an atmosphere.
    https://www.rsc.org/images/Arrhenius...m18-173546.pdf
    In order to get an idea of how strongly of the Earth (or any other body
    of the temperature +15°C.)
    A century later in 1998, NASA again confirms the same findings,
    NASA GISS: Science Briefs: Greenhouse Gases: Refining the Role of Carbon Dioxide
    Without naturally occurring greenhouse gases, Earth's average temperature would be near 0°F (or -18°C) instead of the much warmer 59°F (15°C).
    NOTE: both have the Earth at +15°C!
    In 2019, the NASA Cosmos page updated Monday, November 18, 2019, 12:32:48 PM,
    says,
    NASA's Cosmos
    Right now, the warming influence is literally a matter of life and death. It keeps the average surface temperature of the planet at 288 degrees kelvin (15 degrees Celsius or 59 degrees Fahrenheit). Without this greenhouse effect, the average surface temperature would be 255 degrees kelvin (-18 degrees Celsius or 0 degrees Fahrenheit); a temperature so low that all water on Earth would freeze, the oceans would turn into ice and life, as we know it, would not exist.
    It we are truly seeing global warming, should not the calculation of Earth's temperature with and without an atmosphere have changed?

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    I used to subscribe to Scientific American. Some time in the '90s they hired on a new editorial
    staff and it became a left-wing liberal rag. Same is true for National Geographic.

    Sea level is rising. The water has to be coming from somewhere, and it's a good bet
    that Greenland, Antarctica and the alpine glaciers around the world are the source.

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Case View Post
    I used to subscribe to Scientific American. Some time in the '90s they hired on a new editorial
    staff and it became a left-wing liberal rag. Same is true for National Geographic.
    Facts have a liberal bias. Lol

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Climate Extremism in the Age of Disinformation

    November 18th, 2019Do the global warming wars ever change anyone’s mind?
    I suppose there are a few people whose minds have been changed. As I recall, Judith Curry has said Climategate (now “celebrating” its 10 year anniversary) was her wake-up call that institutionalized climate science might not be all it claims to be. She is now a well-informed and unabashed skeptic of the modern tendency to blame every bad weather event on humans.

    While I’m sure there are other examples, the unfortunate truth is that fewer and fewer people actually care about the truth.
    The journalist who broke the Climategate story, James Delingpole, yesterday posted an article entitled The Bastards Have Got Away with It!, James concludes with,
    “Climategate was the event when, just for a moment, it seemed we’d got the climate scamsters bang to rights, that the world’s biggest scientific (and economic) con trick had been exposed and that the Climate Industrial Complex would be dismantled before it could do any more damage to our freedom and our prosperity. But the truth, it would seem, is no match for big money, dirty politics and madness-of-crowds groupthink. We’ve lost this one, I think, my friends. And the fact that all those involved in this scam will one day burn in Hell is something, I’m afraid, which gives me all too little consolation.”
    You see, it does not really matter whether a few bad actors (even if they are leaders of the climate movement) conspired to hide data and methods, and strong-arm scientific journal editors into not publishing papers that might stand in the way of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) mission to pin climate change on humans, inflate its seriousness, and lay the groundwork for worldwide governmental efforts to reduce humanity’s access to affordable energy.

    The folks were simply trying to Save the Earth™, and we all know that the ends justifies the means, right? So what if they cheated? Boys will be boys, you know. The science is sound, and besides, 97% of all scientists agree that… something. . . .
    "Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one." --Marcus Aurelius

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    The author of the OP article is a woman, so "his" cronies don't exist. Just another instance where you are tripped up by the facts.

    As for defeats, I don't recall any of your posts.

    The truth is my ally.
    Of course you don't recall my posts, why would you? Your denial of reality is so deep that you dismiss anyone or anything that challenges your view of reality. And you call yourself scientific.

    Your lack of objectivity is really unfortunate, but it is what it is. I don't mind that you hold an anti-scientific view, just that you try to dress it up like you're some kind of professional work when you're not. You're part and parcel with the anti-intellectual movement that's going through the USA right now, and it's an insult to real scientists who have dedicate their lives to studying these matters in detail.

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Light View Post
    Of course you don't recall my posts, why would you? Your denial of reality is so deep that you dismiss anyone or anything that challenges your view of reality. And you call yourself scientific.

    Your lack of objectivity is really unfortunate, but it is what it is. I don't mind that you hold an anti-scientific view, just that you try to dress it up like you're some kind of professional work when you're not. You're part and parcel with the anti-intellectual movement that's going through the USA right now, and it's an insult to real scientists who have dedicate their lives to studying these matters in detail.
    What is your reality that you think Jack is denying?

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by vegas giants View Post
    Facts have a liberal bias. Lol
    You'd certainly think so from reading this! At what point did true Conservatism come to mean an unwavering belief in crazy conspiracy theories?

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by Surface Detail View Post
    You'd certainly think so from reading this! At what point did true Conservatism come to mean an unwavering belief in crazy conspiracy theories?
    Which portions of the data are crazy conspiracy theories?
    That the Earth is 33C warmer than it would be without an atmosphere?

    Perhaps it is that the mean free path of a 15 um photon at the partial pressure of 400 ppm of CO2 is only a few cm,
    and that nearly 100% of the 15 um photons would be absorbed, within 100 meters, even if CO2 was at 100 ppm?
    Reference: 400ppm of CO2, is like a CO2 only vacuum chamber at .4 mbar (.3 Torr).

    Maybe it is the idea that modeled projections of future warming, are themselves not facts?

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by longview View Post
    Which portions of the data are crazy conspiracy theories?
    That the Earth is 33C warmer than it would be without an atmosphere?

    Perhaps it is that the mean free path of a 15 um photon at the partial pressure of 400 ppm of CO2 is only a few cm,
    and that nearly 100% of the 15 um photons would be absorbed, within 100 meters, even if CO2 was at 100 ppm?
    Reference: 400ppm of CO2, is like a CO2 only vacuum chamber at .4 mbar (.3 Torr).

    Maybe it is the idea that modeled projections of future warming, are themselves not facts?
    The conspiracy theory isn't your Mickey Mouse maths; it's the apparently genuinely held belief that the editorial staff of every printed science publication (Scientific American, National Geographic, etc.) and the executives of every national and international scientific body have been taken over by left-wing activists intent on inventing or exaggerating the effects of AGW.

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    Re: The Legacy of Climategate -- Ten Years Later

    Quote Originally Posted by Surface Detail View Post
    The conspiracy theory isn't your Mickey Mouse maths; it's the apparently genuinely held belief that the editorial staff of every printed science publication (Scientific American, National Geographic, etc.) and the executives of every national and international scientific body have been taken over by left-wing activists intent on inventing or exaggerating the effects of AGW.
    So, enlighten us with some of these facts, that are beyond reproach?

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