• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Is Swine Flu Man Made?

Councilman

DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Messages
4,454
Reaction score
1,657
Location
Riverside, County, CA.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
The speculation that this new variation in the Swine Flu is different in fact the new outbreak of swine flu is associated with a never-seen-before strain of influenza A virus that contains DNA similar to avian, swine and human viruses.(Source, Reuters, Via C2C)
During a meeting in 2005 plans were made between the U.S. and Canada to handle an outbreak of the H5N1 Bird Flu. You can read about the plan at ; “North American Plan for Avian and Pandemic Influenza,”
The question is was this Flu a naturally accruing mutation of the three types or was it weaponized in a lab and released into the population in Mexico as a way to get it started and spread widely before detection as a new strain? Supposition as to it's origins are coming from many sources as are the conspiracy theories. One of the usual sources for those Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind! .
As I posted on another thread there has long been a wish by some elite groups to see the world population reduced by over 6 billion souls.
Normally the H1N1 will kill about 35,000 in America and 500.000 world wide and yet this is being linked to Pandemic with less than 200 deaths and a weakened strain it seems is spreading from Mexico. Why this is could be that the farther from the initial source it gets the weaker it grows. However the speed of the spread is alarming, and that is in part the reason for the WHO coming out with it's warnings.
There is also some worry that missing vials of a live virus may be connected in some way as well. (Source
Dr. Gary Ridenour )
 
Last edited:
There are a variety of factors that when looked at can be construed to fit an assortment of circumstances that the author of a post wishes to present. Important when approaching this logically, one must be sure to avoid the speculation that will lead to argumentum ad ignorantiam. For example "The virus must be man-made due to it's complexity and the fact it has never been seen before."

You can relate a myriad of recent events with the purpose of tying them together in an effort to show what seems like regular occurrences are in fact separate events occurring with a 'man behind the current' orchestrating them for a broader purpose. Whether that purpose be NWO, restructuring of the U.S political system, or an effort to promote ones agendas.

Take a step back and realize there is a lot information regarding the decision making process the average person does not know, cares to know, and will never know that happens at varying levels of our government in times of crisis, but not limited to times of crisis. There also exists the problem of people thinking they know what happens but are largely mistaken and often misinformed about.

You could stretch a wide arrange of past events including but not limited to the following. Donald Rumsfeld's (I know he’s a favorite person to assign the role of villain around here, good thing it is not Cheney) involvement with Gilead Sciences, which is the biotech company that owns the patent on Tamiflu, the influenza remedy that's now in high demand and being distributed and production substantially increased. Thus that company stands to make a large amount of profit should the need arise to disperse courses of the inoculation come to substance. Anyone know if they are publicly traded?


Rumsfeld served as Gilead (Research)'s chairman from 1997 until he joined the Bush administration in 2001, and he still holds a Gilead stake valued at between $5 million and $25 million, according to federal financial disclosures filed by Rumsfeld.

Defense Secretary Rumsfeld sees growth in Gilead stake - Oct. 31, 2005

Add the conspiracy brew the fact that National Guard troops were already in the process of deploying to the U.S/Mexican border prior to the swine flu outbreak.

WASHINGTON — President Obama is considering a request by Gov. Rick Perry of Texas to deploy National Guard troops along the southern border to stop a devastating wave of violence from spilling into this country from Mexico. You can travel the conspiracy rabbit hole as far as you want in an attempt to find a correlation between the recent outbreak of violence in Mexico to the justification of sending troops there with their true purpose being to control the flow of citizens to inevitable attempt to cross the borders should the flu reach epidemic proportions in Mexico

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/14/us/politics/14border.html


The media's purported fear mongering to scare Americans in an effort to be able to push medical issues through Congress with as little resistance as possible. Hey it worked with the economy, who even noticed we monetized our debt? Or hey, it worked with the Patriot Act (the discussion of its validity and necessity is for another forum.)

A Wag-the-Dog type scenario can be presented. The list goes on and on.

All the above is an attempt to steer the discussion of conspiracy theories to a more acceptable and reputable platform. I've noticed a lot of smart people who post on this website across the threads and have also noticed the fact that most of them avoid this forum. A lot of good could occur from tangents that come from a logical discussion of the theories being presented.
 
Its just another scaremongering sensationalist scandal. I am unafraid.
 
I'm surprised we haven't had a mutated strain such as this before now. We were due. I don't think it's anything to freak out about though.
 
Swine flu is not man made, unless a man decided to have sex with a pig. That actually could apply to most musicians.

q. What is the difference between a musician and a pig?

a. A pig is not willing to stay up all night trying to get it on with a musician.

:mrgreen:
 
Probably not. If you're going to spend the time and effort to make something to wipe out Humanity, why make something that can be treated by existing drugs and that doesn't have a relatively high kill rate?

If I was out to kill you all, which I'm not saying I'm not :2wave:, I'd merge Ebola with the common cold with something to delay the onset of symptoms for two weeks.
 
I agree with much of what some of you have said here. However last night I heard no less than two doctors say on the radio say that having three different strains come together in a pig and mutate is virtually impossible in nature. They were Dr. Dean Adell and . Dr. Gary Ridenour.
I wonder why all the hype so early on when the yearly flu does all the damage it does with little notice.
 
It's Bush's fault.
 
If we take out the word "swine", we're left with "flu". Nothing new. Happens every year. Story over. Call me when it's serious.
 
Well it probably came from deplorable conditions where large masses of animals were shoved together. So in a factory farm sort of way maybe so.
 
Very Likely

Very likely, yes.
This is just basic science and history. It's silly when people throw people under the conspiracy bus for mentioning the obvious.
My reasoning is this:
1. We specifically recreated a pandemic flu strain that has similar behavior not long ago, by blending a cytokinetic storm virus, the Spanish flu, with other flues. Green Left - UNITED STATES: Military resurrects deadly flu virus and The Online NewsHour: Bird Flu: Spread of the H5N1 Strain | 1918 Flu Epidemic | PBS
2. The inter species characteristics are unusual in nature, and it just doesn't seem natural as this blend has never happened before in nature, nor is it likely a pig naturally got sick with two different flues from two different continents, and then got infected by two different bird flues, and then a human flu all at the same time. That's how these things combine, the host has to be sick with multiple agents at the same time for the vectors to link. There would be natural stepping stone outbreaks if it was natural.
3. The last couple outbreaks of similar prototypes and behaviors occurred around government and research bases. Swine Influenza A Outbreak, Fort Dix, NJ, 1976 | CDC EID and Previous Swine Flu Outbreak Originated At Fort Dix and Spanish Flu of 1918: Could It Happen Again? - ABC News
4. Researchers have been using pigs to blend avian and human flues, just like this one. http://www.libpubmedia.co.uk/MedJ-Issues/Issue-4/Ma.pdf and WHO | Avian influenza - update: Implications of H5N1 infections in pigs in China
4. The recreation of the Spanish Flu specifically used strands of other flues, combining the cytokinetic factors of the Spanish flu with pieces of other flues, and would behave and look just like this one.

To know all this, and not admit that it is more than likely man made would take too many rationalizations for me at this moment. Maybe I'll huddle into a corner later and try to convince myself we only designed a modified copy of Spanish Flu, it didn't do anything, and that a pig had sex with an international tourist pig, who had eaten a bird who also had their own flues, and they all did it with another bird, and then a human cut himself caring for the whole lot.
 
Last edited:
I'm going to be the first, to blame this on global warming. Its all because we aren't signatorys to the Kyoto Protocol.
 
And the Durban Converence and Bush Impeachnment!

Sure!
Let's blame it on becoming finally fully racist (including the liberals now) and neutering the Durban Conference on racism and the Democrats blocking any hope of reviewing the constitutional abuses of Bush.
We have many things to blame this on, but most of them are man made.
 
talloulou your claim to be a Conservative is exposed as false when you post a position that proves other wise. And you do it repeatedly. There is not now nor has there ever been any proof that the way animals are raised contributes in any way to the spread of pathogens in the general population of the world. Being a liberal you should embrace your true position and stop pretending to be a thinking individual. There is not now nor has there ever been any evidence that the way animals are raised promotes the transfer of animal pathogens to humans. Do some research before you make unsubstantiated claims. PETA is a message from God. It means Please Eat These Animals.
 
talloulou your claim to be a Conservative is exposed as false when you post a position that proves other wise. And you do it repeatedly. There is not now nor has there ever been any proof that the way animals are raised contributes in any way to the spread of pathogens in the general population of the world. Being a liberal you should embrace your true position and stop pretending to be a thinking individual. There is not now nor has there ever been any evidence that the way animals are raised promotes the transfer of animal pathogens to humans. Do some research before you make unsubstantiated claims. PETA is a message from God. It means Please Eat These Animals.

LOL at talloulou being called a liberal. The conservative movement ought to be embracing such well thought out and intelligent people like talloulou(who is pretty conservative) rather than trying to cast her as the opposition.
 
LOL at talloulou being called a liberal. The conservative movement ought to be embracing such well thought out and intelligent people like talloulou(who is pretty conservative) rather than trying to cast her as the opposition.

Why? Explain Your self.
 
talloulou your claim to be a Conservative is exposed as false when you post a position that proves other wise. And you do it repeatedly. There is not now nor has there ever been any proof that the way animals are raised contributes in any way to the spread of pathogens in the general population of the world. Being a liberal you should embrace your true position and stop pretending to be a thinking individual. There is not now nor has there ever been any evidence that the way animals are raised promotes the transfer of animal pathogens to humans. Do some research before you make unsubstantiated claims. PETA is a message from God. It means Please Eat These Animals.

It's almost certain that a US owned factory farm in Mexico is ground zero for swine flu.

The bolded part of your post is patently absurd and only believed by someone who has had a complete lobotomy.
 
Last edited:
alphieb - this comment caught my attention.

I'm surprised we haven't had a mutated strain such as this before now. We were due. I don't think it's anything to freak out about though.

In my part of the world we're still trying to work out what this is all about. Whats your thoughts when comparing swine flu to the avian / bird flu strain?

og.
 
Back
Top Bottom