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American Meteorological Society: Some Extreme Weather Events in 2016 Only Possible Due to Humans

There is plenty of room in other states for those entire populations to move to. Ex Oklahoma, Kansas

Except for the fact that the people who already own the land in the other states will be outraged at having to give up their lands for climate refugees. Remember, great and relatively sudden influxes of masses of people into any one area will result in unrest in that area - always has, always will. Syria's a great example - one of the main factors (if not THE main factor) in their civil war was the influx of refugees from Iraq, and of farmers who could no longer get enough water to irrigate their farms (thanks to climate change, btw).
 
In other words, you want a big socialist government making it too expensive to own a house or use an automobile. Live in an apartment bloc, use the socialist train, if you have a car pay 2 euros per liter for fuel.

In other words you think micromanaging people’s choices though the state and not the market is how to go.

1. It's expensive to own a house in London or Paris not because of "socialism", but because of market forces in a prosperous urban area. We've got the same doggone thing going on in Seattle, SF, NYC, LA...you name it.

2. Trains are "socialist" now? Dude. You're from near Seattle, so you can verify precisely what I'm about to tell you. I can walk out my door down to the Bainbridge Island ferry (five minute walk, tops), then walk up to the 3rd Ave. train station and take the light rail all the way to SeaTac airport...and do it all for less money than it costs to take a car on the ferry, much less to pay for parking! And almost every day at the Bainbridge Island ferry, you can see people who are on their way to and from SeaTac with their wheeled carry-on luggage. But to listen to you, that's SOCIALIST!!!!!!

Good grief!

Oh, and one more thing - it's becoming pretty apparent that electric cars will be soon be much more economical than gas-powered cars - even Forbes' points out that they're cheaper to operate and own! But I guess in your world, saving money while being ecologically sensible is, well, SOCIALIST!!!!!
 
1. It's expensive to own a house in London or Paris not because of "socialism", but because of market forces in a prosperous urban area. We've got the same doggone thing going on in Seattle, SF, NYC, LA...you name it.

2. Trains are "socialist" now? Dude. You're from near Seattle, so you can verify precisely what I'm about to tell you. I can walk out my door down to the Bainbridge Island ferry (five minute walk, tops), then walk up to the 3rd Ave. train station and take the light rail all the way to SeaTac airport...and do it all for less money than it costs to take a car on the ferry, much less to pay for parking! And almost every day at the Bainbridge Island ferry, you can see people who are on their way to and from SeaTac with their wheeled carry-on luggage. But to listen to you, that's SOCIALIST!!!!!!

Good grief!

Oh, and one more thing - it's becoming pretty apparent that electric cars will be soon be much more economical than gas-powered cars - even Forbes' points out that they're cheaper to operate and own! But I guess in your world, saving money while being ecologically sensible is, well, SOCIALIST!!!!!

Well for many decades the Ferries were run by a private company called Puget Sound Navigation, then the state took it over after regulating them out of business and immediately exempted themselves from the regulations.
When PSN ran the Ferries they were cheaper, ran more frequently, and had better service
Sound Transit is an absolute socialist scam, glad you can use it without the 250 dollar illegally counted car tabs because you live outside the RTA. Link rail is also over budget and has never come close to ridership projections

Housing is expensive because of socialist central planning called “zoning”
And the over 100,000 dollars of inspections that are completely unnecessary
 
Well for many decades the Ferries were run by a private company called Puget Sound Navigation, then the state took it over after regulating them out of business and immediately exempted themselves from the regulations.
When PSN ran the Ferries they were cheaper, ran more frequently, and had better service
Sound Transit is an absolute socialist scam, glad you can use it without the 250 dollar illegally counted car tabs because you live outside the RTA.

Housing is expensive because of socialist central planning called “zoning”
And the over 100,000 dollars of inspections that are completely unnecessary

Well you can't have a growing bureaucracy without growing taxation to support it. If you have codes, then you need a code compliance inspector (with a special vehicle and staff, of course). If you have compliance violations then you need a police officer (with a special vehicle and staff, of course) to enforce code compliance. If you have police then you need a court (with a special building and staff, of course) to settle disputes and levy fines for code compliance violators. If you have all of those public employees then they need a union to ensure that they get overpaid, underworked, have back-up for any and all critical positions and have great fringe benefits.
 
Except for the fact that the people who already own the land in the other states will be outraged at having to give up their lands for climate refugees. Remember, great and relatively sudden influxes of masses of people into any one area will result in unrest in that area - always has, always will. Syria's a great example - one of the main factors (if not THE main factor) in their civil war was the influx of refugees from Iraq, and of farmers who could no longer get enough water to irrigate their farms (thanks to climate change, btw).

The climate change argument about Syria has been thoroughly debunked.
 
Y'know, it's as if anytime a scientist adjusts data, y'all seem to think that he's making crap up as he goes along, that his motives must be mercenary and nefarious.

Has it ever occurred to y'all that maybe, just maybe scientific research very rarely settles on one set of data, on one set of laws or rules or equations? For instance, we know that general and special relativity are real - indeed, if we didn't allow for relativistic effects on satellites, our cell phones would be a lot less functional! But even with that, relativity is NOT considered a scientific fact - it's considered a theory since it hasn't been proven to the standards that are accepted by the scientific community.

Same thing goes with gravity - we deal with it every day, we feel it in our bones and muscles, but gravity is "only" theoretical in the eyes of physicists - it hasn't been proven to their standards of what's considered "proof".

What's more, both relativity and gravity are the subjects of ongoing experiments today and have been since the theories were first proposed - that's the way science works.

Given the fact that neither gravity nor relativity are considered unproven theories, and that both are the subjects of ongoing experiments where physicists will use their findings to "adjust" the data already collected over the past several generations, exactly how can one expect that the scientific community would go outside, collect the available data on the atmosphere and climate, collate the data and construct their theories, and then call it a day and not continue to study it year-in and year-out as they do gravity and relativity? The very idea that scientists would not continue their research is ludicrous! Why? As the level of technology and education available to climate scientists increases year-by-year, they find new data that was not available before...and so they have to study the new data and see how it fits with what was already documented...and sometimes the new data disproves the old data, and sometimes scientists find that this or that very small factor that they have just identified will change a significant amount of the data already collected over the years.

What's more, scientists never - repeat, never - agree in all details of a major field of study. In every field of study, you'll find scientists disagreeing - sometimes viciously - over this or that detail or theory. So when it comes to sea level rise, you ARE going to find different estimates - some greater, some lesser - but nearly the entire climatology community (except for the relatively very few deniers, several of whom are paid in some way by Big Oil) agrees that the sea level will rise significantly. What's more, they themselves will tell you that their estimates will change over time as better data becomes available concerning glacial flow, calving, and melt; geological factors (like the Karst topography in Florida (which negates any hope of a great seawall, btw)); the effectiveness of humanity's efforts to decrease the emission of greenhouse gases; the degree of deforestation and the growth of "heat islands" that result from urbanization; and much more.

For instance, just last month, phys.org printed a study showing that there is substantial indication that climate change may increase volcanic activity - which idea seems silly, of course, until one reads that the data apparently show that when a (naturally very, very heavy) glacier melts, there is less pressure on the crust beneath, and so allows magma to flow more easily. Yeah, that does make sense...and it's actually good news in a way, since explosive volcanic eruptions can cool the planet somewhat. Of course, if it's a supervolcano (like Yellowstone) that blows, well, that's not good...but it's nothing to worry about. For now.

So...yeah, scientists DO adjust their data - they MUST do so, for to fail to do so when new data becomes available would be scientific malpractice. It's not a grand conspiracy, not a nefarious scheme to spread socialism...but simply scientists doing their jobs to the best of their ability.

The climate change argument about Syria has been thoroughly debunked.

reference?
 
lol

AMS puts out a paper saying that for the first time, for events in 2016, we can attribute the intensity of certain extreme events beyond normal levels to climate change.

Your response is to... link to a paper that was submitted in November 2014? Whose period of observation is 1979-2013, as in before the time period where the AMS paper claims we can observe distinct effects? A paper where on the first page it refers to "robust warming" in land regions over the past century? One that concludes with the following:

Long-term projections of future dynamic contributions are challenging given the substantial underlying decadal scale variability, as well as the uncertain impact of anthropogenic forcing on mid-latitude circulation. However, given our finding that many patterns have exhibited increasing (decreasing) intensity of extreme hot (cold) events, and that those trends are coincident with a nearly categorical increase in thermodynamic forcing, the observed trends of increasing hot extremes and decreasing cold extremes could be expected to continue in the coming decades, should greenhouse gases continue to accumulate in the atmosphere.
(Emphasis added)

Oh, and guess what? One of the lead authors (Daniel Horton) contributed to a recent article:

Quantifying the influence of global warming on unprecedented extreme climate events
Quantifying the influence of global warming on unprecedented extreme climate events
(Hint: You might not read about this one on WUWT, as the authors recognize that "continued global warming is likely to cause widespread emergence of unprecedented events in the future")

Did you even bother to read the article you linked?

You’ll have to forgive him. He’s a bit slow.
 
Well for many decades the Ferries were run by a private company called Puget Sound Navigation, then the state took it over after regulating them out of business and immediately exempted themselves from the regulations.
When PSN ran the Ferries they were cheaper, ran more frequently, and had better service
Sound Transit is an absolute socialist scam, glad you can use it without the 250 dollar illegally counted car tabs because you live outside the RTA. Link rail is also over budget and has never come close to ridership projections

Housing is expensive because of socialist central planning called “zoning”
And the over 100,000 dollars of inspections that are completely unnecessary

You've been listening to Dori Monson, haven't you? He hates Sound Transit with the proverbial heat of a thousand white-hot suns! I used to listen to him, and even submitted a couple haikus for him (until one I gave was really inappropriate - I regret that).

When it comes to Sound Transit, track the tax dollars for its construction. What tax dollars were wasted...meaning, what tax dollars went "poof" and disappeared into thin air instead of being circulated in the local economy? What's more, MOST public transportation does run a deficit regardless of where you live...because up-front profit is not the purpose of public transportation. Why? Because the real profit from public transportation does NOT come from fares, but from the increase in the ability of the poor and lower-middle-class to get from point A to point B, to be able to have better jobs...and pay more taxes.

You should be looking at ferries and light rail and buses the same way you look at roads. Does the state make an up-front profit on laying pavement for cars to get from point A to point B? Of course not! The profit - as with every other means of publicly-funded conveyance - comes from the increased tax revenue since more people are able to go more places, to spend more money in those other places, to get and keep jobs in those other places. If there's one big fault in "modern conservative economic theory", it's that conservatives seem to always demand up-front profit, and do not understand the short-term costs normally translate into long-term profits from increased business and increased job availability.

And Bainbridge Island is a GREAT example of this! Why? Because there's thousands of wealthy people over here on BI who work in downtown Seattle (a 35-minute relaxing and scenic commute instead of the I-5 headache)...and the fact that they live here increases the local property values to among the highest in the state...and so increases the tax revenue from those property values...and that, sir, is how Washington state takes a short-term loss but makes a long-term profit on the ferry system. But I get it...everything that doesn't make an immediate profit is SOCIALISM!!!! and must be rejected by all patriotic Americans, regardless of how much sense that socialist idea may make. For instance, studies show that it actually costs LESS in taxpayer dollars to provide apartments for the homeless than to just leave them on the street...but something tells me that you're probably going to reject the idea out-of-hand 'cuz SOCIALISM!!!!!!
 
You've been listening to Dori Monson, haven't you? He hates Sound Transit with the proverbial heat of a thousand white-hot suns! I used to listen to him, and even submitted a couple haikus for him (until one I gave was really inappropriate - I regret that).

When it comes to Sound Transit, track the tax dollars for its construction. What tax dollars were wasted...meaning, what tax dollars went "poof" and disappeared into thin air instead of being circulated in the local economy? What's more, MOST public transportation does run a deficit regardless of where you live...because up-front profit is not the purpose of public transportation. Why? Because the real profit from public transportation does NOT come from fares, but from the increase in the ability of the poor and lower-middle-class to get from point A to point B, to be able to have better jobs...and pay more taxes.

You should be looking at ferries and light rail and buses the same way you look at roads. Does the state make an up-front profit on laying pavement for cars to get from point A to point B? Of course not! The profit - as with every other means of publicly-funded conveyance - comes from the increased tax revenue since more people are able to go more places, to spend more money in those other places, to get and keep jobs in those other places. If there's one big fault in "modern conservative economic theory", it's that conservatives seem to always demand up-front profit, and do not understand the short-term costs normally translate into long-term profits from increased business and increased job availability.

And Bainbridge Island is a GREAT example of this! Why? Because there's thousands of wealthy people over here on BI who work in downtown Seattle (a 35-minute relaxing and scenic commute instead of the I-5 headache)...and the fact that they live here increases the local property values to among the highest in the state...and so increases the tax revenue from those property values...and that, sir, is how Washington state takes a short-term loss but makes a long-term profit on the ferry system. But I get it...everything that doesn't make an immediate profit is SOCIALISM!!!! and must be rejected by all patriotic Americans, regardless of how much sense that socialist idea may make. For instance, studies show that it actually costs LESS in taxpayer dollars to provide apartments for the homeless than to just leave them on the street...but something tells me that you're probably going to reject the idea out-of-hand 'cuz SOCIALISM!!!!!!

So if I understand correctly, the point of this wall of text is to say that if Government transit agencies are losing money, never on budget or time that’s ok because the overruns circulate through the economy? With logic like that how can you lose ?

With Ferries I supplied a specific example of how Ferries were safely and profitably operated by a private company that made profit running them, and after World War Two they wanted to charge an additional nickel per passenger because the federal payments for war workers ended, the Washington Transportation commission said no, they forbid the Ferries from raising fares, then refused to grant permits for road improvements to terminals, then squeezed them until they were forced to sell, then 5 months after assuming operations the state cut the schedule and raised fares by a dime.

Your argument is invalid.
 
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So if I understand correctly, the point of this wall of text is to say that if Government transit agencies are losing money, never on budget or time that’s ok because the overruns circulate through the economy? With logic like that how can you lose ?

With Ferries I supplied a specific example of how Ferries were safely and profitably operated by a private company that made profit running them, and after World War Two they wanted to charge an additional nickel per passenger because the federal payments for war workers ended, the Washington Transportation commission said no, they forbid the Ferries from raising fares, then refused to grant permits for road improvements to terminals, then squeezed them until they were forced to sell, then 5 months after assuming operations the state cut the schedule and raised fares by a dime.

Your argument is invalid.

Um, no. Using your logic, we should never even have paved roads, and Eisenhower's Interstate Highway System was a great and criminally-unnecessary burden upon the state and federal economies. Again, you're completely ignoring the OTHER sources of tax revenue that the city and state bring in as a direct result of those "money-losing" forms of public transportation. Just like with roads, these forms of public conveyance are money-losers up front...but in the big picture, they're critical for maintaining the transportation infrastructure that allows the city and state to grow and prosper.
 
Um, no. Using your logic, we should never even have paved roads, and Eisenhower's Interstate Highway System was a great and criminally-unnecessary burden upon the state and federal economies. Again, you're completely ignoring the OTHER sources of tax revenue that the city and state bring in as a direct result of those "money-losing" forms of public transportation. Just like with roads, these forms of public conveyance are money-losers up front...but in the big picture, they're critical for maintaining the transportation infrastructure that allows the city and state to grow and prosper.

At the very least you can make the argument people actually use the roads. Unlike sound transit

I doubt sound transit brings even their operating cost in tax revenue. They go literally no where people wouldn’t drive to or take the bus to. And buses are far cheaper then light rail and use the same infrastructure as cars. Also roads are open use, rails are a highly restrictive use.

So your answer is still, a transportation project can be as wasteful as possible because the money will circulate through the economy, that’s a form of Kenysian economics that’s been long disproven. I mean if you believe that go shatter a store window because then a glazier will be paid to fix it. This is a myth, the tax money absorbed by sound transit would’ve been spent in the private economy much more efficiently.

And man, you just keep dodging the ferry question, I’ll ask you direct, was it right, yes or no, for the state to squeeze out a profitable ferry operator so that they could take it over and raise fares and cut service?
 
Climate change and the Syrian civil war revisited - ScienceDirect
ScienceDirect › science › article › pii


by J Selby · 2017 · Cited by 7
For proponents of the view that anthropogenic climate change will become a 'threat multiplier' for instability in the decades ahead, the Syrian civil war has become a recurring reference point, providing apparently ...

Okay, I've read most of the study and I'll give you that one - thank you, and good on you for showing that to me.

That being said, while that part of my argument turned out to be wrong, that does not detract from my overall point one whit. Even in America two or three generations hence, Florida will be flooding to the extent that large parts will no longer be habitable, and so there will be many - probably well into the millions - will be displaced.

Considering the experience you've related to me in the past, what happens when millions of people are displaced from their home and have to move to a different place even within their own home nation?
 
Okay, I've read most of the study and I'll give you that one - thank you, and good on you for showing that to me.

That being said, while that part of my argument turned out to be wrong, that does not detract from my overall point one whit. Even in America two or three generations hence, Florida will be flooding to the extent that large parts will no longer be habitable, and so there will be many - probably well into the millions - will be displaced.

Considering the experience you've related to me in the past, what happens when millions of people are displaced from their home and have to move to a different place even within their own home nation?

You're welcome.

It's not going to happen because the theory from which the prediction is derived is false.
 
At the very least you can make the argument people actually use the roads. Unlike sound transit

I doubt sound transit brings even their operating cost in tax revenue. They go literally no where people wouldn’t drive to or take the bus to. And buses are far cheaper then light rail and use the same infrastructure as cars. Also roads are open use, rails are a highly restrictive use.

So your answer is still, a transportation project can be as wasteful as possible because the money will circulate through the economy, that’s a form of Kenysian economics that’s been long disproven. I mean if you believe that go shatter a store window because then a glazier will be paid to fix it. This is a myth, the tax money absorbed by sound transit would’ve been spent in the private economy much more efficiently.

And man, you just keep dodging the ferry question, I’ll ask you direct, was it right, yes or no, for the state to squeeze out a profitable ferry operator so that they could take it over and raise fares and cut service?

1. Not everyone has a car. Not everyone can afford a car. Not everyone wants a car. Not everyone can use a car.

2. Light rail is only somewhat more expensive than buses...and takes MUCH less time when traveling longer distances. Try taking the bus from Westlake Center to the airport and see how long that takes you.

3. And NO, this "form of Keynesian economics" has not been disproved at all. All I have to do to see the proof of its success is to look at how prosperous Bainbridge Island is, almost completely due to the ferry system. Without the ferry system, BI - and much of the Kitsap peninsula north of the submarine base - would be an economic wasteland, with no real access to the economic engine that is Seattle without driving for several hours. But instead, this is one of the more desirable places to live in the state of Washington, with a disproportionately high percentage of wealthy people...all of whom pay a heck of a lot of property taxes, sales taxes, and whatever other taxes there are.

4. Most tellingly, if your argument was accurate, then instead of looking at the widespread prosperity that we have in Puget Sound, we'd be in perpetual economic doldrums...but no matter how you try, it's very hard to argue against obvious widespread and persistent economic success.
 
You're welcome.

It's not going to happen because the theory from which the prediction is derived is false.

You're saying that the sea level will not rise to the point that a truly significant portion of Florida will become uninhabitable by the end of the century?
 
Cool. I’ll take Asia heatwave over socialist takeover of our economy. It means nothing

You are a bit late, posting on the socialist internet, (which I at least pay for through a bill that is delivered by a socialist post office) and you probably learned to read and write in a socialist school system, to whose schools you traveled over socialist paved streets, having fastened your socialist-required seat belt. The libertarian ship has sailed. Long ago. Get used to it.
 
Yes. Absolutely.

Unfortunately, neither you nor I will likely be around to see which of us was right...

...but it has already been shown that the sea level is rising, and that due to loss of glacial coverage and the general rise of temperatures over most of the planet, the rise in sea level will accelerate. I would argue with you further on this, but - as you demonstrated a few years ago by claiming the Great Recession never occurred - you've shown yourself willing and able to deny reality.
 
Unfortunately, neither you nor I will likely be around to see which of us was right...

...but it has already been shown that the sea level is rising, and that due to loss of glacial coverage and the general rise of temperatures over most of the planet, the rise in sea level will accelerate. I would argue with you further on this, but - as you demonstrated a few years ago by claiming the Great Recession never occurred - you've shown yourself willing and able to deny reality.

The recession occurred, it just wasn't as great as the propaganda made it out to be.
 
1. Not everyone has a car. Not everyone can afford a car. Not everyone wants a car. Not everyone can use a car.

2. Light rail is only somewhat more expensive than buses...and takes MUCH less time when traveling longer distances. Try taking the bus from Westlake Center to the airport and see how long that takes you.

3. And NO, this "form of Keynesian economics" has not been disproved at all. All I have to do to see the proof of its success is to look at how prosperous Bainbridge Island is, almost completely due to the ferry system. Without the ferry system, BI - and much of the Kitsap peninsula north of the submarine base - would be an economic wasteland, with no real access to the economic engine that is Seattle without driving for several hours. But instead, this is one of the more desirable places to live in the state of Washington, with a disproportionately high percentage of wealthy people...all of whom pay a heck of a lot of property taxes, sales taxes, and whatever other taxes there are.

4. Most tellingly, if your argument was accurate, then instead of looking at the widespread prosperity that we have in Puget Sound, we'd be in perpetual economic doldrums...but no matter how you try, it's very hard to argue against obvious widespread and persistent economic success.


1) irrelevant
2) the advantages of light rail do not financially justify the cost and total lack of ridership
3) you’ve purposefully ignored that ferry boat service was once provided at a profit until the state purposefully overregulated them out of existence, and no Kitsap county would not be economically dead, the top three employers of county residents are all located inside the county.
4) no, my argument does not mean that at all, that’s a straw man argument
 
1) irrelevant
2) the advantages of light rail do not financially justify the cost and total lack of ridership
3) you’ve purposefully ignored that ferry boat service was once provided at a profit until the state purposefully overregulated them out of existence, and no Kitsap county would not be economically dead, the top three employers of county residents are all located inside the county.
4) no, my argument does not mean that at all, that’s a straw man argument



1. NOT irrelevant...but no one will ever convince you otherwise.
2. "do not justify" in your opinion.
3. I suspect - since you didn't provide a reference - the "top three" employers in Kitsap are the Navy, the state and local governments...and Wal-Mart. The latter two would be true of almost ANY poor, rural county in America - it's certainly true of the dirt-poor Mississippi Delta. But the jobs that bring in the money into the county are the Navy...and the jobs from downtown Seattle. That, sir, is a fact.
4. It's only a strawman argument because you want to say it is...and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on that one.

But more directly, it looks like you may have been misinformed as to the history of the ferry system:

Embarking and disembarking were handled the same as always, although riders received a yellow pamphlet explaining the future plans of the new state-run organization. Washington State Ferries offices took over the offices of the Black Ball Line, and even the phone number (3-2579) was unchanged. The biggest difference was that the president's office, which had been the domain of Captain Alexander Peabody (1895-1980), was now the office of WSF General Manager Floyd McDowell.

The state had recently bought out most of the fleet and operations from Captain Peabody after a years-long battle in which much of the public felt that the privately owned system constituted a monopoly. After suffering through shutdowns and rate hikes, an angry citizenry convinced lawmakers to step in and let the state run the ferry system in such a way that it could be made more accountable to the populace. Plus, many assumed that a network of bridges and tunnels would soon be crisscrossing Puget Sound, making ferries obsolete. To them, the ferry system was only temporary.
 
1. NOT irrelevant...but no one will ever convince you otherwise.
2. "do not justify" in your opinion.
3. I suspect - since you didn't provide a reference - the "top three" employers in Kitsap are the Navy, the state and local governments...and Wal-Mart. The latter two would be true of almost ANY poor, rural county in America - it's certainly true of the dirt-poor Mississippi Delta. But the jobs that bring in the money into the county are the Navy...and the jobs from downtown Seattle. That, sir, is a fact.
4. It's only a strawman argument because you want to say it is...and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on that one.

But more directly, it looks like you may have been misinformed as to the history of the ferry system:

Embarking and disembarking were handled the same as always, although riders received a yellow pamphlet explaining the future plans of the new state-run organization. Washington State Ferries offices took over the offices of the Black Ball Line, and even the phone number (3-2579) was unchanged. The biggest difference was that the president's office, which had been the domain of Captain Alexander Peabody (1895-1980), was now the office of WSF General Manager Floyd McDowell.

The state had recently bought out most of the fleet and operations from Captain Peabody after a years-long battle in which much of the public felt that the privately owned system constituted a monopoly. After suffering through shutdowns and rate hikes, an angry citizenry convinced lawmakers to step in and let the state run the ferry system in such a way that it could be made more accountable to the populace. Plus, many assumed that a network of bridges and tunnels would soon be crisscrossing Puget Sound, making ferries obsolete. To them, the ferry system was only temporary.


Your link is missing many parts of the story. It doesn’t mention that the state raised fares after assuming ownership, the state utility commission had denied the permission to increase fares prior (and prior to that the Black ball line only wanted an additional nickel, the state by the end of 1952 had increased fares by over a dime) the reason for seeking the fare increase was because the federal government had subsidized the ferry line to haul war workers for free during the war, obviously in the absense of a war that did not continue.

The state refused to construct a highway to the site of a new ferry dock on the hood canal in the lead up to the acquisition. I mean the state like always is interested in what gets votes so they forced the company to fold as only a government can.

Now, the three largest employers in Kitsap county are the Navy, Harrison Medical Center, and Walmart actually.

But out of a population of over a quarter of a million 12,000 residents commute to Seattle. That’s not where all of the jobs are
 
Your link is missing many parts of the story. It doesn’t mention that the state raised fares after assuming ownership, the state utility commission had denied the permission to increase fares prior (and prior to that the Black ball line only wanted an additional nickel, the state by the end of 1952 had increased fares by over a dime) the reason for seeking the fare increase was because the federal government had subsidized the ferry line to haul war workers for free during the war, obviously in the absense of a war that did not continue.

The state refused to construct a highway to the site of a new ferry dock on the hood canal in the lead up to the acquisition. I mean the state like always is interested in what gets votes so they forced the company to fold as only a government can.

Now, the three largest employers in Kitsap county are the Navy, Harrison Medical Center, and Walmart actually.

But out of a population of over a quarter of a million 12,000 residents commute to Seattle. That’s not where all of the jobs are

I'd love to see a link to the information you have on the ferry system since all I have is your word versus the reference I linked to.

Concerning the three largest employers, I got two out of three right...and if I'm wrong about the number of state and local government workers, two of those top-three employers (the hospital and Wal-Mart) would indeed be the largest two employers in almost any dirt-poor rural county in America. AGAIN, the money flowing into the county comes from the Navy and from high-paying jobs in Seattle.
 
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