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Thread: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

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    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands | TheHill

    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    President Trump’s rapid push for a COVID-19 vaccine by the end of the year may be playing into hands of the anti-vaccine community, which has already used the coronavirus crisis to further its conspiracy claims about the safety of vaccines.

    The Trump administration is racing to get a vaccine to the market quickly with “Operation Warp Speed.”

    The project’s goal is to have 300 million vaccine doses available by January, an accelerated version of the administration’s previous projections of needing 12 to 18 months to get a vaccine ready for the public.
    ================================================== ====================
    My thoughts on this:

    1. The chances of having a reliable & effective vaccine available for distribution to 300 million people by the end of the year is highly improbable based simply on the logistics & the ways that vaccines are developed.

    2. Some trial vaccines have made the recipients very ill.

    3. The biology of the coronavirus S protein, on which the Moderna vaccine is based, is frought with inherent problems. I've posted about these before.

    4. Is Trump using the DPA to ready the syringes & associated dispensers with which to administer this vaccine? You don't just throw a switch & these things suddenly appear.

    5. Many people, myself & anti-vaxxers included, are going to wait to find out the results of the initial application of a new vaccine.

    6. Dozens of different vaccines are being developed by different pharma companies. Besides the necessary clinical trials for each, how long will comparison evaluation trials between these contenders take? The end of the year is only 6+ months away, not a realistic time frame to get all this accomplished by Trump's deadline.
    'Make America great' - Benito Mussolini, Fascist Dictator, 1927 newsreel clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5l_r8MG5II

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by JacksinPA View Post
    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands | TheHill

    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    President Trump’s rapid push for a COVID-19 vaccine by the end of the year may be playing into hands of the anti-vaccine community, which has already used the coronavirus crisis to further its conspiracy claims about the safety of vaccines.

    The Trump administration is racing to get a vaccine to the market quickly with “Operation Warp Speed.”

    The project’s goal is to have 300 million vaccine doses available by January, an accelerated version of the administration’s previous projections of needing 12 to 18 months to get a vaccine ready for the public.
    ================================================== ====================
    My thoughts on this:

    1. The chances of having a reliable & effective vaccine available for distribution to 300 million people by the end of the year is highly improbable based simply on the logistics & the ways that vaccines are developed.

    2. Some trial vaccines have made the recipients very ill.

    3. The biology of the coronavirus S protein, on which the Moderna vaccine is based, is frought with inherent problems. I've posted about these before.

    4. Is Trump using the DPA to ready the syringes & associated dispensers with which to administer this vaccine? You don't just throw a switch & these things suddenly appear.

    5. Many people, myself & anti-vaxxers included, are going to wait to find out the results of the initial application of a new vaccine.

    6. Dozens of different vaccines are being developed by different pharma companies. Besides the necessary clinical trials for each, how long will comparison evaluation trials between these contenders take? The end of the year is only 6+ months away, not a realistic time frame to get all this accomplished by Trump's deadline.
    The delicious paradox of this is that so many members of the Cult of Dirtbag are climate change science deniers, anti-vaxxers and science deniers or scientific luddites in general.
    "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." (authorship disputed)

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by JacksinPA View Post
    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands | TheHill

    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    President Trump’s rapid push for a COVID-19 vaccine by the end of the year may be playing into hands of the anti-vaccine community, which has already used the coronavirus crisis to further its conspiracy claims about the safety of vaccines.

    The Trump administration is racing to get a vaccine to the market quickly with “Operation Warp Speed.”

    The project’s goal is to have 300 million vaccine doses available by January, an accelerated version of the administration’s previous projections of needing 12 to 18 months to get a vaccine ready for the public.
    ================================================== ====================
    My thoughts on this:

    1. The chances of having a reliable & effective vaccine available for distribution to 300 million people by the end of the year is highly improbable based simply on the logistics & the ways that vaccines are developed.

    2. Some trial vaccines have made the recipients very ill.

    3. The biology of the coronavirus S protein, on which the Moderna vaccine is based, is frought with inherent problems. I've posted about these before.

    4. Is Trump using the DPA to ready the syringes & associated dispensers with which to administer this vaccine? You don't just throw a switch & these things suddenly appear.

    5. Many people, myself & anti-vaxxers included, are going to wait to find out the results of the initial application of a new vaccine.

    6. Dozens of different vaccines are being developed by different pharma companies. Besides the necessary clinical trials for each, how long will comparison evaluation trials between these contenders take? The end of the year is only 6+ months away, not a realistic time frame to get all this accomplished by Trump's deadline.
    Fauci said something the other day that he believed EOY was feasible for a distributable vaccine. I'm not sure that to be effective the entire population has to be vaccinated; That's never been the case with various versions of the flu in previous years. I think a focus on the most vulnerable and a re-opening of the country will prove beneficial.
    As to the DPA - worked pretty fast with ventilators and other equipment. I think distribution and the personnel to administer the shots may be more of a bottleneck.
    Those who are willing to surrender their freedom for security have always demanded
    …it should also be taken from those not prepared to do so.- F.A. Hayek

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by JacksinPA View Post
    6. Dozens of different vaccines are being developed by different pharma companies. Besides the necessary clinical trials for each, how long will comparison evaluation trials between these contenders take?
    Why do you think anyone will wait for such comparisons? I'd guess first one to be shown it's "good enough" will be pushed out. If later another one is even better, it will replace the first one as preferred option, etc. (unless it's developed by Chinese or Europe and Trump will just ignore it then - if he is still in the office then)

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    I really worry for the safety of the people who get the vaccine before it is really ready. It seems like the plan is to have a ton of human trials who are unaware that they are part of trials. We will have a bunch of people line up for a haphazardly tested vaccine at the end of the year, and then those people will let us know what side effects and risks it poses.

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by JacksinPA View Post
    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands | TheHill

    Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    President Trump’s rapid push for a COVID-19 vaccine by the end of the year may be playing into hands of the anti-vaccine community, which has already used the coronavirus crisis to further its conspiracy claims about the safety of vaccines.

    The Trump administration is racing to get a vaccine to the market quickly with “Operation Warp Speed.”

    The project’s goal is to have 300 million vaccine doses available by January, an accelerated version of the administration’s previous projections of needing 12 to 18 months to get a vaccine ready for the public.
    ================================================== ====================
    My thoughts on this:

    1. The chances of having a reliable & effective vaccine available for distribution to 300 million people by the end of the year is highly improbable based simply on the logistics & the ways that vaccines are developed.

    2. Some trial vaccines have made the recipients very ill.

    3. The biology of the coronavirus S protein, on which the Moderna vaccine is based, is frought with inherent problems. I've posted about these before.

    4. Is Trump using the DPA to ready the syringes & associated dispensers with which to administer this vaccine? You don't just throw a switch & these things suddenly appear.

    5. Many people, myself & anti-vaxxers included, are going to wait to find out the results of the initial application of a new vaccine.

    6. Dozens of different vaccines are being developed by different pharma companies. Besides the necessary clinical trials for each, how long will comparison evaluation trials between these contenders take? The end of the year is only 6+ months away, not a realistic time frame to get all this accomplished by Trump's deadline.
    I think they should have gone to Ludicrous Speed!

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by Xilnik View Post
    I really worry for the safety of the people who get the vaccine before it is really ready. It seems like the plan is to have a ton of human trials who are unaware that they are part of trials. We will have a bunch of people line up for a haphazardly tested vaccine at the end of the year, and then those people will let us know what side effects and risks it poses.
    Cool let's start with everyone in the WH, led the way Donnie.

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by Slavister View Post
    Why do you think anyone will wait for such comparisons? I'd guess first one to be shown it's "good enough" will be pushed out. If later another one is even better, it will replace the first one as preferred option, etc. (unless it's developed by Chinese or Europe and Trump will just ignore it then - if he is still in the office then)
    Not every candidate will be both safe & effective, at least by degree.

    The S protein on which the Moderna vaccine is based, has a high mutation rate & is therefore highly variable in its amino acid sequence, meaning different strains have already appeared that will respond differently. A vaccine developed on the basis of strain A might have little or no protective effect on infection by strains B or C. As with the current seasonal flu vaccine, this might require the development of multiple vaccines that are combined in order to give a safe & effective vaccine that covers all the strains seen up to that point.
    'Make America great' - Benito Mussolini, Fascist Dictator, 1927 newsreel clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5l_r8MG5II

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Quote Originally Posted by digitusmedius View Post
    The delicious paradox of this is that so many members of the Cult of Dirtbag are climate change science deniers, anti-vaxxers and science deniers or scientific luddites in general.
    As the self-proclaimed international spokesman for Luddites United For Change Backwards" I hereby require you to unconditionally withdraw that totally unjustified slur on all Luddites.
    Summary of 20/07/09 COVID-19 (Deaths/Cases) Mortality Statistics
    World (553,013/12,209,393) 4.53% / USA (134,920/3,160,284) 4.27% / Canada (8,737/106,434) 8.21%
    Running update of the COVID-19 data at Daily Statistical Summary of COVID-19

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    Re: Some worry 'Operation Warp Speed' plays into anti-vaccination movement's hands

    Luddite - Wikipedia. I'm a card-carrying member of the Society.
    'Make America great' - Benito Mussolini, Fascist Dictator, 1927 newsreel clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5l_r8MG5II

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