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The rising sea level myth[W:565]

Re: The rising sea level myth

Dittohead not! said:
The link goes to a blog, not to a NASA site. While it does have a link to NASA at the end, the link has nothing to do with sea levels at all.

Bloggers are fond of telling us what NASA is saying, but, the reality is that NASA is not saying what they're saying it's saying.

I posted a link to a real site. Have you been able to open it yet?
It shows sea levels around the world and gives the rise and fall in sea levels locally. Overall, the levels are up slightly, but certainly not enough to make it necessary to head for the hills or buy that ocean front property in Arizona or Tennessee.
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These are the links, 4 of them, that were at the end of the article. Anything that draws data from the GRACE Satellites has to do with sea level. They all worked for me and the ones that link to NASA link to NASA. I have always found the Anthony Watts stuff to be skeptical, but well source and his links are ususally very understandable.

The comments that follow his posts are usually very instructive as well.


For more information on NASA’s sea level monitoring satellites, visit: OSTM: Home Page , CU Sea Level Research Group | University of Colorado , GRACE - Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment and GRACE Tellus .
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
There are numerous links on the sea level fall, are you just questioning my choice of links or the fact that the sea level did indeed recently fall a quarter inch?

EDIT: never could get your site up, don't know why.


EDIT: HERE, happy??? :lol:


"NASA Satellites Detect Pothole on Road to Higher Seas"

NASA Satellites Detect Pothole on Road to Higher Seas - NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory
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Ecstatic.

Now, you have an actual link to a real site maintained by scientists, not bloggers or politicians. In it, we find an explanation to the "pothole" as follows:

So what's up with the down seas, and what does it mean? Climate scientist Josh Willis of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., says you can blame it on the cycle of El Niño and La Niña in the Pacific.

Willis said that while 2010 began with a sizable El Niño, by year's end, it was replaced by one of the strongest La Niñas in recent memory. This sudden shift in the Pacific changed rainfall patterns all across the globe, bringing massive floods to places like Australia and the Amazon basin, and drought to the southern United States.
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That's as opposed to the blog in the OP, claiming that:

The Rising Sealevel Myth --
Proofs that ocean levels are falling, not rising
(countering a new and expensive misconception about the Earth)
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which is based not on science, observation, or fact, but on someone's agenda of wishful thinking.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Dittohead not! said:
Ecstatic.

Now, you have an actual link to a real site maintained by scientists, not bloggers or politicians. In it, we find an explanation to the "pothole" as follows:



That's as opposed to the blog in the OP, claiming that:



which is based not on science, observation, or fact, but on someone's agenda of wishful thinking.
Click to expand...

In my first post on this I said the same thing the NASA site said. My question was how many gallons does a quarter inch of ocean equal? I just don't think NASA's explanation holds water.

EDIT: At least you now admit the sea level did recently drop. It was news to me too so don't feel too stupid.:)
 
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Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
In my first post on this I said the same thing the NASA site said. My question was how many gallons does a quarter inch of ocean equal? I just don't think NASA's explanation holds water.

EDIT: At least you now admit the sea level did recently drop. It was news to me too so don't feel too stupid.:)
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Yes, that was a surprise.
What wasn't a surprise was that a blogger would take that bit of data and proceed to say that the sea levels are now falling, so NASA was wrong.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
Here's something I had not heard. The sea level recently dropped by a quarter inch but NASA says that extra water just fell over land after warming sucked it up out of the sea. Anyone know how many gallons a quarter inch of ocean equals? Sounds fishy to me.
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It depends on the distribution of the precipitation.

Over ice sheets, it makes them thicken

Over normal areas that rain, probably little or no effect.

Increases in some areas, and it becomes part of refilling aquifers.

I'd say it's pretty hard to support or deny the NASA claim without some tedious studying.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
I got people discussing it and that was my intent.
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So it's acceptable to link to a bunch of pseudo-scientific garbage as long as it gets people talking?
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
Could all this chatter about rising sea levels just be another hoax in an attempt to prop up the AGW hoax?

" A dangerous misconception is gaining increasing credibility in the public eye. This misconception is that the levels of world seas and oceans is rising.

The fact that ocean levels are falling, not rising, is easily demonstrated from a wealth of historical evidence, some of which is presented below. Widespread fears and assertions of rising sealevels prove, when examined, to be only deductions from other equally groundless myths.

Perhaps the world is full of misconceptions, do we really need to worry about them? The rising sealevel misconception is one for which the answer is very definitely "Yes!". This misconception is beginning to cost us very serious money, and interfere with planning and progress in every country with a seashore.

The Great Sealevel Swindle
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The only swindle here is that link. Sea levels are rising. Go ask the islands in the Pacific and Indian oceans that are becoming unlivable because of rising sea levels.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
The sea level recently dropped by a quarter inch but NASA says that extra water just fell over land after warming sucked it up out of the sea. Anyone know how many gallons a quarter inch of ocean equals? Sounds fishy to me.
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Any actual scientific evidence of global warming "sounds fishy" to you.

The chart in the article you linked clearly indicates that the sea levels have been rising since at least 1992 -- despite an occasional drop, such as 1998 to 1999. Annual variations like these are normal, and again, are not proof against global warming.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Visbek said:
Any actual scientific evidence of global warming "sounds fishy" to you.

The chart in the article you linked clearly indicates that the sea levels have been rising since at least 1992 -- despite an occasional drop, such as 1998 to 1999. Annual variations like these are normal, and again, are not proof against global warming.
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LOL

Who needs to prove 'against" global warming.

It's the folks trying to SELL global warming with the political agenda.

We skeptics aren't buying your political agenda. Carbon taxes ect.

The onus of proof is on you, not us. :D
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Visbek said:
So it's acceptable to link to a bunch of pseudo-scientific garbage as long as it gets people talking?
Click to expand...

Getting people talking brought forth a fact very few new, sea level actually fell for a brief period recently. I found that interesting.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
Getting people talking brought forth a fact very few new, sea level actually fell for a brief period recently. I found that interesting.
Click to expand...

it IS interesting!
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
Getting people talking brought forth a fact very few new, sea level actually fell for a brief period recently. I found that interesting.
Click to expand...
Oh?

So you look at a chart which shows a steady increase in sea levels, and a clear trend since 1992, and which includes a few small drops such as 1998-1999 and still rises, and what you find "interesting" is a small one-year reduction?

As in, everything the article says shows a clear increase in sea levels, and you focus on the one tiny detail as "interesting?"
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

yobarnacle said:
Who needs to prove 'against" global warming.
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The scientific evidence overwhelmingly supports the theory that the planet is warming, and it's due to human activity.

Which is why deniers like sawyer need to rely on pseudo-scientific junk like what he listed in his initial post.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Visbek said:
Oh?

So you look at a chart which shows a steady increase in sea levels, and a clear trend since 1992, and which includes a few small drops such as 1998-1999 and still rises, and what you find "interesting" is a small one-year reduction?

As in, everything the article says shows a clear increase in sea levels, and you focus on the one tiny detail as "interesting?"
Click to expand...

A quarter inch drop in one year, yep that is interesting, amazing even. That is one hell of a lot of water going somewhere.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
Getting people talking brought forth a fact very few new, sea level actually fell for a brief period recently. I found that interesting.
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When the long term trend is sea level rising, a short period of sea level falling is an insignificant anomaly.

Or do you consider anomalies to be the rule and long term trends to be the exception, when it comes to climate change?
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Kanstantine said:
When the long term trend is sea level rising, a short period of sea level falling is an insignificant anomaly.

Or do you consider anomalies to be the rule and long term trends to be the exception, when it comes to climate change?
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I have never said this proves or disproves sea level rise, in fact I have said here numerous times it has been rising since the last ice age ended. I find the fact that it can fall a quarter inch in a year amazing though, like I said that's a lot of damn water. The thing about you warmer cult members is you get your hackles up every time you even suspect anything just might go against your religion. Relax and enjoy the science.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

sawyerloggingon said:
I have never said this proves or disproves sea level rise, in fact I have said here numerous times it has been rising since the last ice age ended. I find the fact that it can fall a quarter inch in a year amazing though, like I said that's a lot of damn water. The thing about you warmer cult members is you get your hackles up every time you even suspect anything just might go against your religion. Relax and enjoy the science.
Click to expand...

The next time you accuse me of being a member of a cult, you get reported.

Consider this your first and last warning. Stay civil or leave the discussion.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Kanstantine said:
When the long term trend is sea level rising, a short period of sea level falling is an insignificant anomaly.

Or do you consider anomalies to be the rule and long term trends to be the exception, when it comes to climate change?
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You will have to define "long term".

In an earlier post someone was referring to the past 150 years as long term, compared to a couple of years where sea levels were actually a tad lower.

"The sea level and bay development patterns outlined here are based on mounting archeological and geological evidence as interpreted by author Robert Ricklis. As the timing of sea level change and human occupation is fine tuned and better known, the localized consequences of “minor fluctuations” may become clear. For example, some geologists have inferred the existence of multiple periods of “high stand” when sea level appears to have been several meters higher than modern levels. These relatively minor fluctuations from the big picture perspectives may well have drastically impacted the human exploitation of specific ecological niches along the coastal zone. Lawrence Aten has argued for such a scenario in the Taylor Bayou area on the uppermost Texas coast. (For details, see the Gaulding site Ancient Place.) "

Contributed by Robert A. Ricklis.

Coast Prehistory: sea level
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

You guys need to also understand that an average sea level increase of say 1 inch will manifest itself very differently in bays where lots of water is forced into a narrow area by tides, and areas of shallow slope.

We may very well have a situation in 20 years where the USA has seen relatively no sea level rise while other parts of the world do.
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Kanstantine said:
You guys need to also understand that an average sea level increase of say 1 inch will manifest itself very differently in bays where lots of water is forced into a narrow area by tides, and areas of shallow slope.

We may very well have a situation in 20 years where the USA has seen relatively no sea level rise while other parts of the world do.
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So when will YOU understand that if I can't pick and choose areas, neither should YOU! :)

Do natural disasters, ie: storms, floods, earthquakes occur around the world? Of course! Always have. So what's new?


and HOW would buying permission to emit co2 do ANYTHING to stop it?

the WHOLE global warming, metamorphed into climate change, evolving into sea rise, seems like a socialist wealth redistribution scheme, with the agenda to bring down the western cultures.

I honestly can't see any other interpretation of the movement and it's goals. :D
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

yobarnacle said:
So when will YOU understand that if I can't pick and choose areas, neither should YOU! :)

Do natural disasters, ie: storms, floods, earthquakes occur around the world? Of course! Always have. So what's new?


and HOW would buying permission to emit co2 do ANYTHING to stop it?

the WHOLE global warming, metamorphed into climate change, evolving into sea rise, seems like a socialist wealth redistribution scheme, with the agenda to bring down the western cultures.
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And the conspiracy theory is revealed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

Kanstantine said:
And the conspiracy theory is revealed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Of COURSE socialists have and have had long range plans to defeat the USA and the other western capitalist nations. Do you doubt it?

Let's see. Infiltration of education, the media, subversion of the political parties, ect....30 years ago, who would have imagined the democrats would be pushing socialist agendas and policies?

Who would believe (other than Joe McCarthy in the 50s) that socialists would have taken over most US media and university faculty positions?

Accident?
Or well laid long term plan?

AGW/Climate Change/Sea Rise is the latest attack!
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

yobarnacle said:
Of COURSE socialists have and have had long range plans to defeat the USA and the other western capitalist nations. Do you doubt it?

Let's see. Infiltration of education, the media, subversion of the political parties, ect....30 years ago, who would have imagined the democrats would be pushing socialist agendas and policies?

Who would believe (other than Joe McCarthy in the 50s) that socialists would have taken over most US media and university faculty positions?

Accident?
Or well laid long term plan?

AGW/Climate Change/Sea Rise is the latest attack!
Click to expand...

Were you called Brigadier General Jack D. Ripper in a past life?

You forgot to mention fluoride poisoning of ice cream. Children's ice cream, Mandrake!!
 
Re: The rising sea level myth

yobarnacle said:
LOL

Who needs to prove 'against" global warming.

It's the folks trying to SELL global warming with the political agenda.

We skeptics aren't buying your political agenda. Carbon taxes ect.

The onus of proof is on you, not us. :D
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The following organizations have already done so:


American Association for the Advancement of Science
American Chemical Society
American Geophysical Union
American Institute of Biological Sciences
American Meteorological Society
American Society of Agronomy
American Society of Plant Biologists
American Statistical Association
Association of Ecosystem Research Centers
Botanical Society of America
Crop Science Society of America
Ecological Society of America
Natural Science Collections
Alliance Organization of Biological Field Stations
Society for Industrial and Applied Mathematics
Society of Systematic Biologists
Soil Science Society of America
University Corporation for Atmospheric Research
The National Geographic Society
CERN

and they've convinced all of the scientific organizations in the world except for:

(none)
 
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