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virus origin

Lursa said:
Source?
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...5d12a0-8b0d-11ea-9dfd-990f9dcc71fc_story.html

"The highlights of the Wuhan researchers’ work on bat viruses are spelled out in more than 40 published studies and academic papers that describe a sprawling, ambitious effort to document the connection between bats and recent disease outbreaks in China. The experiments were intended to illuminate how dangerous pathogens sometimes jump from animal hosts to humans. But experts say the research also carried an implicit risk: the possibility that the lab itself could facilitate the spread of the very diseases the scientists were trying to prevent."

"But while an accidental release may have been possible, no proof of such of an event has emerged."

Well how would there be proof when the Chinese don't allow anyone to investigate?
 
Good4Nothin said:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...5d12a0-8b0d-11ea-9dfd-990f9dcc71fc_story.html

"The highlights of the Wuhan researchers’ work on bat viruses are spelled out in more than 40 published studies and academic papers that describe a sprawling, ambitious effort to document the connection between bats and recent disease outbreaks in China. The experiments were intended to illuminate how dangerous pathogens sometimes jump from animal hosts to humans. But experts say the research also carried an implicit risk: the possibility that the lab itself could facilitate the spread of the very diseases the scientists were trying to prevent."

"But while an accidental release may have been possible, no proof of such of an event has emerged."

Well how would there be proof when the Chinese don't allow anyone to investigate?
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Yes, thanks, that's one I've seen.

Fine but there's no proof that they're lying either :doh

Did it say anywhere that they didnt allow anyone to investigate?




This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
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Lursa said:
Yes, thanks, that's one I've seen.

Fine but there's no proof that they're lying either :doh

Did it say anywhere that they didnt allow anyone to investigate?
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The Chinese have not allowed anyone to investigate. I don't have the link now. You could probably find that easily in one of these Washington Post articles.

But WHY did you ask me for a source if you already knew the Wuhan lab was studying bat coronaviruses??
 
Lursa said:
Yes, thanks, that's one I've seen.

Fine but there's no proof that they're lying either :doh

Did it say anywhere that they didnt allow anyone to investigate?
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It does here...

Pompeo: China blocking access to lab suspected of coronavirus link - Washington Times

“And most importantly, we know they’ve not permitted the world’s scientists to go into that laboratory to evaluate what took place there, what’s happening there, what’s happening there even as we speak,” Mr. Pompeo said in a separate interview Friday on the Hugh Hewitt radio show.
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It's probably to late now, anyway. The Chinese have had months to cover their tracks. What is not in question, though, is that they denied all access to this facility.
 
Good4Nothin said:
The Chinese have not allowed anyone to investigate. I don't have the link now. You could probably find that easily in one of these Washington Post articles.

But WHY did you ask me for a source if you already knew the Wuhan lab was studying bat coronaviruses??
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Because the question is about if the virus escaped from a lab, intentionally or on purpose. I have not seen that confirmed anywhere. You seem to think that your link did so. It doesnt.



This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Jack Fabulous said:
It does here...

Pompeo: China blocking access to lab suspected of coronavirus link - Washington Times



It's probably to late now, anyway. The Chinese have had months to cover their tracks. What is not in question, though, is that they denied all access to this facility.
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Ah, thanks.

Do you think that we'd allow some other country, like China or Russia, into our sensitive medical research labs to look for accidents or safety issues?

I do agree they should have...but I sure dont think it's just a "China" thing. It's a CYA thing, period IMO.





This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Lursa said:
Ah, thanks.

Do you think that we'd allow some other country, like China or Russia, into our sensitive medical research labs to look for accidents or safety issues?

I do agree they should have...but I sure dont think it's just a "China" thing. It's a CYA thing, period IMO.
Click to expand...

Under normal circumstances, no. But a global pandemic which kills hundreds of thousands, if not millions, and shuts down the entire world's economy is a little different story.

I'm a realist, and the reality is that I am being asked NOT to suspect that a virus which suddenly appears within a stones throw of a lab which "studies" this very type of virus, didn't somehow escape from that lab.

I'd put the odds at better than 80-20 that this came out of the Wuhan lab, somehow, some way.
 
Jack Fabulous said:
Under normal circumstances, no. But a global pandemic which kills hundreds of thousands, if not millions, and shuts down the entire world's economy is a little different story.

I'm a realist, and the reality is that I am being asked NOT to suspect that a virus which suddenly appears within a stones throw of a lab which "studies" this very type of virus, didn't somehow escape from that lab.

I'd put the odds at better than 80-20 that this came out of the Wuhan lab, somehow, some way.
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The requests were refused a good bit before the virus reached pandemic proportions.

I'd go the other way myself, based on the historical development of these viruses alone and that it only makes sense for there to be such a lab that close for that reason..field work, collecting, contact tracking, etc. But YMMV.





This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Lursa said:
Because the question is about if the virus escaped from a lab, intentionally or on purpose. I have not seen that confirmed anywhere. You seem to think that your link did so. It doesnt.
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You asked for a source for my statement that they studied bat coronaviruses at the Wuhan lab.

No one knows yet if it escaped from there. No one has been allowed to investigate.
 
Lursa said:
Ah, thanks.

Do you think that we'd allow some other country, like China or Russia, into our sensitive medical research labs to look for accidents or safety issues?

I do agree they should have...but I sure dont think it's just a "China" thing. It's a CYA thing, period IMO.
Click to expand...

Yeah I think if there were a pandemic we would not prevent everyone from investigating. Why do some people feel a need to defend everything China does? Are you afraid you would be a racist if you criticize them?
 
Jack Fabulous said:
Under normal circumstances, no. But a global pandemic which kills hundreds of thousands, if not millions, and shuts down the entire world's economy is a little different story.

I'm a realist, and the reality is that I am being asked NOT to suspect that a virus which suddenly appears within a stones throw of a lab which "studies" this very type of virus, didn't somehow escape from that lab.

I'd put the odds at better than 80-20 that this came out of the Wuhan lab, somehow, some way.
Click to expand...

Either it came out of the lab (by accident) or this is one of the strangest coincidences ever.
 
Lursa said:
The requests were refused a good bit before the virus reached pandemic proportions.

I'd go the other way myself, based on the historical development of these viruses alone and that it only makes sense for there to be such a lab that close for that reason..field work, collecting, contact tracking, etc. But YMMV.
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Oh stop. You think they located the lab there because that disgusting market happened to be nearby? What???
 
Good4Nothin said:
You asked for a source for my statement that they studied bat coronaviruses at the Wuhan lab.

No one knows yet if it escaped from there. No one has been allowed to investigate.
Click to expand...

???No. We knew they studied it there. We dont know if it was released from there...accidentally or intentionally. Your link doesnt answer that.

Then I asked if they were allowed to investigate...and someone else provided that answer.





This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Good4Nothin said:
Oh stop. You think they located the lab there because that disgusting market happened to be nearby? What???
Click to expand...

? Wow. How uninformed on this issue are you? This area/region is historically known for the development of coronaviruses :doh

The markets themselves are located all over the country and in other countries around the world. *sigh*





This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Good4Nothin said:
Either it came out of the lab (by accident) or this is one of the strangest coincidences ever.
Click to expand...

Why is it a coincidence when coronaviruses historically come from this region of China? Have been traced to the wet markets there?




This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Good4Nothin said:
Yeah I think if there were a pandemic we would not prevent everyone from investigating. Why do some people feel a need to defend everything China does? Are you afraid you would be a racist if you criticize them?
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I dont defend them, I recognize that we have done the same thing here. See: the incident in Reston, VA documented in the Hot Zone.

Some people have their identities so wrapped up in their belief of American superiority that they have no ability to view other countries objectively...I see you are on that list, based on your posting.




This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Lursa said:
? Wow. How uninformed on this issue are you? This area/region is historically known for the development of coronaviruses :doh

The markets themselves are located all over the country and in other countries around the world. *sigh*
Click to expand...

I'm uninformed??? Before you call me ignorant, better look at yourself. There is no reason to think they located the lab there because there were bats with coronaviruses nearby. There weren't, for one thing.

You seem very confused.
 
Lursa said:
I dont defend them, I recognize that we have done the same thing here. See: the incident in Reston, VA documented in the Hot Zone.

Some people have their identities so wrapped up in their belief of American superiority that they have no ability to view other countries objectively...I see you are on that list, based on your posting.
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This has NOTHING to do with which country is superior!! I see that your opinions on this are entirely political. All I am doing is trying to find out where the virus came from.
 
Good4Nothin said:
This has NOTHING to do with which country is superior!! I see that your opinions on this are entirely political. All I am doing is trying to find out where the virus came from.
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We know where SARS-CoV-2 originated. It was concocted in a lab in the US, Switzerland, and China in 2015. The virus is entirely human-engineered by combining the SARS virus with the coronavirus from the Chinese horseshoe bat. The question should be, how did it get released 4 years later? Was it an accidental release, or was it deliberate?
 
Lursa said:
And I explained why. I cant get anywhere in the search engines that are overwhelmed by the current crisis. Then I gave an informed reason...and you didnt even address it.

And your claims being backed up by other posters is a joke. Let's see your claims backed up by reliable sources?
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but those forum member's whose opinions confirm his own are experts - didn't you know
 
Good4Nothin said:
Yeah I think if there were a pandemic we would not prevent everyone from investigating. Why do some people feel a need to defend everything China does? Are you afraid you would be a racist if you criticize them?
Click to expand...

some people think that in order to blame Trump for all the deleterious impact this virus has had, they must lessen the blame on China.
 
Good4Nothin said:
This has NOTHING to do with which country is superior!! I see that your opinions on this are entirely political. All I am doing is trying to find out where the virus came from.
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what would the answer to your inquiry accomplish?
 
Lursa said:
And your claims being backed up by other posters is a joke. Let's see your claims backed up by reliable sources?
Click to expand...

You're assuming no one on this board has any experience in this field except for you (supposedly, even though you couldn't name any other lab in China studying bat viruses except for the Wuhan lab)?
 
justabubba said:
but those forum member's whose opinions confirm his own are experts - didn't you know
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I don't see any forum member's opinions contradicting the theory that the lab was studying bat viruses and a lab employee likely got infected, only people posting scientific evidence that backs it up - I'm not stuck on this theory, if there's evidence the other way than I'll change my mind

I started out earlier in this thread unsure, and evidence that seemed credible helped form my opinion - people can just go back through the thread and judge themselves

These posts sound pretty credible to me, especially the first one, but obviously judge for yourself...

What we do know is the lab was studying the virus. We do know that American researchers were part of the research team at one time. We know the American research team left saying the safety procedures at the lab were inadequate. In fact, they said it was an accident waiting to happen. We know that the origin of the virus was in the vicinity of the lab. We know that the Chinese locked up doctors who tried to sound the alarm on the virus.

They put the lab there because they were studying the virus that circulates in the bats...

They were studying the virus that circulates in the bats because it causes SARS and MERS, both of which broke out in the last decade.
 
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