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Proposition: Real men do as we want.

Henrin said:
I'm right. :shrug: Men need to stop being bitches in relationships and go back to the way they were before second wave feminism.
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Not all men are being bitches in relationships, and certainly not all women want one like that anyway!
 
Hawkeye10 said:
My theory is that once we figure out what our women really want, and then give it to them, that we can write our own ticket after that, do as we want to do, that women will figure out some way to make it work in their heads. What few men ever understand is what we are taught that women want is rarely what their woman want, though their woman will claim otherwise because they have been taught to follow the script, taught that there is something wrong with them if they want something other than what their betters have told them that they should want.

Step 1: Figure out your woman.

Step 2: Give her what she most wants.

Step 3: Be in charge, do what you want to do, she will be more than fine with that regardless of what she claims.

This is my theory.
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Uhm...a big hell no.
 
One of the biggest perks of being a millennial is that, for the most part, we don't view other people as almost different species because of their gender. My wife and I never fight, and we both get to do what we want. I'd suggest dropping whatever dumb "rules" some insecure men taught you to follow when you were growing up. It makes life much easier.
 
Cardinal said:
I would feel very uncomfortable in a relationship with a woman who wanted to follow my instruction as a matter of course. A woman who doesn't assert herself and take command of her own decisions would be extremely annoying to me. I couldn't respect her, and that would be a very unhealthy relationship for me. It's hard for someone like me to imagine that it's especially healthy for a woman to want to be dominated, but I suppose if that's what truly makes her happy then there's all types.



Nobody should be "melting down" in the face of the other's aggression, but then by the same token nobody's aggression should be causing one's partner to feel fear in the first place.
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And what the man wants most certainly does matter as much as does what the woman wants, we need to find the mates who are right for us, and the first step in getting there is to know who we are. But see when I look around I see so many men who are not only extremely ignorant on how relationships work, but worse they dont even know who they are, and if they could not even figure out who they are then they have no chance of figuring out a woman. I say men run away not so much because they fear their woman, but rather because they have not the first clue what to do with their woman, nor are they very interested in figuring it out. Eventually the woman gets her fill of poor quality man, and leaves.
 
MrPeanut said:
One of the biggest perks of being a millennial is that, for the most part, we don't view other people as almost different species because of their gender. My wife and I never fight, and we both get to do what we want. I'd suggest dropping whatever dumb "rules" some insecure men taught you to follow when you were growing up. It makes life much easier.
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You get out of life what you put into it so "easy" is not what you think it is, and if there is no passion then what is the point I say. These relationships that start out almost exclusively about being best friends dont have legs from what I have seen, the boredom kills everything.

That and the growing apart.

Never fighting is a huge warning light.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
This former feminist is somewhat surprised that he finds in his 50's that this is actually true...that when women want us enough they will forgive us anything and everthing.

My relationship guru David Deida agrees with me I am pretty damn sure though he has never had the guts to say so so far as I has seen.

How do you feel about that?
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Do what you want is relative.

Go out to the bar after work every night and come home after midnight sauced, eventually even the most loving woman will reach her point of no return and leave your ass. Blow the family savings on bad bets often enough, ditto. Start abusing drugs and losing jobs...the list goes on, but a sure fire way to lose even the best woman, get caught cheating.

Now, if "do as you want" is going hunting once or twice a year, chances are a good wife will not take issue with that. Have a hobby, most wives love that stuff. But, spend all weekend chugging beer in the garage, and you might start seeing some conflict.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
You get out of life what you put into it so "easy" is not what you think it is, and if there is no passion then what is the point I say. These relationships that start out almost exclusively about being best friends dont have legs from what I have seen, the boredom kills everything.

That and the growing apart.

Never fighting is a huge warning light.
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If your preference is to have someone to fight with all the time then I think with your current views you are on the right track. I've had long term relationships where we would fight everyday, and it wasn't for me. I prefer peace and quiet.
 
MrPeanut said:
One of the biggest perks of being a millennial is that, for the most part, we don't view other people as almost different species because of their gender. My wife and I never fight, and we both get to do what we want. I'd suggest dropping whatever dumb "rules" some insecure men taught you to follow when you were growing up. It makes life much easier.
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Millennial men don't take charge and just allow women to walk on them. I think it would be best for men to ignore the way millennial men do things. Doing everything feminists want of you, which is what millennial men essentially do in relationships, is hardly a role model to follow. If anything it is the model of the whipped man that doesn't even realize he is whipped.
 
calamity said:
Now, if "do as you want" is going hunting once or twice a year, chances are a good wife will not take issue with that. Have a hobby, most wives love that stuff. But, spend all weekend chugging beer in the garage, and you might start seeing some conflict.
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Which is why I advise men to just not live with them in the first place. If I want to chug beer all day in the garbage it's my business and I will do it if I want.
 
How much of the current crap quality of relationships can be pinned to modern laziness?

Quite a lot I think... a lack of caring, a lack of willingness to be bothered..."Hey, if it dies I will go get a new one, investing in this one is not worth my time".

Another part of our disposable culture.
 
Henrin said:
Which is why I advise men to just not live with them in the first place. If I want to chug beer all day in the garbage it's my business and I will do it if I want.
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Sounds to me like you never found/trained the right woman.

Trust me, they are around, and if you had one then you would have everything you have now, and more.


Note: to those who need to get all offended that I trained my wife take your pissiness down the road a spell, I dont need it. Yes I trained her, and she trained me, and we were clear with each other from the start on that, we have long said so openly in front of our friends....your precious consent took place.
 
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Henrin said:
Millennial men don't take charge and just allow women to walk on them. I think it would be best for men to ignore the way millennial men do things. Doing everything feminists want of you, which is what millennial men essentially do in relationships, is hardly a role model to follow. If anything it is the model of the whipped man that doesn't even realize he is whipped.
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With way way too many just the thought of taking charge of a woman, a woman who more than likely is up in their grill testing them, gives them the hives.

We might just turn into Japan, where the young increasingly cant be bothered to enter into intimate partner relationship till deep into their 20's, too much trouble for too low of quality.

Young women who complain that young men are useless have a legit complaint.

But the men who get it, the ones who can give women what they want, they get more ***** on offer than they can use.
 
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Hawkeye10 said:
Sounds to me like you never found/trained the right woman.
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Never thought of training a woman.

Trust me, they are around, and if you had one then you would have everything you have now, and more.
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I can have more by keeping her in her own place.

Note: to those who need to get all offended that I trained my wife take your pissiness down the road a spell, I dont need it. Yes I trained her, and she trained me, and we were clear with each other from the start on that, we have long said so openly in front of our friends....your precious consent took place.
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Bleh, women talk of training men all the time, so whatever **** you get for it is likely going to be hypocritical nonsense.
 
Henrin said:
Never thought of training a woman.

I can have more by keeping her in her own place.

Bleh, women talk of training men all the time, so whatever **** you get for it is likely going to be hypocritical nonsense.
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This of course is one of the more interesting fault lines...yes women say it all the time, and even to this day in most places it earns a big yuck yuck when they do, but let a man say it about his wife or GF...he is practically convicted on the spot of being an abuser of women, he is scum.
 
Lovebug said:
I think communicating with your spouse is a good thing, and compromise is as well.
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Do you think compromise is a particularly good thing when the man does most of the compromising? Quite a few women seem to expect to be catered to.
 
matchlight said:
Do you think compromise is a particularly good thing when the man does most of the compromising? Quite a few women seem to expect to be catered to.
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Compromise as in
an agreement or a settlement of a dispute that is reached by each side making concessions, or
settle a dispute by mutual concession.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
With way way too many just the thought of taking charge of a woman, a woman who more than likely is up in their grill testing them, gives them the hives.
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Yup, if you don't take charge of yourself then she will.

We might just turn into Japan, where the young increasingly cant be bothered to enter into intimate partner relationship till deep into their 20's, too much trouble for too low of quality.
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There is some resistance to the way things are going in relationships, but not enough to conclude that is a real possibility.
 
matchlight said:
Do you think compromise is a particularly good thing when the man does most of the compromising? Quite a few women seem to expect to be catered to.
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I would say quite a few refuse to compromise at all. These women expect you to do as you are told and that's the end of the story.
 
Lovebug said:
Compromise as in
an agreement or a settlement of a dispute that is reached by each side making concessions, or
settle a dispute by mutual concession.
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But not the 90/10 deals so many women have been taught to expect, where men do the 90% of the work and the giving up, because men suck.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
With way way too many just the thought of taking charge of a woman, a woman who more than likely is up in their grill testing them, gives them the hives.
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Why would I waste my time with a woman who got in my face trying to test me, let alone be interested in "taking charge of her?" Friendly, pleasant, considerate women are far better company.
 
Henrin said:
I would say quite a few refuse to compromise at all. These women expect you to do as you are told and that's the end of the story.
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But Hell will freeze over before you find one who will admit it.

They think they are being reasonable, and where they are not reasonable they are fixing men, they are engaged in a public good....according to them
 
Hawkeye10 said:
With way way too many just the thought of taking charge of a woman, a woman who more than likely is up in their grill testing them, gives them the hives.

We might just turn into Japan, where the young increasingly cant be bothered to enter into intimate partner relationship till deep into their 20's, too much trouble for too low of quality.

Young women who complain that young men are useless have a legit complaint.

But the men who get it, the ones who can give women what they want, they get more ***** on offer than they can use.
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So a relationship is basically trading sex for favors? Why not just hire a hooker? I mean, if you want sex. If you want an intimate friendship with your spouse, it takes hard work from both sides.
When either side starts talking about whipping and being a bitch, I am not sure if they know anything about functional marriages/relationships, or if they are in one.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
But not the 90/10 deals so many women have been taught to expect, where men do the 90% of the work and the giving up, because men suck.
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I tend not to surround myself with people who do, nor do I listen to their advice.
 
matchlight said:
Why would I waste my time with a woman who got in my face trying to test me, let alone be interested in "taking charge of her?" Friendly, pleasant, considerate women are far better company.
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Because what I am talking about is better quality.

Easy is over rated, I say we have way too much easy already.
 
Lovebug said:
I tend not to surround myself with people who do, nor do I listen to their advice.
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And what percentage of young women would you guess are sure that if their man is not mostly following instructions (after some appropriate time on a hopefully touchy feelly explaining of the woman's "needs") on the things the woman cares about then they are in an abusive relationship?

Which is why we have so many woman abusing their men now, and then they wonder why young men would rather sit in the basement playing Playstation or whatever rather than dealing with a woman.
 
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