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In Britain's Triage System, Fear That ˜Terrible Decisions Could Be Made"

BlueTex said:
Post #43 in this thread... Did you not mean that they would actually pay or are you going with some they are indirectly paying BS?
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That comment doesn't exist in post 43.
 
PoS said:
In Britain’s Triage System, Fear That ‘Terrible Decisions Could Be Made’ - The New York Times





Socialized medicine = triage.
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American medicine = triage too. And here it will also be WORSE because Trump refuses to let FEMA manage the allocation of available ventilators according to need. Ventilators will be in storage or idle in many areas while doctors in hard hit hospitals will be making difficult decisions on who lives and dies. Trump is an incompetent moron who will cause more Americans to die needlessly. It will be the biggest scandal in American medical history. Trump should burn in hell for this.

(CNN)With the peak of Covid-19 infections still ahead and medical supplies still scarce, hospitals and physicians are gearing up for a nearly impossible challenge: deciding who gets a life-saving ventilator and who doesn't.
"Physicians who work in parts of the world that don't have adequate resources have had to make decisions like this maybe even on a routine basis, but physicians in the United States have never faced anything like this before," said Dr. Robert Truog, director of the Center for Bioethics at Harvard Medical School. "It is going to be extremely difficult."
If the current rate of hospitalization and intubation continues in New York, "we have about six days" left of ventilators in the stockpile, Gov. Andrew Cuomo said during Thursday's coronavirus briefing.
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As coronavirus cases grow, hospitals adopt a system to rank patients for treatment - CNN
 
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PoS said:
Not every state is doing triage, so the lying one is you.
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Every hospital in the US does triage. Almost daily we hear of people having symptoms, being deemed not serious enough to be admitted and then dying several days later.
 
iguanaman said:
American medicine = triage too. And here it will also be WORSE because Trump refuses to let FEMA manage the allocation of available ventilators according to need. Ventilators will be in storage or idle in many areas while doctors in hard hit hospitals will be making difficult decisions on who lives and dies. Trump is an incompetent moron who will cause more Americans to die needlessly. It will be the biggest scandal in American medical history. Trump should burn in hell for this.



As coronavirus cases grow, hospitals adopt a system to rank patients for treatment - CNN
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If you have the virus,you have to be hoping that your governor is in Trump's good books ATM so you at least have a chance at a ventilator!
 
apdst said:
Like I said, "as soon as possible". You get "as soon as possible". Right?
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I do, but there's a clear distinction between turning things on and expecting them to be as they were and what the new reality will be if there's no treatment or cure. Businesses impacted by the virus won't just magically rebound if consumer confidence isn't there.
 
JANFU said:
What is it called when NY State has to implement strict triage?
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It was a silly premise to begin with. The impact of the virus is beyond what most medical systems are prepared to handle; which is more about preparedness than it is about how healthcare is paid for.
 
ElChupacabra said:
It was a silly premise to begin with. The impact of the virus is beyond what most medical systems are prepared to handle; which is more about preparedness than it is about how healthcare is paid for.
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Yes, well aware.

Amazing how so many do not see what is coming.
 
Manc Skipper said:
If you have the virus,you have to be hoping that your governor is in Trump's good books ATM so you at least have a chance at a ventilator!
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Yes, But Trump's brown nosing Governors are clueless idiots like he is . So I'm not reassured here in Florida.
 
Lutherf said:
You might notice that when the government makes these decisions it's all good. If an insurance company were to make the same decision, however...
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Before the ACA insurance companies certainly made the decisions about pre-existing conditions and denying coverage is just like triage. Only it is not because triage is out of necessity not greed.
 
Grand Mal said:
States ARE your government. We get reminded that every time the subject of mandated measures comes up. You have nowhere to stand here. Does your fed even have the authority to dictate that kind of policy? If not, well, you might want to go easy on the words "lies and deception".
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States are local government, not national, so you need to work on your knowledge there, pal.
Mr Person said:
Now this is too funny. First you attack socialized medicine for what you call "triage". It is shown to be a massive fail (or lie), since privatized hospitals are doing it too. Then you try to move the goal post to every state doing it, but that is also shown to be a very stupid and dishonest thing to say. States aren't running privatized hospitals, and whether or not every hospital in every state does it has nothing to do with your OP being an idiotic attempt to attack "socialized medicine". So now - get this - now, even though we have privatized medicine here in America, you are trying to claim that actually the states don't matter and only the federal government having triage matters. You're trying to put a soccer goal on a chessboard and declaring victory. EXCEPT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CANNOT HAVE TRIAGE BECAUSE IT IS NOT THE ONE RUNNING THE PRIVATIZED HOSPITALS. You know. In the same way state governments aren't. Because "privatized", remember? You either told a very stupid lie, or you made a very stupid mistake. Instead of saying "oops", you just keep doubling down. It's beyond stupid.
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The only one moving goalposts is you. The Fed gov hasnt mandated triage, so its not a nationwide policy, unlike socialized HC in Europe. Its called Federalism, something you know nothing about. You really ought to limit your participation downstairs.
 
PoS said:
States are local government, not national, so you need to work on your knowledge there, pal. The only one moving goalposts is you. The Fed gov hasnt mandated triage, so its not a nationwide policy, unlike socialized HC in Europe. Its called Federalism, something you know nothing about. You really ought to limit your participation downstairs.
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You say that like you really believe it would be a bad thing for us to have a Federal triage policy. Frankly, it would be comforting knowing that all the hospitals are on the same page, following the same guidelines. When the resources run out, we need a plan.
 
PoS said:
In Britain’s Triage System, Fear That ‘Terrible Decisions Could Be Made’ - The New York Times





Socialized medicine = triage.
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swing_voter said:
Free health care only works when you put caps on treatment.

Sometimes you'll read that American health care is more expensive than free health care. That's because in America we're willing to spend $500,000 to keep someone alive another week.
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You both forget that in America tens of millions of Americans get no healthcare at all and tens of millions can't afford the healthcare they really need. America has the most rationed healthcare system on the planet and it's divided up on who has the most money.

America has literal death panels at insurance agencies where they get to decide who lives and dies based in profitability, not in who has the best chance of surviving. Dishonest thread fail.
 
PoS said:
States are local government, not national, so you need to work on your knowledge there, pal. The only one moving goalposts is you. The Fed gov hasnt mandated triage, so its not a nationwide policy, unlike socialized HC in Europe. Its called Federalism, something you know nothing about. You really ought to limit your participation downstairs.
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The UK government hasn't mandated triage. That will be down to doctors or local health trusts.
 
PoS said:
In Britain’s Triage System, Fear That ‘Terrible Decisions Could Be Made’ - The New York Times





Socialized medicine = triage.
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If you think that doesn’t happen in the US, you either have never required major health care, or you just don’t know what you’re taking about.

If you aren’t retired, the insurance company your boss picked for you makes that decision. And you have no say in it at all.

In the UK, the National Health is as public agency. If the public thinks the NHS should spend more, they have the power to change that policy. And since the management and policies of the National Health are regular new items, and people keep up with it, they have the power to do so.

You don’t. You get what the insurance company says you can have.
 
TomFitz said:
If you think that doesn’t happen in the US, you either have never required major health care, or you just don’t know what you’re taking about.

If you aren’t retired, the insurance company your boss picked for you makes that decision. And you have no say in it at all.

In the UK, the National Health is as public agency. If the public thinks the NHS should spend more, they have the power to change that policy. And since the management and policies of the National Health are regular new items, and people keep up with it, they have the power to do so.

You don’t. You get what the insurance company says you can have.
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This has always been the point advocates of our healthcare status quo seem to forget when they talk about freedom of choice and keeping their doctors. The choice is a controlled one, where you're choosing from doctors in your provider's network. If you really like your doctor then changing jobs includes determining if your potential new employer has a plan which includes your doctor.
 
ElChupacabra said:
This has always been the point advocates of our healthcare status quo seem to forget when they talk about freedom of choice and keeping their doctors. The choice is a controlled one, where you're choosing from doctors in your provider's network. If you really like your doctor then changing jobs includes determining if your potential new employer has a plan which includes your doctor.
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Depends on how good your health insurance is.
 
iguanaman said:
Before the ACA insurance companies certainly made the decisions about pre-existing conditions and denying coverage is just like triage. Only it is not because triage is out of necessity not greed.
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Triage is literally about sorting out those with the best chance of survival from those who don't. Somehow that's wrong when done by medics, but fine when done by back-office bean-counters.
 
swing_voter said:
Free health care only works when you put caps on treatment. Sometimes you'll read that American health care is more expensive than free health care. That's because in America we're willing to spend $500,000 to keep someone alive another week.
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And deny life saving healthcare treatments if the insurance doesn't cover it. Our privatized donor system triages patients all the time. Triage is a medical fact of life in all systems...

Our healthcare system is the most expensive per outcome, no question... not arguing with you, just adding some garnish... :peace
 
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