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Reopening, the facts

longview said:
I am sorry, but you did not support your argument, but I had a citation for mine.
The FDA and CDC did choose to develop their own Covid-19 test, that is a matter of fact, not opinion.
For several weeks the CDC required all test to be returned to Atlanta for testing, also fact!
Why do you choose to ignore things like this, as contributing complications of getting US testing going?
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Trump's administration should have demanded that these types of tests were available "before" the virus appeared. Many other countries were ready with these tests. In fact, you may remember that for the first 2 months we were forced to buy those tests from other countries because we could not produce them ourselves. This is an OP about Trump incompetence, not about the FDA and CDC. They cannot do anything the administration does not fund them for.
 
GhostlyJoe said:
The CDC wasn't elected to make these decisions. I don't share your zeal for technocracy.
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You are wrong inasmuch as they may not have the power to make the decisions but they do have the expertise to do so as that is what they were originally put there for, to help handle pandemics, not only from a medical point of view but anything that has to do with the pandemic, such as gatherings and businesses that would spread the disease.

Do I really have to bring this to your attention? Is this not something that a child could figure out themselves?
 
Luckyone said:
I would fine them and/or take away whatever benefits from the government that they are enjoying.
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Thank you for your reply.
 
Luckyone said:
Trump's administration should have demanded that these types of tests were available "before" the virus appeared. Many other countries were ready with these tests. In fact, you may remember that for the first 2 months we were forced to buy those tests from other countries because we could not produce them ourselves. This is an OP about Trump incompetence, not about the FDA and CDC. They cannot do anything the administration does not fund them for.
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Sorry, it was the FDA that decided that the test kits from other countries were not good enough.
The delay in developing our own test was the issue.
 
BlueTex said:
States have had these powers for a long, long time... Public health emergencies are not something new and until recently had little to do with politics... Heck, it wasn't that long ago under a different president when conservatives were clamoring to shut down flights, etc. and blasting the president over a disease from Africa... How times have changed...
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I was posting on a right-wing political blog during the ebola crisis. Those people were terrified, blamed Obama and said the virus was air-borne. Idiots.
 
GhostlyJoe said:
The CDC wasn't elected to make these decisions. I don't share your zeal for technocracy.
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Inorite?

If the CDC had been elected to make these sorts of decisions, they'd be so much more qualified to speak on public health matters than they are now.
They are rank amateurs until they win an election.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Inorite?

If the CDC had been elected to make these sorts of decisions, they'd be so much more qualified to speak on public health matters than they are now.
They are rank amateurs until they win an election.
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and Trump is 10 levels (or more) below them and he is making decisions. What does that say about our country.............run by an incompetent egocentric sociopath. God help us survive.
 
reflechissez said:
I was posting on a right-wing political blog during the ebola crisis. Those people were terrified, blamed Obama and said the virus was air-borne. Idiots.
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That's funny you mention that... go to the advanced search feature here and search for ebola and the sort by date... some fun reading...
 
Luckyone said:
You are wrong inasmuch as they may not have the power to make the decisions but they do have the expertise to do so as that is what they were originally put there for, to help handle pandemics, not only from a medical point of view but anything that has to do with the pandemic, such as gatherings and businesses that would spread the disease.

Do I really have to bring this to your attention? Is this not something that a child could figure out themselves?
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Yes ... the CDC is the government arm dedicated to studying and fighting disease. They are not an all-powerful, all-knowing council of the enlightened. Nor are they elected to make population-level political decisions.

I wonder, do you have as much faith in the FBI, IRS, ATF, CIA, DEA, DOE, Farm Bureau, etc., etc.
 
Luckyone said:
and Trump is 10 levels (or more) below them and he is making decisions. What does that say about our country.............run by an incompetent egocentric sociopath. God help us survive.
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Isn't this what you all were saying about Desantis in Florida? I haven't heard any apologies.

At some point you have to admit you were wrong.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Inorite?

If the CDC had been elected to make these sorts of decisions, they'd be so much more qualified to speak on public health matters than they are now.
They are rank amateurs until they win an election.
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They are not philosopher emperors. Their area of expertise is not the only area that requires consideration. They are not experts in law, economics, psychology, history ....

Stopping coronavirus at all costs isn't humanity's only cause.
 
GhostlyJoe said:
They are not philosopher emperors. Their area of expertise is not the only area that requires consideration. They are not experts in law, economics, psychology, history ....
Stopping coronavirus at all costs isn't humanity's only cause.
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The sun rises in the east.
The phases of the moon wax and wane.

Your case that Trump has some superior wisdom would be stronger if at least Trump and Trump's WH were on the same page.
The WH guidelines are CDC guidelines.
Trump can't even get his own house in order.

Trump is actually just as goofy as his actions make him look.
You have to love Trump like a mother loves her children to not see it.

Do you think it's a good idea to have a medical doctor look into whether or not injecting people with disinfectants helps with covid-19 infections?
Or do you believe Trump when he said those comments were sarcasm directed at a reporter who did not attend the briefing?
 
Luckyone said:
and Trump is 10 levels (or more) below them and he is making decisions. What does that say about our country.............run by an incompetent egocentric sociopath. God help us survive.
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Trump seems to have trouble accommodating new information into his world view.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
The sun rises in the east.
The phases of the moon wax and wane.

Your case that Trump has some superior wisdom would be stronger if at least Trump and Trump's WH were on the same page.
The WH guidelines are CDC guidelines.
Trump can't even get his own house in order.

Trump is actually just as goofy as his actions make him look.
You have to love Trump like a mother loves her children to not see it.

Do you think it's a good idea to have a medical doctor look into whether or not injecting people with disinfectants helps with covid-19 infections?
Or do you believe Trump when he said those comments were sarcasm directed at a reporter who did not attend the briefing?
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I watched the press conference where he said that. It was notable only to those looking to highlight absurdity and not focus on matters of importance. Don't believe the narratives; believe the evidence.

As for Trump, it's his responsibility not by virtue of his wisdom but the power invested in the office he was elected to hold. I wonder what specific policies or actions you expect the federal executive to implement and enforce.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Trump seems to have trouble accommodating new information into his world view.
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A person with the attention span of a 3-year old often has trouble accommodating new information. I am often surprised he can read. What he is good at though, is acting like a 3-year old brat. He has that down pat!
 
Luckyone said:
I think you and everyone else should stay home until it is safe enough to go out, based on the guidelines established by the CDC, which are supposed to be the experts at this. Neither you nor I should have a say in this,.
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We've seen their expertise at work, and quite questionable on this issue.
 
American said:
We've seen their expertise at work, and quite questionable on this issue.
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Does that mean that Trump's expertise on the virus by suggesting people intake clorox, radiating yourself with alpha rays, taking hydroxychloroquine (proven to be harmful to some) and telling everyone "no problem, everything is fine" is good advice? Not questionable?
 
Luckyone said:
Does that mean that Trump's expertise on the virus by suggesting people intake clorox, radiating yourself with alpha rays, taking hydroxychloroquine (proven to be harmful to some) and telling everyone "no problem, everything is fine" is good advice? Not questionable?
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No, it means only that "the experts" have been fabulously in error. Maybe they bought "Expert Certificate" at Sears? Or from some online expert mill? :mrgreen:
 
Thoreau72 said:
No, it means only that "the experts" have been fabulously in error. Maybe they bought "Expert Certificate" at Sears? Or from some online expert mill? :mrgreen:
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So you suggest we follow Trump's expertise, right?
 
Luckyone said:
Does that mean that Trump's expertise on the virus by suggesting people intake clorox, radiating yourself with alpha rays, taking hydroxychloroquine (proven to be harmful to some) and telling everyone "no problem, everything is fine" is good advice? Not questionable?
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No, Trump never suggested people do any of that, but if any speculation on developing treatments is mentioned, we can count on some people doing idiotic things no one of sound mind would consider.

It's completely understandable that the CDC would err on the side of caution in facing an unknown virus. Some of their policy and pronouncements flowing from that caution are questionable, however.
 
Luckyone said:
So you suggest we follow Trump's expertise, right?
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No!, It means be an adult, and do what we can to protect ourselves and society.
As with every other aspect of life, this involves some risk.
People need to go to work, to keep the economy functioning, yes there are risks,
but we do what we can to mitigate those risks.
Do ware a mask, and do wash your hands a lot, if you are not feeling well, stay home, and consult your doctor.
The CDC has backed off on the secondary contact transfers some (touching something an infected person touched).
The concern now is mostly person to person transfer, so masks and social distancing, will slow the spread quite a bit.
 
humbolt said:
No, Trump never suggested people do any of that, but if any speculation on developing treatments is mentioned, we can count on some people doing idiotic things no one of sound mind would consider.

It's completely understandable that the CDC would err on the side of caution in facing an unknown virus. Some of their policy and pronouncements flowing from that caution are questionable, however.
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Do you know how silly it is to challenge someone who has actually said of himself ...
"I am a very good judge of character as that has been one of my strongest attributes/talent in my life. I more often than not know to distinguish BS (as Trump hands out every day) to when a person is true to their words and in the case of Omar Ilhan, I believe everything she said in those 2 speeches."​
So there you go. Perfect judge of character.
 
humbolt said:
No, Trump never suggested people do any of that, but if any speculation on developing treatments is mentioned, we can count on some people doing idiotic things no one of sound mind would consider.

It's completely understandable that the CDC would err on the side of caution in facing an unknown virus. Some of their policy and pronouncements flowing from that caution are questionable, however.
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Do I actually have to re-show all the videos of Trump actually pooh-poohing this virus, his push for hydroxychloroquine, his suggestion that Clorox and Ultraviolet rays could help. Really? are you that blind?
 
Thoreau72 said:
Stupid questions like that suggest desperation.
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So then, what is it you suggest we do? Who do we listen to if not the experts or the people in charge? Are we supposed to do our own research and follow what we personally believe is the right thing to do?
 
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