• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Fauci: no evidence anti-malaria drug pushed by Trump works against virus

Stealers Wheel said:
The more you post it, the more true it becomes. If it is posted hundreds of times, there obviously must be something to it.
Click to expand...

Each new blog that summarizes the study is counted as a new paper published... :2razz:
 
Ikari said:
It is. But if we can run some real experiments and find out if there is any effect, that would prove useful information. I don't think that's what is being done. But if there's some possibility that this proves useful against Covid, then we should run the experiments and find out.
Click to expand...

I'm all for exploring options, but unless doctors prescribing this treatment is conducting a study, then it will be for naught from a testing perspective. In a controlled test environment would requiring something more stringent and controlled than prescribing it to people with a variety of health conditions (or lack there of). I'm eager for someone to develop a treatment because it will help opening up the country in a controlled fashion.
 
Mach said:
Which has no bearing on why Trump chose to champion this publicly as POTUS when there is no clinical data to show both efficacy, and how dangerous it is combined with CV19 and other CV19 medications administered.
Why Trump has said he is not promoting it, as he literally followed that up with stuff like "if you want to you should take it".
Which doesn't explain the right wing medias frenzy over this, as opposed to the half a dozen other treatments under clinical trial.

Trump just being irresponsible, you defending it...same old.
Click to expand...

I don't know if it works, but doctors are anecdotally saying that it does. So, if it turns out it does work, Trump has saved tens of thousands of lives by being certain that the information (that was already in the news media prior to his mentioning it) gets out to even more doctors that are dealing with patients dying or their families that there is a possible solution.

So, if it really does work against the actual virus.. you'll have to thank Trump for saving so many lives despite your objections.
 
Last edited:
buck said:
I don't know if it works, but doctors are anecdotally saying that it does.
Click to expand...
Which means doctors don't know. You don't know. Trump doesn't know.
If you don't know, be quiet.

So, if it turns out it does work, Trump has saved tens of thousands of lives by being certain that the information (that was already in the news media prior to his mentioning it) gets out to even more doctors that are dealing with patients dying or their families that there is a possible solution.
Click to expand...
Absurd. He's likely already caused harm to people as a result of his public championing of taking a drug that has now clinically demonstrated efficacy, and that has other side effects when given with the other drugs used to treat CV19 right now.
Additionally, tons of people are now harassing their physicians for this and zpacks, and its disrupting the medical treatment protocols.

That's why not-a-doctor Trump, should let doctors treat patients. They all have access to what treatments are being tried, and that show promise around the world. Leave that decision to the experts.

But we all know Trump did this for some other purpose...likely as you say, an irresponsible roll of the dice. If he's wrong, he tried. If he's right, he can say he's the savior.

Shame on you all.

So, if it really does work against the actual virus.. you'll have to thank Trump for saving so many lives despite your objections.[/QUOTE]
 
Lutherf said:
The idea that we shouldn't try something that, in a clinical setting, appears to do very little harm but could do a good bit of good should NOT be used because Trump endorsed it is insane.
Click to expand...
Yes, you are being insane in claiming that you, and Trump, now better than a century of medical knowledge and expertise in the United States and around teh world.
That's precisely why we have things like FDA and medical advice given by physicians.

Not right wing morons.

The idea that medical solutions should be subject to political will is dangerous and is direct evidence of the real problem with socialized medicine.
Click to expand...
Medical solutions should be subject to medical experts.

Gods man, what a danger it is to society promoting such B.S.
 
buck said:
I don't know if it works, but doctors are anecdotally saying that it does. So, if it turns out it does work, Trump has saved tens of thousands of lives by being certain that the information (that was already in the news media prior to his mentioning it) gets out to even more doctors that are dealing with patients dying or their families that there is a possible solution.

So, if it really does work against the actual virus.. you'll have to thank Trump for saving so many lives despite your objections.
Click to expand...
Trump minions always want to have it both ways.
If it fails to work it will be "well he tried". If it works, it will be, "see, I saved thousands of lives".

Just let the medical professionals do their job and stop angling for Trump kudos.
 
Last edited:
Are there any totally ignorant people on this planet that would take medical advice from Donald Trump?

Friggin Donald con man Trump? Trump University Trump?
 
year2late said:
President Trump REALLY needs to leave medical advice to the doctors.
Click to expand...

Wait a minute! You mean DonaldTrump is NOT a medical doctor?!?!?!?!?!!? And if you or I went on TV and urged people take drugs which were not tested - we would be facing the music.
 
BlueTex said:
Is there something at that link you were trying to point out? Here is the first sentence: There are no US Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved drugs specifically for the treatment of patients with COVID-19.
Click to expand...

You asked for evidence that chloroquine had been used for a coronavirus. I provided that information. Now you say you only want to see currently approved uses. That's an ENTIRELY different standard and goes directly back to what I was saying about allowing politicians to decide what medications can or should be used.
 
Mach said:
Yes, you are being insane in claiming that you, and Trump, now better than a century of medical knowledge and expertise in the United States and around teh world.
That's precisely why we have things like FDA and medical advice given by physicians.

Not right wing morons.


Medical solutions should be subject to medical experts.

Gods man, what a danger it is to society promoting such B.S.
Click to expand...

Like I showed in the CDC link, it HAS BEEN used to treat a coronavirus and medical professionals ARE using it and prescribing it. The fact that you disagree with those professionals, perhaps for political reasons, is your problem.
 
Lutherf said:
Like I showed in the CDC link, it HAS BEEN used to treat a coronavirus and medical professionals ARE using it and prescribing it. The fact that you disagree with those professionals, perhaps for political reasons, is your problem.
Click to expand...
Where did I claim I disagree with medical experts? Keep it up Lutherf, trolling it up during a crisis.
 
Mach said:
Where did I claim I disagree with medical experts? Keep it up Lutherf, trolling it up during a crisis.
Click to expand...

Do you read what you yourself post or are you just copying random rants from across the internet and pasting them here?
 
JacksinPA said:
Fauci: no evidence anti-malaria drug pushed by Trump works against virus | World news | The Guardian

Trump urges Americans to try hydroxychloroquine

Donald Trump’s top coronavirus adviser has warned again that there is no scientific evidence to support the use of an unproven anti-malaria drug the president has been pushing as a possible remedy for Covid-19.

How science finally caught up with Trump's playbook – with millions of lives at stake

In White House briefings on Saturday and Sunday, Trump urged Americans worried about the virus to try hydroxychloroquine, a drug used to treat malaria, arthritis and lupus that has not been extensively tested for other conditions.

“Take it. What do you have to lose?” Trump said on Saturday, suggesting he might do so himself after asking “my doctors”.

On Sunday, Trump said America doesn’t have time “to take a couple years” to test the efficacy of the drug in treating Covid-19.
==============================================
Taking HC like Tylenol is about as good as playing the lottery.
Click to expand...

Dr. Fauci said no such thing. From the article:

“In terms of science, I don’t think we can definitively say it works,” he told CBS’s Face the Nation.

“The data are really just at best suggestive. There have been cases that show there may be an effect and there are others to show there’s no effect.”
Click to expand...

It is not "no evidence". It is anecdotal evidence by people who have taken it and started feeling better afterwards. But because clinical trials have not been performed, he cannot say definitively whether or not it is an effective treatment. But that is not the same thing as "no evidence."
 
Look what happened the last time Trump said, “what in the hell do you have to lose?”




/thread
 
ElChupacabra said:
I'm all for exploring options, but unless doctors prescribing this treatment is conducting a study, then it will be for naught from a testing perspective. In a controlled test environment would requiring something more stringent and controlled than prescribing it to people with a variety of health conditions (or lack there of). I'm eager for someone to develop a treatment because it will help opening up the country in a controlled fashion.
Click to expand...

If I recall correctly, there are conflicting results as well, as to the effectiveness of the drug fighting Covid. The other issue is that this drug is used for other diseases that it is approved for and if we make a run on this drug it could impact others who have diseases that require this medication.

That being said, it does seem that there is enough to warrant actual studies into the effectiveness of this in fighting covid infections. It would be nice to have a possible treatment for this that could help alleviate some of the strain on the People and the healthcare system. It's a little irresponsible for Trump to be touting this as a treatment now, I think he's just searching for something to bail him out of the hole he dug. But if this can be used, it should be properly studied and we should find out if it really does work and can be used.
 
Felis Leo said:
Dr. Fauci said no such thing. From the article:



It is not "no evidence". It is anecdotal evidence by people who have taken it and started feeling better afterwards. But because clinical trials have not been performed, he cannot say definitively whether or not it is an effective treatment. But that is not the same thing as "no evidence."
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Fauci is coming from the extreme side of clinical science where one makes no determination until a tested and verifiable determination can be made.

Trump is coming from the standpoint of, "Other people are trying it and we aren't seeing patients explode on the street so why not give it a shot"

Medical experts around the world have been providing their own opinions which cover the full spectrum from Fauci to Trump.

The idea that a medical option should be discounted merely because Trump supports it is asinine and, frankly, every bit as dangerous as gloming on to it merely because Trump says he likes the concept. This virus IS NOT about Donald Trump and people that view it through a Trump filter, either positive or negative, are ****ing idiots.
 
Last edited:
Felis Leo said:
Dr. Fauci said no such thing. From the article:

It is not "no evidence". It is anecdotal evidence by people who have taken it and started feeling better afterwards. But because clinical trials have not been performed, he cannot say definitively whether or not it is an effective treatment. But that is not the same thing as "no evidence."
Click to expand...
There is no significant evident of efficacy to treat CV19. Who do you think didn't mean that, when they typed no evidence?
Of course it's an interesting candidate for testing, it's an anti-malarial and various countries have reported anecdotal claims about how it helps.

But there is no clinically significant..or scientifically significant evidence that it is efficacious when treating CV19.

You're splitting hairs on this, on the wrong side.

Many drugs are being tested, and we hope any/all of them are wildly effective. That Trump chose to promote one, magnified by right wing media, has caused disruptions in physician treatment protocols, has apparently resulted in at least one death, and at best has confused the public, put a run on people who really need the drug for effective treatment of lupus, etc.

It's public malpractice at a scale the nation has never seen in modern times. why defend it in any way. EVEN IF IT DOES work later, that will never change that it was wrong to do what he did, how he did it.
 
Lutherf said:
Exactly.

Fauci is coming from the extreme side of clinical science where one makes no determination until a tested and verifiable determination can be made.

Trump is coming from the standpoint of, "Other people are trying it and we aren't seeing patients explode on the street so why not give it a shot"

Medical experts around the world have been providing their own opinions which cover the full spectrumfrom Fauci to Trump.

The idea that a medical option should be discounted merely because Trump supports it is asinine and, frankly, every bit as dangerous as gloming on to it merely because Trump says he likes the concept. This virus IS NOT about Donald Trump and people that view it through a Trump filter, either positive or negative, are ****ing idiots.
Click to expand...

Well ya know... It IS an election year.
And Trump's enemies must do what central command, their comrades from the DNC demands that they do.

Propagandize, twist and hyperbolize every syllable that the president speaks...
 
Mach said:
There is no significant evident of efficacy to treat CV19. Who do you think didn't mean that, when they typed no evidence?
Of course it's an interesting candidate for testing, it's an anti-malarial and various countries have reported anecdotal claims about how it helps.

But there is no clinically significant..or scientifically significant evidence that it is efficacious when treating CV19.

You're splitting hairs on this, on the wrong side.

Many drugs are being tested, and we hope any/all of them are wildly effective. That Trump chose to promote one, magnified by right wing media, has caused disruptions in physician treatment protocols, has apparently resulted in at least one death, and at best has confused the public, put a run on people who really need the drug for effective treatment of lupus, etc.

It's public malpractice at a scale the nation has never seen in modern times. why defend it in any way. EVEN IF IT DOES work later, that will never change that it was wrong to do what he did, how he did it.
Click to expand...

It certainly is irresponsible for him to make sweeping statements about non-clinically tested drugs for a particular virus. But do you think Doctors who are prescribing the hydroxychloroquine and the antibiotic azithromycin combinations for treatment of their patients with COVID-19 should be declared quack doctors and stripped of their licenses to practice medicine because of the lack of clinical trials of these drugs in relation to COVID-19?
 
Last edited:
trixare4kids said:
Well ya know... It IS an election year.
And Trump's enemies must do what central command, their comrades from the DNC demands that they do.

Propagandize, twist and hyperbolize every syllable that the president speaks...
Click to expand...

And that behavior is EXACTLY why we need to restore power to the states.
 
Mach said:
Which means doctors don't know. You don't know. Trump doesn't know.
If you don't know, be quiet.


Absurd. He's likely already caused harm to people as a result of his public championing of taking a drug that has now clinically demonstrated efficacy, and that has other side effects when given with the other drugs used to treat CV19 right now.
Additionally, tons of people are now harassing their physicians for this and zpacks, and its disrupting the medical treatment protocols.

That's why not-a-doctor Trump, should let doctors treat patients. They all have access to what treatments are being tried, and that show promise around the world. Leave that decision to the experts.

But we all know Trump did this for some other purpose...likely as you say, an irresponsible roll of the dice. If he's wrong, he tried. If he's right, he can say he's the savior.

Shame on you all.
Click to expand...

So, if it doesn't work he gets blame for (supposed) deaths, but if it does work he gets no credit for raising awareness by repeating the media stories that it might work. OK. Seems entirely reasonable.
 
Sizzle said:
Trump minions always want to have it both ways.
If it fails to work it will be "well he tried". If it works, it will be, "see, I saved thousands of lives".

Just let the medical professionals do their job and stop angling for Trump kudos.
Click to expand...

That's what many medical pros are doing... By prescribing it to (potentially) save lives. Yet, democrat governors are getting in the way of the doctors job by threatening the doctors or outright banning the drug they want to prescribe to treat coronavirus.

Those left wing minions always want it both ways. A medical decision should be between a patient and a doctor.. Until the doctors try to save lives by prescribing drugs for off label purposes that might potentially get in the way of more coronavirus deaths that might make Trump look worse. Yes, I can be as hyperbolic as you.
 
buck said:
So, if it doesn't work he gets blame for (supposed) deaths, but if it does work he gets no credit for raising awareness by repeating the media stories that it might work. OK. Seems entirely reasonable.
Click to expand...

Why would Trump get credit for promoting it when it was already being used around the world and clinical trials around the world were popping up for it, etc?
Credit for it? The medical community gets credit...the patients who volunteered to be part of the study...the original developers, the countries around the world that are also testing it.

The idea that Trump "gets credit" is too stupid for words.
 
Lutherf said:
Exactly.

Fauci is coming from the extreme side of clinical science where one makes no determination until a tested and verifiable determination can be made.

Trump is coming from the standpoint of, "Other people are trying it and we aren't seeing patients explode on the street so why not give it a shot"

Medical experts around the world have been providing their own opinions which cover the full spectrum from Fauci to Trump.

The idea that a medical option should be discounted merely because Trump supports it is asinine and, frankly, every bit as dangerous as gloming on to it merely because Trump says he likes the concept. This virus IS NOT about Donald Trump and people that view it through a Trump filter, either positive or negative, are ****ing idiots.
Click to expand...

The left is now invested in this drug not working because they cant allow Trump to be right about something. Theyre deranged.
 
Fletch said:
The left is now invested in this drug not working because they cant allow Trump to be right about something. Theyre deranged.
Click to expand...

It is more about thorough studies being done.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom