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What should WE specifically do in your opinion?

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joko104

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We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down over 80% a few years ago because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect and provide for you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU? What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
 
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joko104 said:
We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down nearly 90% because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - likely the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
Click to expand...

There are people willing to risk their lives for selfish people like you who value money over their own wellbeing and that of others. They're called doctors, nurses, paramedics, fire service and police. This isn't about YOU but is about the physical health of an entire nation. If you don't provide an essential service then shut down, go home and stay there unless you have a genuine need (not 'want'), to go out.
 
I work for a label printer. Labels for canned goods, bottled goods, etc. Food and drink. Essential. We operate 24/7 and always have.

Since the outbreak, no one has been let into the building that hasn't already been there. One point of concern we have; a plant in New Orleans was recently closed, and we've "imported" equipment and personnel from the Louisiana plant. This happened before the outbreak (barely), but a few employees are now in New Orleans gathering their things for the move to Northern Nevada.

One manager told me our concerns are "being discussed." By that I hope he means testing before they're allowed to return.
 
The greatest generation, rationed just about every material that could possibly be used for the war effort, planted victory gardens, bought war bonds, enlisted in droves, made bandages, etc. Surely you can be inconvenienced for a month or so...
 
snakestretcher said:
There are people willing to risk their lives for selfish people like you who value money over their own wellbeing and that of others. They're called doctors, nurses, paramedics, fire service and police. This isn't about YOU but is about the physical health of an entire nation. If you don't provide an essential service then shut down, go home and stay there unless you have a genuine need (not 'want'), to go out.
Click to expand...

For your message, if there was a way I could block you receiving any safety or product availability (like food) to you from what we do, I would do it. Noting you didn't mention ANYTHING you are doing for anyone else, by your message your are one of those people who bites the hand that feeds you. No one who works in a grocery store should allow you to buy anything.
 
joko104 said:
We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down over 80% a few years ago because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect and provide for you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU? What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
Click to expand...

You have an obligation to not abandon your people.

If you can get the work done then you should get the work done, if you were not willing to do your best to forge on then you never should have been in the business.....just as the person who is unwilling to help fellow passengers should never accept a seat at the exit window.
 
BlueTex said:
The greatest generation, rationed just about every material that could possibly be used for the war effort, planted victory gardens, bought war bonds, enlisted in droves, made bandages, etc. Surely you can be inconvenienced for a month or so...
Click to expand...

If people should self quarantine, it is more than "inconvenience."

Curious how people on the forum furiously insist everyone should self quarantine, but fully expect everyone else to risk their health and life to provide for them. What are YOU doing to put yourself at covid-19 risk for other people. Anything?
 
Actually, there is another topic. What are YOU doing to help other people that puts you at any covid-19 risk? Or just looking out for yourself?

They need people making more meals-on-wheels deliveries to the elderly more than ever. They need more guardian ad litums for at risk children more than ever. They need people to deliver good to the homeless. Any of you doing anything like that?
 
joko104 said:
If people should self quarantine, it is more than "inconvenience."

Curious how people on the forum furiously insist everyone should self quarantine, but fully expect everyone else to risk their health and life to provide for them. What are YOU doing to put yourself at covid-19 risk for other people. Anything?
Click to expand...

Nobody has been ordered to self quarantine except those with confirmed exposure... Isolation is not quarantine...
 
joko104 said:
We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down over 80% a few years ago because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect and provide for you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU? What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
Click to expand...

We are staying open because we are building three public schools and one hospital extension. The owners of the schools and hospital have pull with the government and, in fact, are the government, and they do not want the construction delayed. But we have to have materials so the steel mills, supply houses, plumbers, electricians, brick masons, lumber yards, concrete companies and dozens of other businesses and their suppliers must remain open.

When everything is taken into account, there remains little doubt that maybe 80% of the country or more needs to stay open for the good of everyone, especially for the good of those fighting this virus more intimately in hospitals and clinics.
 
snakestretcher said:
There are people willing to risk their lives for selfish people like you who value money over their own wellbeing and that of others. They're called doctors, nurses, paramedics, fire service and police. This isn't about YOU but is about the physical health of an entire nation. If you don't provide an essential service then shut down, go home and stay there unless you have a genuine need (not 'want'), to go out.
Click to expand...
There are people willing to risk their lives for selfish people
Click to expand...

Yeah right

I know a nurse who is complaining about all the hours she must work

Cowgirl up!
 
Most businesses can not afford to stay closed for long without permanent financial ruin (though I don't really know how the stimulus works for truly small businesses). That is not our situation. We could close permanently and be just fine. Bur most businesses can't and many run on the edge - particularly small shopping strip stores all over everywhere. Some try to think of any reason to claim they are "essential," like a chocolate shop in Tampa on local news, refusing to close claiming chocolate is an essential of life because happiness is an essential of life - and not going broke is essential to the owner's life.
 
The stimulus package SHOULD have included supplemental pay to low paid employees are being put at risk to serve others - like stockers and clerks in grocery and WalMart store (but WalMart is making such a killing they should be paid more now anyway.)

Probably healthcare workers - from nursed to janitors - should be receiving matching pay from the government to double their salaries. Same for people who work in grocery stores.
 
Some companies like WalMart and grocery stores are making massive profits now - and are NOT passing this on to employees. Because so many people are out of work, they do not have a shortage of employees. There is something very wrong with that picture. I think it would be reasonable for the government to TEMPORARILY raise the minimum wage for healthcare workers, grocery store workers of large grocery chains etc. to force "share the wealth" - given it is the government that created this extreme profits for some companies by ordering their competition shut down (like shutting down restaurants and therefore upping grocery store sales).

If the government is going to use its power to make some companies extremely profit by shutting down their competition (regardless of motive), then the government should equally use its power to raise the minimum wage for those employees society now needs who are putting themselves risk for all of us - and to stop employer predatory practices towards employees by not sharing the wealth, another form of wrongful profit gouging in this national health situation.
 
joko104 said:
For your message, if there was a way I could block you receiving any safety or product availability (like food) to you from what we do, I would do it. Noting you didn't mention ANYTHING you are doing for anyone else, by your message your are one of those people who bites the hand that feeds you. No one who works in a grocery store should allow you to buy anything.
Click to expand...

What, you want me to brag about shopping for elderly neighbours? You are clueless mate. Completely.
 
joko104 said:
Actually, there is another topic. What are YOU doing to help other people that puts you at any covid-19 risk? Or just looking out for yourself?

They need people making more meals-on-wheels deliveries to the elderly more than ever. They need more guardian ad litums for at risk children more than ever. They need people to deliver good to the homeless. Any of you doing anything like that?
Click to expand...

Maybe we should be asking YOU what you're doing for your fellow citizens. Well...? As for me I'm 67 and in a high risk group, so I suggest you stfu and keep your worthless opinions and assumptions to yourself.
 
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joko104 said:
For your message, if there was a way I could block you receiving any safety or product availability (like food) to you from what we do, I would do it. Noting you didn't mention ANYTHING you are doing for anyone else, by your message your are one of those people who bites the hand that feeds you. No one who works in a grocery store should allow you to buy anything.
Click to expand...

For such a "selfless" person you sure seem to be pushing really hard for some kind of grand acknowledgement of the great "sacrifices" you are making...
 
joko104 said:
We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down over 80% a few years ago because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect and provide for you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU? What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
Click to expand...



“Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation”

Only you and your employees can answer this question

“Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU?”

Only you and your employees can answer this question

“What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?”

Some the same as you. Most rather limited, understanding walking out your door to get food for your family is taking a risk.

“You aren't taking any risks for us?”

How do you know? You must use something that people other than you are involved in that supply in some way.

“For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down?”

Only you and your employees can answer this question

“I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?”

Why is it that when the question of what others are doing you have doubt built into your question but when you explained your own doings it was you looking good?

“What would YOU do in our position?”

Already answered, and follow whatever the local and state guidelines are.

“would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones?”

Is your service a life-saving service? If that’s your profession, you already answered that when you took that step and otherwise have no such obligation. Unless those in such life-saving profession asked me to in order to directly save lives.
 
joko104 said:
We face a different question than most of you on this forum. We have a business that provides sterilizing and sanitizing chemicals to food processors at every level (chickens, livestock) and nearly every other level of food processing and packaging, plus clinics and doctor's offices, labs and water purification locations that can not use ordinary water safety chemicals. It is a niche market and there are few suppliers selling at our middle volume level - and we supply virtually all other companies that do on the wholesale/bulk level too. Literally we provide the inventory to our competitors, who tend to be smaller companies. Masks and gloves - which we have plenty of and circumstantially do use - generally would offer no protection. For example, gloves are just an layer of skin and when contaminated are contaminated the same as skin.

Our employees all then go home after work. Back and forth. We can not contaminate the chemicals, but certainly could contaminate packaging.

So what should we do? We ourselves rolled the business down over 80% a few years ago because we had made enough for a lifetime and we aren't Scrooge. When this hit (like a tidal wave in sales) we completely shut down all sales, taking about 10 days to just catch up, while we decided whether to just stay closed until this was open. But for ethical reasons socially and for employees opened it back up a bit - though are trying to restrict sales because otherwise it would be completely overwhelming.

So these questions:
1. Do we and our employees have any ethical obligation whatsoever to stay open to protect and provide for you? Many of our customers - including commercial - when into true panic when we shutdown as it was going to force them to shut down. Do we have a moral obligation to risk our health and life for YOU? What risks are you taking for me or anyone else?

2. We are not price gouging and for the most part did not raise prices $1 - though we likely could double or triple prices on some products. Would it be fair to charge prices that ultimately make YOU pay more for food etc - because at least we should be paid for risking our lives working for you. You aren't taking any risks for us? This of course would including passing on a good share of the extra profits to all employees.

3. For the sake of our safety and the employees, should we shut down? Is it everyone for themselves now - the position in real terms likely nearly all of you are taking. I doubt many of you are delivering food to the homeless and home bound elderly, are you?

What would YOU do in our position? There are many companies - particularly mom-pop businesses - that face this decision. So does every doctor's office, dentist, convenience store owner, auto repair shop, plumber, electrician etc etc. IF you were financially secure, would YOU provide needed services to people at the risk of your own life, employees lives and the lives of your loved ones? Most of you got to sleep in. I didn't.

This is a REAL question many business owners and their employees now face.
Click to expand...

I have not shut down I am still working(when I want)...I fear not the microbial army which seeks to dominate our species. Plus I want to be able to afford scoring some dabs.
 
snakestretcher said:
What, you want me to brag about shopping for elderly neighbours? You are clueless mate. Completely.
Click to expand...

Who is clueless is you. If you are doing so, you should state you are doing so and in doing so openly encourage others to also do the same.

Tells us more about what you are doing.
 
BlueTex said:
For such a "selfless" person you sure seem to be pushing really hard for some kind of grand acknowledgement of the great "sacrifices" you are making...
Click to expand...

He wants to make the rules because he is a Trump fan-boy.
 
joko104 said:
Who is clueless is you. If you are doing so, you should state you are doing so and in doing so openly encourage others to also do the same.

Tells us more about what you are doing.
Click to expand...

I already told you, in post #15. Now go away and count your important money.
 
joko104 said:
Who is clueless is you. If you are doing so, you should state you are doing so and in doing so openly encourage others to also do the same.

Tells us more about what you are doing.
Click to expand...

Why are you so panicked? Your state is one of the few left without a statewide stay at home order... You "only" have 4,950 confirmed cases and 60 deaths... Why so hysterical?
 
I'm posting between loading up printers for safety, shipping and instruction sheets. Another person is printing labeling. I tend to just be jumping on and off the forum in general... just reminded others to get ready as much as possible for the weekend tidal wave of shipping labels that will start coming from the office location in a couple of hours. People had been working double shifts for 10 days, we all really needed the weekend off - but now we all pay for it.
 
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Luther said:
Yeah right

I know a nurse who is complaining about all the hours she must work

Cowgirl up!
Click to expand...

She should be getting double pay.
 
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