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  1. #31
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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Ethic's before money has to become a higher concern for mankind. Nothing in the principle of God based goodness has ever said that a people cannot profit and live fair, when Ethics lead our pathways.

    We have much to "RELEARN" and how to re-groom ourselves and our society, As To and About; how to live as honorably people, who are just and to build a system of ethnic based justice.

    In the 1970's our schools were damaged greatly when legislation's impacted our society, which led to the diminishing of "Civic's" being taught in our schools. We lost that education value of what it is to be a "Citizen" in this Democracy and this United States.
    The Far Right - wanted it removed, because it was post Civil Right Era, and for that learning to be promoted for a non segregated people, to learn how to further fight for rights and liberty in this nation, it did not like the move of Civil Rights nor of Women Rights, and the Many Rights of the Previously disenfranchised. IF people were to be unlearned about our system, they too were to be unlearned about our voting rights, unlearned about how voting districts function and unlearned about how our political and Civic system functions. Those of the Far Left moved as well, to avert the learning of Civics with a claim of wanting unconstrained freed without Civic responsibility as they considered people were being groomed for War Services. The element of the Vietnam War was a great impacting tragedy upon the American people, and people were distraught at the many lives were being destroyed and taken away in a war no one could explain. Later, the Pentagon Papers surfaced, exposing the mess, it future impacted the minds of people, and moved us even further from the education of Civics. On the Far Right, they become more enraged and wanted to lay blame upon the elements of cultural and ethnic integration. when bare premise and fact is, 'we ceased to "teach coming youth and the next generation about what it is to be of Civic Understanding and Learning in how to learn Civics as to the individual in a Democracy System of these United States.

    Civics is about more than just how our System is designed, it is about the civil nature of what it takes to live within a Democratic system.
    Former Senator Bob Graham has long championed a push for Civic Education to be Returned to Our Schools.
    Since the removal of Civics from being centered in our Educational System, we've seen a continual erosion of our society and a widening disintegration of our social continuity. One does not grow up with inherent learning as to how to live in Civil society, it is a process of learning. We seem to have forgotten that very important point.

    instead we have allowed money to become our focus in every aspect, and as a result, EVERYTHING in America has declined. Ethics have been disregarded and eroded and made void.

    If we want to fix American we have to start at these levels of Education, and move back to what we once knew, and education our young in what is American Democracy and Teach the Civics, to education people how to live in a Civic system as civil beings in a Democracy.

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye10 View Post
    ... not only is a degree not a signal that a person is educated, it is a sign that they have had their brain warped by the brain molders, and are likely too ignorant to know that this has happend.
    This is untrue!

    There are certainly different political currents, but the choice of which to follow is for each of us to make. In fact, what has happened over the recent past is that Americans have become even less attached to political parties.

    Donald Dork lost the popular-election but won election by means of an antiquated Electoral College that America never had the courage to fix (meaning institute legally the fact that the EC must report ONLY THE TOTAL POPULAR VOTE IN THAT STATE.)

    Why is it too difficult for people to understand that simple rule? Why is it that some blockheads still repeat the inanity that "smaller states deserve more of a voice". A truly fair and unbiased vote for the presidency is that of the simple popular-vote on most democracies on earth - with the unique exception of ours ... !
    Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them; then neither persons nor property will be safe. (Frederick Douglass)

  3. #33
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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by Lafayette View Post
    This is untrue!

    There are certainly different political currents, but the choice of which to follow is for each of us to make. In fact, what has happened over the recent past is that Americans have become even less attached to political parties.

    Donald Dork lost the popular-election but won election by means of an antiquated Electoral College that America never had the courage to fix (meaning institute legally the fact that the EC must report ONLY THE TOTAL POPULAR VOTE IN THAT STATE.)

    Why is it too difficult for people to understand that simple rule? Why is it that some blockheads still repeat the inanity that "smaller states deserve more of a voice". A truly fair and unbiased vote for the presidency is that of the simple popular-vote on most democracies on earth - with the unique exception of ours ... !
    Your baseline quote is excellent:

    "Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them; then neither persons nor property will be safe". (Frederick Douglass)

    It very well enforces the fact that the E.C. should be abolished... I had those thoughts when I was 10 yrs old.... because it never made sense in this day and time that people vote, and the E.C. Comes In and over-ride it and install a President based on the voice of a few, over the voices of many.

    American Democracy is to be "One Man", "One Vote".. does not matter what material holding, land holding, monetary holding, or office or position one holds... "One Man", "One Vote". E.C. amounts to nothing more than the wealthy establishing such a system as E.C. because they had little respect for the general population, and considered the general population too uneducated to over-ride what their money had installed as a mechanism to control the usurp the vote of voice of the people. It was pretended, that it was to give the lesser populated states a higher voice. When fact is... the voice of vote, should only concern itself with the "One Man", "One Vote". without concern or regard for the population size within a state, because people are free to live where they choose and in doing so, get the results of what the "One Man", "One Vote" brings into deliverance.

    There is not much in America that was not perverted by the wealthy in their aims to control and dominate, from the point of class divisiveness, into and thought salver and indentures and the biased gaming of playing people against one another based on their monetary status of rich or poor. (That reeks of "Plutocracy", which is an abomination upon and against the very principles the American Democracy was Established. It could only have been done upon and against an uneducated mass, that is why "education is premier in a Democracy", and Civics Education should never be made to play second class to the teaching of history, when that history itself is adulterated)

    Federal and State Campaign Funding Should have always been the system... and to get that funding a Candidate should be mandated to have demonstrated some civic achievement in governmental performances of serving the people in some capacity that represents their devotion to the principles set forth in the governing princeliness of our society.
    NOT... which wealthy family one hails from, or which family has established itself as some political dynasty or who can accumulate the most money.

    Today, we have people placed in office, who can't do the job of the office, for the incessant campaigning of raising money for the next campaign cycle. No man should think himself guaranteed for re-elections. Only the performance and services of the duties of the job, Nothing should give a man the thought or conclusion as if consideration is guaranteed; or implied or mandated they get re-elected.

    What service is it to the people, if a President spends 2 yrs of a 4 year term, posturing and campaigning to get re-elected, when the role and work of the jobs is slated for a term of 4 yrs. Only overwhelming achievements that advance and uplift society and establish policy that protects and advance the future should be considered if such a one throws their hat in the ring for the next election cycle.

    We have No Kings, No Queens, No Kings Court, No Monarch's --- we are a nation of American Citizens, " "One Man", "One Vote", and all are to be equal in civic and civil matters in this American Democracy. One's economic or monetary holding has no bearing on giving any man, more than the power of "One Man", "One Vote".
    Last edited by RealityNow; 03-25-19 at 08:01 AM.

  4. #34
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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by RealityNow View Post
    We have No Kings, No Queens, No Kings Court, No Monarch's --- we are a nation of American Citizens, " "One Man", "One Vote", and all are to be equal in civic and civil matters in this American Democracy..
    But we do have an upper-class quite prepared to fund whatever is necessary to get their person elected. And how is that done?

    Election funding expenditures are most spent upon TV-adverts. Because we Yanks are the people who watch the most TV. So, the BoobTube is the place where most election promotion money is spent.

    Does it have any effect? That is, the two major parties throwing paid-for adverts at one another? There is nothing more stoopid than an advert. It condenses everything to its simplest form and pitches it to you. Whether you "buy it" or not is your business. But given that TV commercials are a Very Profitable Business, it is likely to remain that way for political commercials.

    So, we are, in fact, selling our political representatives like they were packaged dog-food!

    Every now and then there is a TV-debate, and it does attract millions of Americans. I've watched a couple and such debates are mind-blowingly childish. From what I gather, the politicians asked to "KISS" - that is, Keep It Simple to Sell - which also means making an idea so simple it is nothing more than a lie.

    I know of no sphere of politics that is simple. But, I also think that Americans are not especially well trained in Civics and their Civic Duty (which means voting) - aside from a general description of local, state and national government functions. Which really does not say anything about "What are or should be the goals of a political party?"

    That can be answered very clearly by each party, most often with opposite opinions that are debated. The Right is going to insist upon "unlimited ability to obtain as much wealth as is humanly possible" and the Left will bore us silly about "Sharing it all fairly". Which is why I suggest that more and more Americans are voting in the middle! They can easily flip-flop to either side.

    Unfortunately , they do not concentrate on True Value from their political leadership, which is why there is such Income Disparity in America. Nobody should want that we all earn the same salary. Our abilities are all different, and it is "ability" (along with some luck) that determines financial outcomes.

    What is nevertheless of key importance, however, is the fact that 15% of Americans (more than 40 million men, women and children) - living in one of the richest nations on earth - can't go to a doctor when they are sick and don't know from where their meals next week are coming ...
    Last edited by Lafayette; 03-26-19 at 07:01 AM.
    Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them; then neither persons nor property will be safe. (Frederick Douglass)

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Thank you, Post #34 (Civics Education in the US), should awaken those from the tribal trance of drama antics... unfortunately....

    What we get when apathy and raw ignorance prevails, wrapped in self centered greediness... is: The mess that exist today in our Political System... The Rabid Mentality of Republican Savagery, headed by the Master Savage of the Decade.... "Trump"!

    Plutocracy is made up of "Savages Driven by Avarice".... It is supported by the savage mentality of the under educated and the uneducated, and they are embolden by the ignorance born of lack of knowledge, and void of the capability and ability of understanding the Civics of Democracy. They function by "Tribalism, based on skin color, race, and greed seeking, while they bond themselves together in an incessant aim to pursue denying society from having systems that care for/of its people and their communities. Such savage driven madness has no regard for the environment, nor the concern for the youth of today, who will become the inheritors of all that exist. They have no interest to learn the ethic's and morality that is core within the composition of Democracy, and certainly no concern for the Civics Educations of how to live and respect the systems that American Democracy has created. They pervert even the principles of Religion, for the vanity of their own lust-fullness to indulge in the pridefulness of what makes fools of mankind. thus producing what is savagery.. They seek to wrap their bias and bigotry, in the words they have bastardized into making their ideals and abomination unto the very Bible they have used for the sake of abusive self aggrandizing delusions of superiority. Thus rendering them as the most inferiority before the eyes of God. They think "hoarding guns and slinging out put down commentary, will uplift them, when it only exposes the elemental make up of what is "savages".

    Democracy was designed for those who embrace Dignity, Ethics, and Humane Concerns and Respect for Civil Society, and the Civics which educates on how to live within the systems Democracy Created.
    Civics Education is what promotes the understanding as to how to live in a Civil Society, what is it's structure and what and how the composition that makes up that structure is designed to function, as well as the rights and responsibilities of the persons, as individuals, who make up what is "We The People".

    Those who rail and scream about Freedom... are often the greatest abusers of everything the principles of Freedom stands for. They are void of knowing that "Freedom is - only gained through Adherence to Responsibility".... and to be Responsible on has to know what the pare meters are that preserves what Responsibility Makes into Freedom.

    The Truly Ignorant, think "Freedom" means to do any thing, any way at any time, by any means.... willfully unaware that such conduct is that of a "Savage".
    Last edited by RealityNow; 03-26-19 at 08:48 AM.

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Right Winger's avoid the subject about "Civics Education" , as if their mindset cannot digest what it is, and they certainly are averse to knowing the value basis that it is unto American Democracy.... Yet, they want to wave the flag, followed by their idiocy of wanting to dictate to society as if they are some model to emulate.

    they look for post they can go to with aim to feed their drama lusting with a drama spin fix, and within their giddy foolishness, sling out their "one liner" imbecilic "go to phrases"...

    America has to survive this madness for at least a decade as the old heads pass on and the new generation of young educated and civics aware people can move into positions and change the paradigm.

    The damages which Trump has done and continue doing, is amplified by the vile of the Republican Led Senate... doing all they can to try and hang on to the "white nationalistic plutocratic agenda, of trying to prolong the damaging system of white nationalism of wealthy white male domiance. Of which, we've seen damage America for Centuries and Decades....

    Time - Continues to march us forward... in this case we move forward, but through the madness and vile of these types acting like savages, trying to further their savagery. Unfortunate as it is, the contempt and rage will cause damages within society, as society of liberal minded people who understand that the premise and principles within and of Democracy is based in Liberalism, which is constituted by Majority Rule... Therefore, through it all, Democracy's Principles will stand and in doing so continue its move to eradicate such savagery from infecting and damaging the coming generations.
    It took 100's of yrs to demolish the system of slavery from the perversion that led to it being sanctioned by and within government policy, then it took another 100 yrs for the segregation it spawned... and now we are only 55 yrs since the Civil Rights Act... Therefore.. within the next 10-25 yrs... and it may be far less, considering the advanced level of the spread of information and the learning curve which has been improved within and through the age of information, which technology has bought... It will become a taming of social media, from the wild west days it has demonstrated in its newness.... it is at a point and time it has to mature... and that maturity is taking place more and more each day...!

    Watch what happens as Trump attacks "ACA"... when the poor and working poor whites that now back Trump come face to face with the devastation his attack is pursuing, they will be forced to awaken, by the only thing that can awaken them... and that is "coming face to reality" of not only their pockets being cleaned out, but when the death cycle increased due to their lack of access to health care. Then when he attacks Social Security, they will become rabid, and forced into facing the truths they have long worked hard to avoid, which is the truth, they have been "hoodwinked" and "betrayed"... !!!!! They will learn the value of what is Public Services and Public Assistance... and they will be liken to a person stranded in the desert in 100 degree temperatures with no water.

    Then they will come to learn what "The Preamble" and its intrinsic value within American Democracy.

    They will try every means they can to fight off that truth.... but that truth will cover them and the more who fight it will simply smother the life out of themselves.

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    "If itís consensus, it isnít science. If itís science, it isnít consensus. Period." --Michael Crichton

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by RealityNow View Post
    Right Winger's avoid the subject about "Civics Education" , as if their mindset cannot digest what it is, and they certainly are averse to knowing the value basis that it is unto American Democracy.... Yet, they want to wave the flag, followed by their idiocy of wanting to dictate to society as if they are some model to emulate.

    they look for post they can go to with aim to feed their drama lusting with a drama spin fix, and within their giddy foolishness, sling out their "one liner" imbecilic "go to phrases"...

    America has to survive this madness for at least a decade as the old heads pass on and the new generation of young educated and civics aware people can move into positions and change the paradigm.

    The damages which Trump has done and continue doing, is amplified by the vile of the Republican Led Senate... doing all they can to try and hang on to the "white nationalistic plutocratic agenda, of trying to prolong the damaging system of white nationalism of wealthy white male domiance. Of which, we've seen damage America for Centuries and Decades....

    Time - Continues to march us forward... in this case we move forward, but through the madness and vile of these types acting like savages, trying to further their savagery. Unfortunate as it is, the contempt and rage will cause damages within society, as society of liberal minded people who understand that the premise and principles within and of Democracy is based in Liberalism, which is constituted by Majority Rule... Therefore, through it all, Democracy's Principles will stand and in doing so continue its move to eradicate such savagery from infecting and damaging the coming generations.
    It took 100's of yrs to demolish the system of slavery from the perversion that led to it being sanctioned by and within government policy, then it took another 100 yrs for the segregation it spawned... and now we are only 55 yrs since the Civil Rights Act... Therefore.. within the next 10-25 yrs... and it may be far less, considering the advanced level of the spread of information and the learning curve which has been improved within and through the age of information, which technology has bought... It will become a taming of social media, from the wild west days it has demonstrated in its newness.... it is at a point and time it has to mature... and that maturity is taking place more and more each day...!

    Watch what happens as Trump attacks "ACA"... when the poor and working poor whites that now back Trump come face to face with the devastation his attack is pursuing, they will be forced to awaken, by the only thing that can awaken them... and that is "coming face to reality" of not only their pockets being cleaned out, but when the death cycle increased due to their lack of access to health care. Then when he attacks Social Security, they will become rabid, and forced into facing the truths they have long worked hard to avoid, which is the truth, they have been "hoodwinked" and "betrayed"... !!!!! They will learn the value of what is Public Services and Public Assistance... and they will be liken to a person stranded in the desert in 100 degree temperatures with no water.

    Then they will come to learn what "The Preamble" and its intrinsic value within American Democracy.

    They will try every means they can to fight off that truth.... but that truth will cover them and the more who fight it will simply smother the life out of themselves.
    Now that you've had your rant, do you have anything substantive to say about civics education in America?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS. #MAGA #WalkAway

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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by Lafayette View Post
    From the Center for American Progress: The State of Civics Education

    Excerpt:


    No modern nation on earth can claim to be a Real Democracy if Civics Education is not a key element of secondary-schooling. People must know not only the political history of the US, but also how politics runs the country today. I suspect personally that most people get a notion of political activity off the BoobTube (TV).

    That's just not good enough. The notion of Liberty being the foundation-stone of our nation is fine but neither is it good enough. Americans must be taught also that the Electoral College that MANIPULATES THE POPULAR-VOTE before conveying the results to Congress and Gerrymandering are both manipulations of the popular-vote to favor either side of a basically two-party system!

    Both the above election-voting connivances have been in place since 1812 - when the 12th Amendment instituted the Electoral College and a Massachusetts governor (Gerry) carved out voting districts to assure that his party would win them.

    What are a people to do when their democracy has been infected by such complicities?

    Simply not put up with them!
    The fact that you use the term "Democracy" indicates your own poor civics education. If you can't be precise and correct, don't come in here complaining about the education system. And then your commentary on the EC, is not useful to an objective discussion on civics education. You already appear partisan from the start, if that's your intent, you're a success.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS. #MAGA #WalkAway

  10. #40
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    Re: Civics Education in the US

    Quote Originally Posted by american View Post
    the fact that you use the term "democracy" indicates your own poor civics education. If you can't be precise and correct, don't come in here complaining about the education system. And then your commentary on the ec, is not useful to an objective discussion on civics education. You already appear partisan from the start, if that's your intent, you're a success.
    blah, blah, blahhhhhhh ...
    Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them; then neither persons nor property will be safe. (Frederick Douglass)

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