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Trump looking to use COVID-19 crisis to punish blue states.

Checkerboard Strangler said:
One of Australia's biggest life insurers moves to cut off payouts to customers who die from COVID-19, including frontline doctors.
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Doh!

An internal document from insurer TAL, obtained by the ABC, reveals the company has begun adding an exclusion clause for the coronavirus in new insurance policies.​
 
Excon said:
Doh!

An internal document from insurer TAL, obtained by the ABC, reveals the company has begun adding an exclusion clause for the coronavirus in new insurance policies.​
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JesusPreExistingCondition.jpg
 
Hari Seldon said:
Its like everyone in a certain county or state is either blue or red. Simply ridiculous. The virus is spreading and its just a matter of time before it comes to a county, village, town near you. The hope is it will be stretched out over a longer period enabling the healthcare system to avoid choosing who lives and who dies.
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I'm not suggesting this is a good idea, it is just a description of the way the man thinks. He said it, out loud, this week and today. “It’s a two-way street,” Trump told Fox News on Tuesday. “They have to treat us well, also. They can’t say, ‘Oh, gee, we should get this, we should get that.’"

What he's too thick to understand (and has plenty of company) is that rural "red" communities are even less well equipped to deal with a spike of cases than "blue" cities. Those infections are going to slosh back and forth between red and blue counties no matter how much distance we try to employ. (I should note that I once worked for a rural ambulance service, so I know how under equipped and thinly staffed rural facilities are. In our hospital there were literally 3 doctors on staff, and one was in his 70s. In some counties, there is one deputy for every 200 square miles of territory.)
 
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Nap said:
That is practically what has been going on from the beginning. It is the blue states that have largely locked themselves up. I'm still going to work and see plenty of people going on as normal.

Edit: Also, those lock downs are self inflicted. Not sure why you are under the assumption Trump has done anything.
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With all respect though, and offering sincere thoughts for you & your community's safety, the infection has been starting from the areas of the country that experience the most international exposure and greatest population density. I suspect you're not in an initial growth area.

But that's not to be said the likely limited amount of infection in your neck of the woods will not soon grow to epidemic levels. You likely have carriers and infected in your community spreading the disease, but those infected today will not be fully apparent for several weeks or even at all if testing is not prevalent in your area. Reasonable social isolation can allow you to get a handle-on it now, even while testing is behind the curve.

But good luck in not having it in the way many of us do. I wish you the best.
 
NWRatCon said:
This is not some crazy conspiracy theory, this is established. How, you ask? They announced it today: Trump weighs plan to label counties by coronavirus "risk" level You remember that map Trump kept waving around after the election? That is his vision: identify the blue counties, and keep them shut down, and allow red counties to open up business.
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Where did this conspiracy theory come from? Out of your nasty anti-Trump head?
Where is the evidence he is targeting red states over blue states for quicker recovery?
Show us some proof.
What's wrong with gradually letting certain areas recover faster if the risk for Covid is low?
 
Nap said:
Blue counties are predominantly densely packed high population centers so of course "red" counties are going to have much lower risk. Mississippi never locked down in the first place.
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That makes sense. Lower risk counties should open up first.
 
NWRatCon said:
I'm not suggesting this is a good idea, it is just a description of the way the man thinks. He said it, out loud, this week and today. “It’s a two-way street,” Trump told Fox News on Tuesday. “They have to treat us well, also. They can’t say, ‘Oh, gee, we should get this, we should get that.’"

What he's too thick to understand (and has plenty of company) is that rural "red" communities are even less well equipped to deal with a spike of cases than "blue" cities. Those infections are going to slosh back and forth between red and blue counties no matter how much distance we try to employ.
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I couldn't agree more. Then you have these idiots like that Pastor in Louisiana just ignoring any kind of quarantine. Also people like mashy who think they are immune based on his religious and political beliefs.
 
Hari Seldon said:
Its like everyone in a certain county or state is either blue or red. Simply ridiculous. The virus is spreading and its just a matter of time before it comes to a county, village, town near you. The hope is it will be stretched out over a longer period enabling the healthcare system to avoid choosing who lives and who dies.
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The system (doctors) is already choosing who lives and who dies.
It would seem that the demographics of any county would be known.
There's nothing that says everyone has to go back to work if they are fearful of the virus.
You can't make people work if they fear for their lives.
 
NWRatCon said:
This is not some crazy conspiracy theory, this is established. How, you ask? They announced it today: Trump weighs plan to label counties by coronavirus "risk" level You remember that map Trump kept waving around after the election? That is his vision: identify the blue counties, and keep them shut down, and allow red counties to open up business.
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Really? This nonsense is a republican conspiracy? How is it that democrats want cities shut down to avoid risks but when Trump identifies those cities he is allegedly evil for supposedly wanting them shut down?
 
Chomsky said:
With all respect though, and offering sincere thoughts for you & your community's safety, the infection has been starting from the areas of the country that experience the most international exposure and greatest population density. I suspect you're not in an initial growth area.

But that's not to be said the likely limited amount of infection in your neck of the woods will not soon grow to epidemic levels. You likely have carriers and infected in your community spreading the disease, but those infected today will not be fully apparent for several weeks or even at all if testing is not prevalent in your area. Reasonable social isolation can allow you to get a handle-on it now, even while testing is behind the curve.

But good luck in not having it in the way many of us do. I wish you the best.
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Of course, I'm not saying anything like Red states are better than Blue states. Only that rural areas are naturally going to be lower risk than compared to major metropolitan areas. I don't see why that would be controversial. The main points I was trying to get across was that the conspiracy theory was ridiculous and the idea that Trump was to blame for blue states being locked down is rather ridiculous as that is being handled at the local level and Trump has no say in whether or not a state opens up or not, he can only encourage one way or the other.

Good luck to you and your family through all of this.
 
NWRatCon said:
I'm not suggesting this is a good idea, it is just a description of the way the man thinks. He said it, out loud, this week and today. “It’s a two-way street,” Trump told Fox News on Tuesday. “They have to treat us well, also. They can’t say, ‘Oh, gee, we should get this, we should get that.’"

What he's too thick to understand (and has plenty of company) is that rural "red" communities are even less well equipped to deal with a spike of cases than "blue" cities. Those infections are going to slosh back and forth between red and blue counties no matter how much distance we try to employ. (I should note that I once worked for a rural ambulance service, so I know how under equipped and thinly staffed rural facilities are. In our hospital there were literally 3 doctors on staff, and one was in his 70s. In some counties, there is one deputy for every 200 square miles of territory.)
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Just imagine the deals this greedy narcissist is making when doing foreign policy? Imagine what we're going to find-out when he's out of office? Even worse, imagine what we may never find-out!
 
Glowpun said:
Trump wants to keep the blue counties on its shelter in place while the red counties can go back to work. Well let me tell you what will HAPPEN. of course the blue counties will suffer some economic pains but they will stay alive, while the red counties will have a wider spread of the disease and more of them will die.
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Well, aren't you a ray of sunshine if this live or die era.
Have you already traveled to the future and seen the results of freeing up certain counties to resume normal operations?
And you have seen more Conservative die than Liberals?
What did it look like?
 
Nap said:
That is practically what has been going on from the beginning. It is the blue states that have largely locked themselves up. I'm still going to work and see plenty of people going on as normal.

Edit: Also, those lock downs are self inflicted. Not sure why you are under the assumption Trump has done anything.
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Anti-Trumpers are always looking for another way to criticize a president whose political life depends on how he leads the country out of this crisis. Let's bash Trump for trying to restore the country to normal economic activity.
That does a lot of good when people are dying in the hospitals.
 
jaypatriot said:
That makes sense. Lower risk counties should open up first.
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Of course, the whole point of the lockdown was to ease the strain on our healthcare system. Lower population areas will naturally be the first test cases to open things back up. Imagine getting New York back in order, then opening up prematurely and the state has a massive jump in cases again. Not a very smart way to get back on track.
 
Nap said:
He doesn't have the power to. Blue state lockdowns aren't because of Trump. All he has done is advise and the govenor of each state has made those decisions.
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People want to think that Trump is all powerful and he can wave his wizard wand and make things happen or cause people to die on command. Are people blind to where they don't see governors instituting shelter in place orders for people to follow under the pain of misdemeanor citations? Do people understand the meaning of 'states rights'?
 
Linc said:
Coward Cadet Bone Spurs runs to Sean ‘waterboard me’ Hannity and lies, blames, divides, ignores, refuses, and completely fails at his only responsibility, leading and taking care of his Nation.

It takes a republican to hold up the House vote tomorrow. It takes a complete asshole like trump to hold back desperately needed supplies from Blue states. Red state governors with a brain say it will take months.

temper tantrum trump continues to grand canyon our Nation, with cheap shots at Sleep Joe Biden, Obama, and Bush at his campaign rally presser. After dropping his bucket of ****, he cowardly leaves.
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How do you get to sleep at night after spitting all that Trump-hating bile wherever you go?
What if you are wrong about Trump slowly starting up the economy in a few weeks?
Will you then say, "Never mind", that was a good idea.?
 
jaypatriot said:
People want to think that Trump is all powerful and he can wave his wizard wand and make things happen or cause people to die on command. Are people blind to where they don't see governors instituting shelter in place orders for people to follow under the pain of misdemeanor citations? Do people understand the meaning of 'states rights'?
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Lol, they think the people having more power and control over those that directly govern them is racist. They prefer unelected bureaucrats a 1,000 miles away making decisions for how your local area should be ran even though only a few likely ever stepped foot in your state.
 
Fiddytree said:
People posting in this thread are why I distrust the average person.

Seriously, guys, you want to punish the red or blue states with dead bodies of all ages and medical conditions because they aren't on your team?

Piss off, you should be ashamed of yourselves, and I would say more, but apparently "civility" in this forum is about swear words rather than the consequences of ideas.
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The whole concept of picking red states over blue states is totally ridiculous to begin with.
What if the governor of a states declares that shelter-in-place rules are still in effect.?
That takes precedence over Trump declaring the economy is now open in certain places.
 
Nap said:
Of course, I'm not saying anything like Red states are better than Blue states.
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No, I know you aren't saying that at all. You've always struck me as a decent above-board guy.

Only that rural areas are naturally going to be lower risk than compared to major metropolitan areas. I don't see why that would be controversial.
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It's not controversial at all. I totally agree (for now).

I was simply trying to point-out the insidious nature of this thing, in that the numbers from tests today only tell the story of 2-3 weeks ago. Meaning I suspect you guys have carriers and infected in your area now, and their numbers are growing. Practicing reasonable social isolation now, can keep those unknown carriers isolated until you can get testing going to identify them and do contact tracing.

We've got over 2K infected in my metro area. We never knew we had them, until we just very recently got the testing going in earnest. Your situation may very well be similar, but on a much lower scale. Only a few, or not, they are out there infecting others if you're not doing social isolation, at least until you get substantive testing going.

The main points I was trying to get across was that the conspiracy theory was ridiculous and the idea that Trump was to blame for blue states being locked down is rather ridiculous as that is being handled at the local level and Trump has no say in whether or not a state opens up or not, he can only encourage one way or the other.
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Yeah, agreed. The states are making their own decisions here.
 
Chomsky said:
No, I know you aren't saying that at all. You've always struck me as a decent above-board guy.

It's not controversial at all. I totally agree (for now).

I was simply trying to point-out the insidious nature of this thing, in that the numbers from tests today only tell the story of 2-3 weeks ago. Meaning I suspect you guys have carriers and infected in your area now, and their numbers are growing. Practicing reasonable social isolation now, can keep those unknown carriers isolated until you can get testing going to identify them and do contact tracing.

We've got over 2K infected in my metro area. We never knew we had them, until we just very recently got the testing going in earnest. Your situation may very well be similar, but on a much lower scale. Only a few, or not, they are out there infecting others if you're not doing social isolation, at least until you get substantive testing going.

Yeah, agreed. The states are making their own decisions here.
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Oh, I fully understand. We currently have exponential growth here and as more tests get done that number is going to rise to the 1,000s. I hate it for many of the elderly here because they aren't even really trying to isolate and they above all should be hiding away at home. I couldn't believe all the older people at Walmart when I had to go pick up some groceries the other day.
 
Chomsky said:
Yeah, agreed. The states are making their own decisions here.
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I think there has been a serious misinterpretation of what the OP was addressing, but I am not particularly surprised. I may not have been entirely clear, either.

I don't think Trump has some magic wand (although I do believe he thinks he does) and can dictate (although he clearly would like to) which counties can and can't open up, but... He desperately wants to influence the process directly. Why counties? That doesn't make any epidemiological sense, or geographic sense, or resource sense... but it does make political sense. Who do you think came up with this idea? I/You know it wasn't the CDC, or the Surgeon General, or anyone with a lick of sense. There are a number of sycophantic Governors out there (De Santis, Reeves) who will follow whatever Trump proposes, even if it goes against the interests of their own State. There are even more local authorities who will do so. It's called a bully pulpit for a reason.

Moreover, there isn't anything conspiratorial about it. The administration has already taken numerous official actions to directly punish "blue" jurisdictions. It's not some kind of secret. This is just a continuation of that. As I said initially, "That is his vision: identify the blue counties, and keep them shut down, and allow red counties to open up business." He sees that as punishment because the only thing he cares about or thinks about is how to make money and who "likes" him. He couldn't give a **** about the welfare of people who won't vote for him anyway.
 
NWRatCon said:
I think there has been a serious misinterpretation of what the OP was addressing, but I am not particularly surprised. I may not have been entirely clear, either.

I don't think Trump has some magic wand (although I do believe he thinks he does) and can dictate (although he clearly would like to) which counties can and can't open up, but... He desperately wants to influence the process directly. Why counties? That doesn't make any epidemiological sense, or geographic sense, or resource sense... but it does make political sense. Who do you think came up with this idea? I/You know it wasn't the CDC, or the Surgeon General, or anyone with a lick of sense. There are a number of sycophantic Governors out there (De Santis, Reeves) who will follow whatever Trump proposes, even if it goes against the interests of their own State. There are even more local authorities who will do so. It's called a bully pulpit for a reason.

Moreover, there isn't anything conspiratorial about it. The administration has already taken numerous official actions to directly punish "blue" jurisdictions. It's not some kind of secret. This is just a continuation of that. As I said initially, "That is his vision: identify the blue counties, and keep them shut down, and allow red counties to open up business." He sees that as punishment because the only thing he cares about or thinks about is how to make money and who "likes" him. He couldn't give a **** about the welfare of people who won't vote for him anyway.
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You wrote: "There are a number of sycophantic Governors out there (De Santis, Reeves) who will follow whatever Trump proposes, even if it goes against the interests of their own State. There are even more local authorities who will do so. It's called a bully pulpit for a reason."

Do you think red state governors want to see people in their states die because not enough precautions were taken before opening up businesses? Do you believe they would follow Trump's suggestion only to watch their citizens get sick and die?
How stupid do you think they are? They have a political future too, you know.
 
NWRatCon said:
This is not some crazy conspiracy theory, this is established. How, you ask? They announced it today: Trump weighs plan to label counties by coronavirus "risk" level You remember that map Trump kept waving around after the election? That is his vision: identify the blue counties, and keep them shut down, and allow red counties to open up business.
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You democrats need to make up your minds. You bitch because he hasn't acted swiftly or strongly enough. Of course when he does you cry like the snow flake partisan hacks you are. Makes sense to indentify the worst hit counties, keep them sealed off as well as possible and provide them with the medical help they need to beat the virus. What fools you dems are.
 
jaypatriot said:
You wrote: "There are a number of sycophantic Governors out there (De Santis, Reeves) who will follow whatever Trump proposes, even if it goes against the interests of their own State. There are even more local authorities who will do so. It's called a bully pulpit for a reason."

Do you think red state governors want to see people in their states die because not enough precautions were taken before opening up businesses? Do you believe they would follow Trump's suggestion only to watch their citizens get sick and die?
How stupid do you think they are? They have a political future too, you know.
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A) Obviously, yes. Have you listened to either of them? Are you aware that Reeves actually countermanded local prophylactic measures for business, not safety, reasons? That De Santis refused to prevent overcrowding on beaches because of the revenue impact? B) I believe they are INCREDIBLY stupid. Worse, they are politically sick. They believe that they can only climb the political ladder by being utterly loyal to Trump. In some States that political calculation has been seen to be true (De Santis, Scott, Reeves...). Are you really that naive?
 
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