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Vaccines

Good4Nothin said:
Natural immunity is much better. It lasts a lifetime, while vaccine immunity is temporary.

Some vaccines may be helpful, some probably are not. But the whole problem is being ignored now. What medical researcher would dare to investigate vaccines?
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I suggest that you investigate vaccines.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Wakefield lied. He wasn't just discredited, he was struck off the Medical Register due to his egregious lies.
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Isn't that pretty much what they've done to Assange for his "lies"?
 
Thoreau72 said:
Isn't that pretty much what they've done to Assange for his "lies"?
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They can make an example of one person, so no one else will dare question or oppose.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Yes he was accused of that, by one person, a drug company advocate. You aren't skeptical at all?
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He was not accused by one person. He was investigated by a journalist (who’s ties to drug industry exist solely in your head) and the investigation showed blatant fraud, with his co-authors abandoning the paper and independent investigations that caused him to lose his medical license and become disgraced within the profession.
 
Threegoofs said:
He was not accused by one person. He was investigated by a journalist (who’s ties to drug industry exist solely in your head) and the investigation showed blatant fraud, with his co-authors abandoning the paper and independent investigations that caused him to lose his medical license and become disgraced within the profession.
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That is ONE side of the story. You have not bothered to look at the other side.

It's real easy to slander and discredit someone. Those are the kind of lies people almost always believe.
 
Good4Nothin said:
I understand the reason for vaccines. They supposedly prevent epidemics of infectious diseases, which used to be so destructive in the past. We seldom have these epidemics anymore in the US, and that is supposedly because of vaccines.

I am willing to go along with the assumption that vaccines can be helpful. I am NOT willing to go along with the medical industry pushing more and more vaccines. They do NOT have good evidence that this is safe or necessary.

Vaccine makers are not motivated to test well for safety, since they have no liability. We are so vaccine crazed now, that the government wants to make things easy for the drug companies, to make sure they continue making more and more vaccines. If they had liability, they might stop, supposedly.

And then of course there is the other side -- all the people who want to sue because they think their children were damaged. And the doctors and lawyers who want to profit from this.

You can't trust either side. Our government has teamed up with the big drug companies, that is obvious.

But there is also a sincere well-meaning belief in the wonder of vaccines.

Obviously the truth is not found in either extreme. The difficult and expensive work of controlled scientific studies is the only way to answer the questions. But they probably won't be done, since we already "know" vaccines are safe and effective. And any research that is done will be funded by drug companies, so they will always turn out favorably for the vaccines.

It has become very hard to find information in google that is skeptical of vaccines. That's because Big Tech is taking good care of us and making sure we don't get fake information. Or what they consider fake. Or what Big Tech and Big Drug and the US government don't want us to know.

Autism was a big controversy of course, because so many children got it after being vaccinated. But that could be a coincidence, a lot of coincidences. And parents are not medical experts so they know nothing about their own children.

Research has shown no connection between vaccines and autism. But you can make research show anything you want, practically.

There has been research showing a connection between vaccines and gastrointestinal problems, and between gastrointestinal problems and autism.

Those dots are easy enough to connect. Wakefield did that decades ago, but he was discredited. The drug companies didn't like his research.

So who knows. One thing I do know is I do not trust Big Drug or our nanny government and its Big Tech friends.
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Here we go... :roll:

Anti-vaxxers are nutters, who put their entire community at a greater than necessary risk. Vaccinations should be mandatory for anyone not caught in an allergy / side effect vulnerability screening process.

/thread.
 
Good4Nothin said:
That is ONE side of the story. You have not bothered to look at the other side.

It's real easy to slander and discredit someone. Those are the kind of lies people almost always believe.
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One side is that he's a fraud...the other is that he's an incompetent idiot. Which side do you believe?
 
My father was a doctor, so I'm very much in favor of vaccination.

That said, I am most suspicious of Big Pharma, and I think things have gotten out of hand.

When my children were vaccinated in the early 80s, there were just a few vaccines required.

My grandson just had his first vaccine, but my very informed daughter negotiated so that just a few of the several dozen vaccines required these days were administered.

I think there is something to the claims regarding autism. That is, it is not black or white, but numerous shades of gray.
 
Thoreau72 said:
My father was a doctor, so I'm very much in favor of vaccination.

That said, I am most suspicious of Big Pharma, and I think things have gotten out of hand.

When my children were vaccinated in the early 80s, there were just a few vaccines required.

My grandson just had his first vaccine, but my very informed daughter negotiated so that just a few of the several dozen vaccines required these days were administered.

I think there is something to the claims regarding autism. That is, it is not black or white, but numerous shades of gray.
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Several dozen vaccines are required where you're at?? Dang, you in the jungles of South America, or something? I think up here it's like 5? I agree, though, the schedule can be aggressive for some kids - but as your daughter found out, most doctors are more than willing to work with parents to come up with something that they are comfortable with, so long as the big ones are looked after.

There is absolutely nothing to the claims regarding autism. That is pure bunk.
 
OlNate said:
Several dozen vaccines are required where you're at?? Dang, you in the jungles of South America, or something? I think up here it's like 5? I agree, though, the schedule can be aggressive for some kids - but as your daughter found out, most doctors are more than willing to work with parents to come up with something that they are comfortable with, so long as the big ones are looked after.

There is absolutely nothing to the claims regarding autism. That is pure bunk.
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Or not.
 
Thoreau72 said:
My father was a doctor, so I'm very much in favor of vaccination.

That said, I am most suspicious of Big Pharma, and I think things have gotten out of hand.

When my children were vaccinated in the early 80s, there were just a few vaccines required.

My grandson just had his first vaccine, but my very informed daughter negotiated so that just a few of the several dozen vaccines required these days were administered.

I think there is something to the claims regarding autism. That is, it is not black or white, but numerous shades of gray.
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The reason there are more vaccines is that they are incredibly safe and incredibly effective.
 
Thoreau72 said:
My father was a doctor, so I'm very much in favor of vaccination.

That said, I am most suspicious of Big Pharma, and I think things have gotten out of hand.

When my children were vaccinated in the early 80s, there were just a few vaccines required.

My grandson just had his first vaccine, but my very informed daughter negotiated so that just a few of the several dozen vaccines required these days were administered.

I think there is something to the claims regarding autism. That is, it is not black or white, but numerous shades of gray.
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Yes, that has been my point.
 
Threegoofs said:
The reason there are more vaccines is that they are incredibly safe and incredibly effective.
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Yes, the idea that they are ALL entirely safe and effective is INCREDIBLE.
 
Wakefield discovered the connection between GI problems and autism. Now that is generally accepted, as research on gut bacteria has advanced.

Some research has found connections between vaccines and GI problems.

CONNECT THESE TWO DOTS.

But no medical researcher dares.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Yes, the idea that they are ALL entirely safe and effective is INCREDIBLE.
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Only thing INCREDIBLE around here is your attempt to trash vaccination. I think you should be ashamed.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Yes, the idea that they are ALL entirely safe and effective is INCREDIBLE.
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None of them are entirely safe. For example, the combo vaccination most commonly prescribed will give one person in a million an allergic reaction.

Still no reason to buy a tinfoil hat. Maybe advocate for better screening, and mandatory vaccination for the other 999,999 out of a million folks who can get it without a risk, so if your kid is the one in a million that can't take the vaccine, they will still be protected by herd immunization.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Wakefield discovered the connection between GI problems and autism. Now that is generally accepted, as research on gut bacteria has advanced.

Some research has found connections between vaccines and GI problems.

CONNECT THESE TWO DOTS.

But no medical researcher dares.
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Wakefield is a quack.

Also:

GI Problems and Autism: No Link Found

Yeah, I think I'll take the Mayo Clinic over Wakefield 8 days a week.
 
OlNate said:
Wakefield is a quack.

Also:

GI Problems and Autism: No Link Found

Yeah, I think I'll take the Mayo Clinic over Wakefield 8 days a week.
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That was just one study. And they DID find more GI problems in autistic children. In medical science, a single study is never conclusive, especially when others have found different results.
 
How inflammation and gut bacteria influence autism

"Although ASD primarily impacts the brain, over recent years, links with other systems have become clear — in particular, gastrointestinal (GI) issues seem to occur more often in individuals with ASD than in the rest of the population."
 
The Gut Microbiota and Autism Spectrum Disorders

"Gastrointestinal (GI) symptoms are a common comorbidity in patients with autism spectrum disorder (ASD), but the underlying mechanisms are unknown. Many studies have shown alterations in the composition of the fecal flora and metabolic products of the gut microbiome in patients with ASD. The gut microbiota influences brain development and behaviors through the neuroendocrine, neuroimmune and autonomic nervous systems."
 
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