• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Vaccines

I have not yet seen any of you provide scientific evidence that all vaccines are always safe for everyone. Or that most vaccines are mostly safe for most people, including infants.

We can see the vaccines are safe propaganda blasted all over the mainstream news sites. Are you going to automatically believe all propaganda? If yes, you are their ideal sucker. I mean citizen.
 
Good4Nothin said:
I have not yet seen any of you provide scientific evidence that all vaccines are always safe for everyone. Or that most vaccines are mostly safe for most people, including infants.

We can see the vaccines are safe propaganda blasted all over the mainstream news sites. Are you going to automatically believe all propaganda? If yes, you are their ideal sucker. I mean citizen.
Click to expand...

Nobody has said that vaccines are safe for everyone.
 
I understand measles is airborne, even gone with the wind:

Scarlett is widowed when Charles dies from a bout of pneumonia and measles while serving in the Confederate Army.
 
Good4Nothin said:
I have not yet seen any of you provide scientific evidence that all vaccines are always safe for everyone. Or that most vaccines are mostly safe for most people, including infants.

We can see the vaccines are safe propaganda blasted all over the mainstream news sites. Are you going to automatically believe all propaganda? If yes, you are their ideal sucker. I mean citizen.
Click to expand...

Still at it I see, peddling your anti-vaxer CT tripe.
 
The benefits of vaccines outweigh vastly the small risks.
 
zyzygy said:
The benefits of vaccines outweigh vastly the small risks.
Click to expand...

But you have not shown any evidence. You just believe the medical industry propaganda.

There might be things about vaccines that could be improved that would make them safer. But that won't ever happen as long as everyone is brainwashed into thinking they are fine as they are.
 
Good4Nothin said:
But you have not shown any evidence. You just believe the medical industry propaganda.

There might be things about vaccines that could be improved that would make them safer. But that won't ever happen as long as everyone is brainwashed into thinking they are fine as they are.
Click to expand...

You have yet to prove that it is propaganda. You are a typical conspiracy theory aficionado, using a term like brainwashed. You will be calling us sheeple next. I have posted evidence but you ignore it.
 
Good4Nothin said:
NIH Director Dr Bernadine Healy speaks to Sharyl Attkisson about autism susceptibility
Click to expand...

I mention her because in her later years she aligned herself with the anti-vaccine movement, so much so that the anti-vaccine crank blog Age of Autism named her its Person of the Year for 2008 and posted along with her death notice a video of her conspiracy-mongering about vaccines. In her time flirting with the anti-vaccine movement (and even seeming to embrace it at times), she parroted the same misinformation, the same pseudoscience, and the same nonsense that many anti-vaccine activists promoted. Worse, by doing so, she gave the imprimatur of her previous position as NIH director to that nonsense.
R.I.P. Bernadine Healy - RESPECTFUL INSOLENCE
 
Unfortunately, Dr. Healy's flirtation with the antivaccine movement has become more serious of late. Indeed, clearly J.B. Handley clearly views her as one of his own, given that Age of Autism named Healy its Person of the Year for 2008. If there's one virtually completely reliable indication that a scientist or physician is well on the way to becoming an antivaccine crank (or has already become one), it's being named Person of the Year by Age of Autism. It's like the Nobel Prize, Oscars, Pulitzer Prizes, and Congressional Medal of Freedom for antivaccine crankery and autism quackery all rolled into one. Here's a hint for Dr. Healy: Anyone whom J.B. Handley views as a hero has gone far, far down the antivaccine rabbit hole, whether she's acknowledged it or not, whether she even realizes it or not. Whether Dr. Healy will ever manage to find her way out of it or if she even wants to find her way back to the surface and sunlight, I don't know. What I do know is that her appearance with Jenny McCarthy and Jim Carrey was profoundly embarrassing. It's hard to believe that a former Director of the NIH can be so clueless. Worse, she doesn't even seem to be aware of the significance of this "award" or that she has become propaganda tool number two for the antivaccine movement. (Jenny McCarthy is propaganda tool number one.)

Bernadine Healy: Flirting with the anti-vaccine movement | ScienceBlogs
 
Quag said:
Posing links you googled buy havent read that often dont support your BS isn't research
Click to expand...

He seems to believe the title of any tosh that he finds on the net.
 
Bernadine Healy: new crank on the block

In addition to Healy inexplicably falling in line with the mercury militia, she uses the Hannah Poling case like a true believer. Despite the fact that the court in the Poling case in no way implicated a connection between vaccines and autism, she repeats the same canards as the rest of the anti-vaccine denialists.

But, hey, this is just one interview. Perhaps she was trying to make a different point and it just came out wrong.

Nope. She said exactly what she meant. Her US News article is right out of the mercury militia play book. And it doesn't stop there. She's pretty much anti-science when it comes to medicine in general.

She seems to think that evidence-based medicine, the scientific revolution that has saved so many lives, is some sort of fascism. And to top it off, the AAPS, the bizarre organization that seems to include every doctor that shows up on Quackwatch, likes her.

It's sad and embarrassing to see one of my colleagues get sucked into the pseudoscientific realm of medical denialism. But most of all, it's dangerous. She speaks from a position of authority, and people believe her. It makes our work that much harder and that much more important.

Bernadine Healy: new crank on the block | ScienceBlogs
 
Good4Nothin said:
But you have not shown any evidence. You just believe the medical industry propaganda.

There might be things about vaccines that could be improved that would make them safer. But that won't ever happen as long as everyone is brainwashed into thinking they are fine as they are.
Click to expand...

Actually, the evidence is all around you instead of being 6 feet under or suffering while getting there.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Lasting neuropathological changes in rat brain after intermittent neonatal administration of thimerosal. - PubMed - NCBI

"Lasting neuropathological changes in rat brain after intermittent neonatal administration of thimerosal."

"These findings document neurotoxic effects of thimerosal, at doses equivalent to those used in infant vaccines or higher, in developing rat brain, suggesting likely involvement of this mercurial in neurodevelopmental disorders."
Click to expand...
All mercury isn’t the same: Methylmercury vs. ethylmercury

Mercury is a naturally occurring element found in the earth's crust, air, soil and water. Since the earth's formation, volcanic eruptions, weathering of rocks and burning of coal have caused mercury to be released into the environment. Once released, certain types of bacteria in the environment can change mercury to methylmercury. Methylmercury makes its way through the food chain in fish, animals and humans. At high levels, it can be toxic to people.

Thimerosal contains a different form of mercury called ethylmercury. Studies comparing ethylmercury and methylmercury suggest that they are processed differently in the human body. Ethylmercury is broken down and excreted much more rapidly than methylmercury. Therefore, ethylmercury (the type of mercury in the influenza vaccine) is much less likely than methylmercury (the type of mercury in the environment) to accumulate in the body and cause harm.
Click to expand...
Vaccine Ingredients – Thimerosal | Children's Hospital of Philadelphia
 
An assessment of thimerosal use in childhood vaccines. - PubMed - NCBI

"Depending on the immunization schedule, vaccine formulation, and infant weight, cumulative exposure of infants to mercury from thimerosal during the first 6 months of life may exceed EPA guidelines."

"CONCLUSION:
Our review revealed no evidence of harm caused by doses of thimerosal in vaccines, except for local hypersensitivity reactions. However, some infants may be exposed to cumulative levels of mercury during the first 6 months of life that exceed EPA recommendations. Exposure of infants to mercury in vaccines can be reduced or eliminated by using products formulated without thimerosal as a preservative."
 
The mainstream medical authorities want to make sure parents get their kids vaccinated. They don't want epidemics of infectious diseases to occur as the result of too many unvaccinated children. That is understandable.

But their strategy for convincing people that vaccines are nothing to worry about is to lie. They don't want you to know that there is plenty of research showing vaccines can cause autoimmune and neurological problems.

Mainstream medical news doesn't question the authorities' statements about vaccine safety. And you don't question mainstream medical news.

People like Gorski and Novella ALWAYS take the side of the mainstream authorities. Maybe they know the truth, but are also concerned about making sure most children are vaccinated. They have very little respect for the general population, and they don't trust people to make intelligent decisions.

And it is true that parents can over-react to news about vaccine problems. No parent wants to take any chance on harming their children.

But lying and hiding the truth just encourages extremist conspiracy theories.
 
Good4Nothin said:
The mainstream medical authorities want to make sure parents get their kids vaccinated. They don't want epidemics of infectious diseases to occur as the result of too many unvaccinated children. That is understandable.

But their strategy for convincing people that vaccines are nothing to worry about is to lie. They don't want you to know that there is plenty of research showing vaccines can cause autoimmune and neurological problems.

Mainstream medical news doesn't question the authorities' statements about vaccine safety. And you don't question mainstream medical news.

People like Gorski and Novella ALWAYS take the side of the mainstream authorities. Maybe they know the truth, but are also concerned about making sure most children are vaccinated. They have very little respect for the general population, and they don't trust people to make intelligent decisions.

And it is true that parents can over-react to news about vaccine problems. No parent wants to take any chance on harming their children.

But lying and hiding the truth just encourages extremist conspiracy theories.
Click to expand...

And you buy into those absurd theories.
 
zyzygy said:
And you buy into those absurd theories.
Click to expand...

No I don't. I pay attention to the scientific research. I don't believe everything Gorski and Novella, and mainstream medical news, say about it.
 
And by the way, zyzygy, your comments are not relevant or interesting. You simply deny whatever I say. There is no value in trying to communicate with you.
 
Vaccines are safe. Proven through science.

What's not safe is the way we treat food. If anything food is the problem. Of course republicans want to keep deregulating, but at the end of it all, food is the issue. Not vaccines.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom