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Pastor again defies state order not to hold large gatherings. He says 1,000 people came to his churc

swing_voter said:
He can do a YouTube video that everyone can watch from home.

His followers aren't exactly the brightest bulbs either. They don't have to show up.
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It is hard to get the collection plates filled if they are all sitting at home. With a 1,000 attendance that must produce a good amount of money.

It is all about the money, always has and always will.
 
Crosscheck said:
It is hard to get the collection plates filled if they are all sitting at home. With a 1,000 attendance that must produce a good amount of money.

It is all about the money, always has and always will.
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That is exactly what the issue is...
 
ttwtt78640 said:
He actually has a point - why is a mattress store allowed to remain open, but a church and barber shop ordered to close? He has not ordered any of his "flock" to violate "social distancing" - they are quite free not to go out and attend his church just as they are free not go out to shop for a new mattress.
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Most businesses (not all) are at least making an effort to keep patrons separated by 6 feet. I doubt if the pastor has tried to keep the attendees separated.
 
PirateMk1 said:
I believe he is correct. Until ALL are shut down then quite frankly he has the right to claim he is essential. They are still keeping roofing and construction open along with the people who make the granite counter tops. How the **** is a granite counter top essential?? I bring this up because I have been turning down loads of that sort of stuff. A lot of factories are still open. So how come everyone is on his ass? I dont see much reduction in traffic, people are still out, in California. If there is a lock down not too many people are following it. How many people are concurrently in your local grocery store or Walmart right now.
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To be fair, I live in the east bay of the SF area and here traffic is WAY DOWN - its a damn pleasure to drive even during rush hour (which is no longer clogged). Moreover, most retail stores are either closed or, if they are restaurants, only provide takeout. The markets are still barren (although a little less so) and shopping is light to very light.

Frankly its getting depressing of not getting out because there is nowhere to go - but other than to see a friend or two, that's what we are limited to (unless you work in one of the essential businesses). It's almost dystopian to see vast empty parking lots.

The preacher may or may not be correct in his state and circumstance - that is debatable. But it would be a mistake to believe that others are not obeying orders and taking a least risk strategy - I am, as are all my friends and associates.
 
Elvira said:
There are other ways to conduct meetings, such as Zoom...my congregation has missed one meeting since this mess started, only one, while the brothers were trying to get Zoom set up...
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You miss the point he made and I am making, why is he being singled out, when you have a whole boatload of others violating the same measures, or at least the spirit of those measures.
 
maxparrish said:
To be fair, I live in the east bay of the SF area and here traffic is WAY DOWN - its a damn pleasure to drive even during rush hour (which is no longer clogged). Moreover, most retail stores are either closed or, if they are restaurants, only provide takeout. The markets are still barren (although a little less so) and shopping is light to very light.

Frankly its getting depressing of not getting out - but other than to see a friend or two, that's what we are limited to (unless you work in one of the essential businesses).

The preacher may or may not be correct in his state and circumstance - that is debatable. But it would be a mistake to believe that others are not obeying orders and taking a least risk strategy - I am, as are all my friends and associates.
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I just went through Sacramento Stockton and Fresno and Bakersfield coming from Tacoma. While traffic was lighter it was still out and pretty heavy. Plenty of people are out and about.
 
CaughtInThe said:
just selfish and political.


what are the chances that not one person in his congregation dies from the virus? 50/50?
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Here in WA St, 2 hrs from Seattle, on March 10 there was a community meeting of 56 people. 2 weeks later 40+ people had tested positive for CV and 10 were actively sick.
 
PirateMk1 said:
Have you read the guidelines? I have. Part of my job to ship stuff. How is a majority of construction essential?
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Are we done with mattresses?

We're 1 - 0 and I haven't read the guidelines. Instead of personal interpretation, I gather stats from relevant sources so as to see a picture of the professional consensus.

We could do it your way. I could claim to have read the whole thing four times and my interpretation disagrees with yours.

Or... We can reason how construction could be so construed. Or... We can claim nothing makes sense in a world of madness and strife, and ours is only to be a victim. But I'm not actually willing to engage in the latter
 
Elvira said:
There are other ways to conduct meetings, such as Zoom...my congregation has missed one meeting since this mess started, only one, while the brothers were trying to get Zoom set up...
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That's much too modern for people locked mentally & emotionally in the Middle Ages.
 
PirateMk1 said:
I believe he is correct. Until ALL are shut down then quite frankly he has the right to claim he is essential. They are still keeping roofing and construction open along with the people who make the granite counter tops. How the **** is a granite counter top essential?? I bring this up because I have been turning down loads of that sort of stuff. A lot of factories are still open. So how come everyone is on his ass? I dont see much reduction in traffic, people are still out, in California. If there is a lock down not too many people are following it. How many people are concurrently in your local grocery store or Walmart right now.
Click to expand...

There are people that are following social distancing guidelines, and then you have those that are not; whether by stupidity, arrogance, ignorance, or a mix of all three. Morons are still attempting to hold large gatherings, like parties and such (not at grocery stores, because people need to get food), when it's clear that it's about the dumbest thing you can do in this situation. Same thing goes for this situation. Holding large gatherings like this is irresponsible--hands down.
 
maxparrish said:
To be fair, I live in the east bay of the SF area and here traffic is WAY DOWN - its a damn pleasure to drive even during rush hour (which is no longer clogged). Moreover, most retail stores are either closed or, if they are restaurants, only provide takeout. The markets are still barren (although a little less so) and shopping is light to very light.

Frankly its getting depressing of not getting out because there is nowhere to go - but other than to see a friend or two, that's what we are limited to (unless you work in one of the essential businesses). It's almost dystopian to see vast empty parking lots.

The preacher may or may not be correct in his state and circumstance - that is debatable. But it would be a mistake to believe that others are not obeying orders and taking a least risk strategy - I am, as are all my friends and associates.
Click to expand...

I am in the SFBA as well. At the worst...the very worst, the traffic is Sunday morning light. I have to stop myself from turning a 15 minute commute at speed limit into a 8 minute commute on the "open road". :lamo
 
ttwtt78640 said:
He actually has a point - why is a mattress store allowed to remain open, but a church and barber shop ordered to close? He has not ordered any of his "flock" to violate "social distancing" - they are quite free not to go out and attend his church just as they are free not go out to shop for a new mattress.
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Pot shops and laundramats are open here.

Pot shots are considered medicinal even tho recreational pot is legal here.

And I can see how some people would need laundromats, but 'necessary' in this crisis? Hmm.
 
year2late said:
I am in the SFBA as well. At the worst...the very worst, the traffic is Sunday morning light. I have to stop myself from turning a 15 minute commute at speed limit into a 8 minute commute on the "open road". :lamo
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I haven't left my neighborhood very much since the shelter-in-place-order, but it's been pretty light on traffic over here, more so than it usually is.
 
ecofarm said:
Are we done with mattresses?

We're 1 - 0 and I haven't read the guidelines. Instead of personal interpretation, I gather stats from relevant sources so as to see a picture of the professional consensus.

We could do it your way. I could claim to have read the whole thing four times and my interpretation disagrees with yours.

Or... We can reason how construction could be so construed. Or... We can claim nothing makes sense in a world of madness and strife, and ours is only to be a victim. But I'm not actually willing to engage in the latter
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What the **** does a mattress have to do with anything and why did you cut my post? Apparently you want to be a disingenuous. Do yourself a favor and not engage.
 
PirateMk1 said:
You miss the point he made and I am making, why is he being singled out, when you have a whole boatload of others violating the same measures, or at least the spirit of those measures.
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So? Who cares? Do what is best for your congregation...
 
ttwtt78640 said:
He actually has a point - why is a mattress store allowed to remain open, but a church and barber shop ordered to close? He has not ordered any of his "flock" to violate "social distancing" - they are quite free not to go out and attend his church just as they are free not go out to shop for a new mattress.
Click to expand...

There's a substantial and important difference between 2 or 3 customers in a store shopping for a mattress, and 1,000 individuals seated on top of each other for an hour or more in church.

And a barber shop or other similar service requires direct and close contact for a long period of time between the person in the chair and the barber, hair dresser, nails person, etc.

Yes, no one is forcing these morons to gather in a group of 1,000, but unfortunately there's no known way to keep those assholes separate from the rest of society. If there's an outbreak at the church, this action will kill others who didn't do stupid, reckless things.
 
Crosscheck said:
Most businesses (not all) are at least making an effort to keep patrons separated by 6 feet. I doubt if the pastor has tried to keep the attendees separated.
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That has nothing to do with the government deciding that a business (or, in this case, a non-profit service) is 'non-eesential'. The order was not "try to keep folks separated by X feet" it was to close completely. Many restaurants and bars would gladly serve 1/3 to 1/2 of their normal seating capacity to assist in "social distancing" - that was not an option.
 
TheGoverness said:
There are people that are following social distancing guidelines, and then you have those that are not; whether by stupidity, arrogance, ignorance, or a mix of all three. Morons are still attempting to hold large gatherings, like parties and such (not at grocery stores, because people need to get food), when it's clear that it's about the dumbest thing you can do in this situation. Same thing goes for this situation. Holding large gatherings like this is irresponsible--hands down.
Click to expand...

People need to get food, but they dont need to all be in the store at once, yet during a lockdown we let them why? Does the corona virus magically not infect people in a grocery store? Why are factories still open? Why are said factories still shipping? There's an awful lot of exceptions to this lock down.
 
Elvira said:
So? Who cares? Do what is best for your congregation...
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If you dont care about the others, why bust this guys balls?
 
JasperL said:
There's a substantial and important difference between 2 or 3 customers in a store shopping for a mattress, and 1,000 individuals seated on top of each other for an hour or more in church.

And a barber shop or other similar service requires direct and close contact for a long period of time between the person in the chair and the barber, hair dresser, nails person, etc.

Yes, no one is forcing these morons to gather in a group of 1,000, but unfortunately there's no known way to keep those assholes separate from the rest of society. If there's an outbreak at the church, this action will kill others who didn't do stupid, reckless things.
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Well since that ruling only applies to morons and assholes then I guess it's OK. ;)
 
maxparrish said:
To be fair, I live in the east bay of the SF area and here traffic is WAY DOWN - its a damn pleasure to drive even during rush hour (which is no longer clogged). Moreover, most retail stores are either closed or, if they are restaurants, only provide takeout. The markets are still barren (although a little less so) and shopping is light to very light.

Frankly its getting depressing of not getting out because there is nowhere to go - but other than to see a friend or two, that's what we are limited to (unless you work in one of the essential businesses). It's almost dystopian to see vast empty parking lots.

The preacher may or may not be correct in his state and circumstance - that is debatable. But it would be a mistake to believe that others are not obeying orders and taking a least risk strategy - I am, as are all my friends and associates.
Click to expand...

My brother is in San Diego and he reports the same thing. He's a physician so is working, and what used to take AT LEAST 70 minutes at 6pm on a Friday took him 14 minutes - as fast as he wanted to drive. His group had an active social life and they're all just staying home these days.
 
PirateMk1 said:
If you dont care about the others, why bust this guys balls?
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Because he gives Christians who are trying to do the right thing a bad name, he is giving God a bad name with his foolishness...not all Christians are like he is...

"Do nothing out of contentiousness or out of egotism, but with humility consider others superior to you, as you look out not only for your own interests, but also for the interests of others." Philippians 2:3,4
 
PirateMk1 said:
I just went through Sacramento Stockton and Fresno and Bakersfield coming from Tacoma. While traffic was lighter it was still out and pretty heavy. Plenty of people are out and about.
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Perhaps in-metropolitan traffic is much lighter than interstate freeway traffic. I wouldn't be going anywhere on I-5 unless it was to get out of the bay area and find someplace to hole up.
 
year2late said:
I am in the SFBA as well. At the worst...the very worst, the traffic is Sunday morning light. I have to stop myself from turning a 15 minute commute at speed limit into a 8 minute commute on the "open road". :lamo
Click to expand...

Exactly my experience. The last time I saw this was during the day without an immigrant strike.
 
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