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Global Cooling Is Under Way

Jack Hays said:
As I said, you are free to use the terminology you prefer, as am I.
And no, a complaint about usage is not a semantic argument.
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Except you are drawing conclusions from that terminology.
 
Jack Hays said:
One thing is more important than the other. Yes, I draw conclusions from that, regardless of the terminology.
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You were drawing the conclusion that human activity is not important to climate change. You blame the sun. Both can be greatly impacting the environment, though. That's your fault.
 
FreeWits said:
You were drawing the conclusion that human activity is not important to climate change. You blame the sun. Both can be greatly impacting the environment, though. That's your fault.
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The Sun (and GCR flux) is indeed more important. I think it is sufficiently more important to overwhelm human influence.
 
Jack Hays said:
The Sun (and GCR flux) is indeed more important. I think it is sufficiently more important to overwhelm human influence.
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See, it does not need to be thought of in this way. The Sun's influence can be the most important, even overwhelming human influence, but human influence can still have a big impact. You are looking at this from the POV that only one thing can be the reason that matters. That's simply false.
 
FreeWits said:
See, it does not need to be thought of in this way. The Sun's influence can be the most important, even overwhelming human influence, but human influence can still have a big impact. You are looking at this from the POV that only one thing can be the reason that matters. That's simply false.
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No. I'm looking at it from the point of view that one factor is important and one is less so. This thread expresses my view that warming will be stopped dead in its tracks and ultimately reversed, regardless of human activity.
 
Jack Hays said:
No. I'm looking at it from the point of view that one factor is important and one is less so. This thread expresses my view that warming will be stopped dead in its tracks and ultimately reversed, regardless of human activity.
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I know that is the conclusion you are drawing from faulty logic. One does not follow the other. It does not follow that because the Sun is the most important in regards to global warming that human activity couldn't also be so important that it causes global warming to increase in a way that destroys humanity. This is the point I've been trying to get across to you, but you are so concentrated on trying to slither out of the obvious, you don't see what's right in front of you.
 
Jack Hays said:
No. "Denier" is a stupid word designed to poison discussion. I do not believe human activity is the primary climate influence; nor does Svensmark. That is not denial of any kind.
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Denier is an accurate term for you and your denier sources.
 
FreeWits said:
I know that is the conclusion you are drawing from faulty logic. One does not follow the other. It does not follow that because the Sun is the most important in regards to global warming that human activity couldn't also be so important that it causes global warming to increase in a way that destroys humanity. This is the point I've been trying to get across to you, but you are so concentrated on trying to slither out of the obvious, you don't see what's right in front of you.
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The difference between solar/GCR flux influence and human influence is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug. A persistent theme in the history of science is to learn, and relearn, the modest place of humans in the grand scheme of things.
 
[FONT=&quot]Solar[/FONT]
[h=1]Weak sun and El Nino events may create a colder and snowier than normal winter season in much of the eastern half of the USA[/h][FONT=&quot]The fast approaching solar minimum and its potential impact on the upcoming winter season By Meteorologist Paul Dorian Overview In the long term, the sun is the main driver of all weather and climate and multi-decadal trends in solar activity can have major impacts on oceanic and atmospheric temperatures. In addition, empirical observations have shown…
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UAH October:


UAH_LT_1979_thru_October_2018_v6-550x317.jpg
 
[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[h=1]The Millennial Turning Point – Solar Activity and the Coming Cooling[/h][FONT=&quot]Guest opinion by Dr. Norman Page When analyzing complex systems with multiple interacting variables it is useful to note the advice of Enrico Fermi who reportedly said “never make something more accurate than absolutely necessary”. My recent paper presented a simple heuristic approach to climate science which plausibly proposed that a Millennial Turning Point (MTP)…
Continue reading →
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The question, though, is whether global cooling is worse than global warming, and which of the two should we be more concerned about? With everything that is going on with the climate these days, and everything the news outlets reports everyday, I sometimes can't help but wonder if some of these people are just pulling my leg and making me think the world is ending or something.
 
jparkshere said:
The question, though, is whether global cooling is worse than global warming, and which of the two should we be more concerned about? With everything that is going on with the climate these days, and everything the news outlets reports everyday, I sometimes can't help but wonder if some of these people are just pulling my leg and making me think the world is ending or something.
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Not much to do about it either way.
 
Jack Hays said:
[FONT="][URL="https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/10/22/weak-sun-and-el-nino-events-may-create-a-colder-and-snowier-than-normal-winter-season-in-much-of-the-eastern-half-of-the-usa/"]
SDO_1024_HMIIC-10-22-18-220x126.jpg
[/URL]Solar[/FONT]
[h=1]Weak sun and El Nino events may create a colder and snowier than normal winter season in much of the eastern half of the USA[/h][FONT="]The fast approaching solar minimum and its potential impact on the upcoming winter season By Meteorologist Paul Dorian Overview In the long term, the sun is the main driver of all weather and climate and multi-decadal trends in solar activity can have major impacts on oceanic and atmospheric temperatures. In addition, empirical observations have shown…
[/FONT]
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This does seem to be the pattern, at least for a strong El Nino. The typical pattern for the Pacific Northwest, however, is warmer and drier weather. California gets our rain, and their soil is not used to it...so they get floods and washouts. It is during El Nino years that Donner pass tends to get more snow though. That's good news for northern California (except for travelers over that pass).

As always, we can speculate all we want. Time will tell if we are right or not.
 
jparkshere said:
The question, though, is whether global cooling is worse than global warming, and which of the two should we be more concerned about? With everything that is going on with the climate these days, and everything the news outlets reports everyday, I sometimes can't help but wonder if some of these people are just pulling my leg and making me think the world is ending or something.
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The Church of Global Warming has always predicted doom and gloom. They must. It's the only thing that keeps the religion going. If they predicted that the 'globe is warming' (not a definable phrase), and then predicted the consequences would be beneficial, they couldn't justify all the money they want to spend or the power grab they want to achieve.

The Church of Global Warming stems from the Church of Karl Marx. That is the parent religion.
 
  • Salvatore del Prete | November 13, 2018 at 12:34 pm | Reply
    The climate is now in at the crossroads.
    For my money I think it is the geo/solar magnetic field strengths and if they weaken enough and stay weak I think the result will be a major climatic impact to colder conditions.
    Signs I am watching for are:
    OVERALL SEA SURFACE TEMPERATURES
    500 MB ATMOSPHERIC CIRCULATION PATTERNS /HEIGHTS
    OVERALL GEOLOGICAL ACTIVITY
    OVERALL SNOW/CLOUD COVERAGE
    Time will tell but the potential is as higher now then any other time since the Dalton Solar Minimum ended which was in 1850.

 
Jack Hays said:
  • Salvatore del Prete [FONT=&]| November 13, 2018 at 12:34 pm | Reply
    The climate is now in at the crossroads.
    For my money I think it is the geo/solar magnetic field strengths and if they weaken enough and stay weak I think the result will be a major climatic impact to colder conditions.
    Signs I am watching for are:
    OVERALL SEA SURFACE TEMPERATURES
    500 MB ATMOSPHERIC CIRCULATION PATTERNS /HEIGHTS
    OVERALL GEOLOGICAL ACTIVITY
    OVERALL SNOW/CLOUD COVERAGE
    Time will tell but the potential is as higher now then any other time since the Dalton Solar Minimum ended which was in 1850.

    [/FONT]
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Greetings, Jack. :2wave:

I won't be surprised to see colder conditions - I already have over a period of 25 years of personal record keeping - a small thing, but it is proof I can see with my own eyes! The interesting side of all the different stories we're seeing lately though, from different countries around the world, seems to be that coal is no longer a bad word to anyone except those who link climate policy to environmental policy. People are going to insist on being warm in their homes, and China and India - and Australia who is the latest to use as an example - have been very aggressive in building new coal-fired plants non-stop. Time will tell what happens next..... :thumbs:
 
polgara said:
Greetings, Jack. :2wave:

I won't be surprised to see colder conditions - I already have over a period of 25 years of personal record keeping - a small thing, but it is proof I can see with my own eyes! The interesting side of all the different stories we're seeing lately though, from different countries around the world, seems to be that coal is no longer a bad word to anyone except those who link climate policy to environmental policy. People are going to insist on being warm in their homes, and China and India - and Australia who is the latest to use as an example - have been very aggressive in building new coal-fired plants non-stop. Time will tell what happens next..... :thumbs:
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Greetings, Polgara.:2wave:

Continued cooling will upset some apple carts.:mrgreen:
 
Jack Hays said:
Greetings, Polgara.:2wave:

Continued cooling will upset some apple carts.:mrgreen:
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We may be cooling, but I hope you are wrong.
For all the doom and gloom the alarmist hype about warming, cooling would be far worse.
For the most part, a warmer world, is a better world, a colder world, not so much.
 
Nunavut is a vast, sparsely populated region of northern Canada. I just read an article that claimed these indigenous people in the area are complaining the population of polar bears is so vast and has become a threat because of the growing number of bears attacking and killing the people. Gosh guess all those polar bears didn't drown after all. :) Someone phone Al Gore.
 
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